Scrod - the New England answer

Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports
1

Regarding the definition of scrod: http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mscrod.html

Here in Boston, scrod refers to the whitefish catch o’ the day.

It could be haddock, cod, pollock, hake, flounder or other varieties of whitefish.

It was whatever had the lowest market price that day.

If they specify haddock or cod on the menu, it is because the dish will contain haddock or cod and they won’t substitute. If it says “scrod” it means they intend to use the lowest-priced whitefish. That may mean cod or haddock, but not necessarily.

I doubt you’ll find anything labelled “scrod” at a reputable Boston fish market.

2

Just a bit of trivia… “Scrod” is also the name given to the creature in the trash-masher in the original Star Wars.

I suppose I should be embarrased for knowing that…

“It turns out it isn’t so much a law of physics as it is a local ordinance.”

3

Cecil states that only a sophisticated palate would detect the difference between f.e haddock and cod. Being an Icelander and an avid fisheater all my life I must disagree. The difference between cod (gadhus morhua)and haddock (melanogrammus aeglefinus)is easy to spot both in texture and flavour blindfolded.
Know your fish my man.

4

polli

The column mentions the sophisticated palate in discussing the difference between young cod and old cod, not between cod and haddock. Plus, it wasn’t Cecil. It’s easy to tell the difference. :slight_smile:

rocks

5

And welcome to The Straight Dope.

6

So what’s “whitefish”?

7

LOL! In college I once asked a dining-hall server what the fish of the day was.
She replied “Scrod.”
Me: “What kind of scrod is it?”
She: “Whitefish.”
Me: “What kind of whitefish is it?”
She: “Scrod.”

I think it’s funny now, but as a smart-ass know-it-all college student I was irritated with her apparent ignorance.

8

Well, SDStaff Doug says: << I am quite certain that scrod ORIGINALLY was coined as a term for young
cod, and can recall this term in use over 20 years ago on commercial
packages of frozen fish. It’s common practice for the juvenile stages of
fish to have special names applied to them, like “parr” for young salmon.
If folks have adopted the term to mean something else, then that is a
recent - and perhaps local - re-definition. >>
I also have heard those stories about Boston. However, Motorg, no offense but your word ain’t sufficient proof. Where did you hear it and how do you know it? There’s the dictionary on the one side… against… ?

9

Proof? You’d like actual proof? :wink:
That is a librarian’s call to arms!

I put it forward quite honestly and consistently as a local definition.
It is used very consistently in the
Boston area to mean the lowest priced
whitefish of the day, be it cod, haddock, flounder, hake, etc.

As far as the local Boston definition making it into a dictionary - it would be necessary for our local usage to make it into usage by a wider audience and for dictionary researchers to pick up on it. Once one of them picks up a change in usage, it often makes it into the others in fairly short order, because one of the methods the dictionary teams use, from what I’ve read, is reading other dictionaries. I haven’t had a chance to exhaustively check all dictionaries, so I don’t know if one of them has the Boston definition in it yet.

[preachy section] In the meantime, can we try to avoid calling it “THE Dictionary?” There are many different dictionaries, and no two are idebntical and none alone should be considered the last word on the English language. The Straight Dope team used Websters, which is what most of the online dictionaries are - one of the reasons I haven’t had a chance to check any source other than the one already checked by the Straight Dope team.

Being a Bostonian, I certainly hope to find the Boston usage anointed by one of the other dictionaries, but I’ll let you know the results of my quest either way.

As far as my post in reply to Irishman, I probably should have put in a winky or two. I meant it as a self-deprecating glimpse into my former 18-year-old self, and I don’t know if it came across that way.

10

And I know the rest of the country rejected “wicked” (as in “wicked cool”) after giving it only a very short day in the sun.
sigh

I begin to despair of successfully disseminating our scrod definition…

11

Well, one thing that should be pointed out is that “Websters” isn’t a single dictionary. Several different companies put out dictionaries that contain the name “Webster” in the title. Merriam-Webster, Inc. is one of them, and I think that the definition given in the Mailbag article was from them, as the definition given at WWWebster Dictionary is identical in wording with the one the article gives.

However, I have before me my trusty New Lexicon Webster’s Dictionary of the English Language (Lexicon Publications, Inc. 1989) (which if I understand the copyright information correctly is actually taken from the Larousse Illustrated International Encyclopedia and Dictionary of 1972). IT defines scrod as follows:

This is the first definition I have located that actually attempts an etiology for the word, and one that appears to have some merit. The trouble is, it doesn’t appear to have much bearing on usage in the New England area, where, I am advised by my uncle who lived there, scrod is not just strips of cooked fish. I can assure you that scrod isn’t used by much of anyone outside of the NE Atlantic coastline area (since we ALL know in the rest of the country that there is rarely a need for the pluperfect subjunctive :wink: )

One thing to consider: the word may have evolved its usage over time. In other words, it might once have meant cod cut into strips, used by Dutch settlers in the area; then been mutated into small fish of the cod variety, followed by application to haddock (who the hell would know the difference, restaurants might think; you should see what gets passed off in California as red snapper), followed by application to almost any whitefish. And then, it might be that ignorant people use it for any whitefish, whereas those who know better understand that it has more specific application.

12

Well, as a fellow Bostonian, FWIW I can testify that Motorgirl’s usage is indeed common around here.

Gorton’s of Gloucester has, in the Glossary page:

“aka: Schrod (Note: Scrod is not a type of fish but a market name used interchangeably for young cod, haddock, and sometimes cusk and pollock.) … Description (in market): Fillets labelled “scrod” could be any number of white-fleshed, delicately flavored fish; the broadly applied term usually indicates a young fish weighing under 2 1/2 lbs.”

At Search 4 Fish, Captain Jack (whoever he is) says:

“The term Scrod or Schrod was a term which was used to size different members of the Gadidae family. The fishes in this family are Haddock, Cod Fish, Cusk & Borbo.”

The Alaska Fisheries Board says:

“Scrod (Schrod) – A size designation (whole fish under 3 pounds) for some North Atlantic groundfish species, primarily cod and haddock, but sometimes pollock.”

Fish FAQ 2 says:

“The name comes from a Middle Dutch word “schrode” meaning a strip or shred. In New England scrod may be immature cod or haddock weighing 11/2 to 21/2 pounds. Sometimes the term is applied to cusk of about the same weight, or to pollock weighing 11/2 to 4 pounds. When fishermen use the word, they are usually referring to gutted small haddock.”

So I think there’s strong evidence taht “scrod” is a much broader term, at least in everyday usage, than is said in the Mailbag article.

jrf

13

JonF said:

That’s the definition of scrod I’ve always heard here in NYC, too.

(Please note: I am not scrod.)

14

Then you’ll understand that I have to beat you senseless for failing to answer the question. :wink:

Okay, my Merriam-Webster has for scrod: “a young fish (as a cod or haddock); esp: one split and boned for cooking.”

whitefish: any of various freshwater food fishes related to the salmons and trouts.

Since JonF was kind enough to answer the question, I’ll let you off the hook, Motorgirl.

(You’re a librarian? Neat. So’s my sister.)

15

In the rush to tell an amusing anecdote I forgot!

I’m glad JonF found some sources that back up the definition of scrod I put forth, because I had little luck with ordinary dictionaries. They all follow the Merriam-Webster model, though a few did not mention haddock, only cod.

I’m not currently practising as a librarian. I’m working at a computer company, so I don’t have a reference collection at my disposal on a daily basis. JonF was smart to try sources from the fishing industry. Methinks there’s a bit of the librarian in him…

16

There’s a tale (from Playboy’s joke page) about a chap who, visiting Boston for the first time, asks a cabbie where he can get scrod. The cabbie says he’s been asked that question a thousand times, but never in the future pluperfect tense.

AskNott

"Measure twice, cut once. Dang! Measure again, cut again.

17

Ummmm… AskNott, you might want to READ the Mailbag item before you post a quote from it?

And, the results of my weekend in Boston and informal survey of fish restaurants, to be published here shortly.

18

I’ve always heard a variant of that joke…something about the two wealthy old maids from Beacon Hill who went down to the docks once a month to get scrod.

Barron’s Food Lover’s Companion, an excellent food reference work, lists scrod as “young cod and haddock weighing under 2 1/2 pounds.”

Uke

19

Woops. Sorry, Dex.

AskNott

20

OK, so here’s my survey. I was in Boston, I had a little free time, so I picked up the Restaurant Guide in the hotel and started to call seafood restaurants. (Granted, that’s not a random group of restaurants.) I asked to speak to the chef or the manager, and I posed the question “What is scrod?”

The first two restaurants I called agreed mostly with Doug’s answer: scrod is young cod or small cod under about 2 or 2.5 lbs. One chef said that there used to be a term schod to refer to young haddock, but that’s fallen out of use, and some restaurants use scrod to refer to young/small haddock.

So far, so good. Then we went to eat at Legal Seafood, so I asked the same question. Their answer (on a little handout sheet called “Fish Facts”) was: “Scrod is the generic term for any mild white fish at or near market size of 2-2.5 lbs. We use COD as our “scrod” because of its local tradition, quality, and ability to be prepared a number of ways. It is by far the most popular fish species.”

OK, that would seem to support Motorgirl’s notion that scrod (at least in Boston) can be any white fish.

However, later, in the airport, I saw a copy of the cookbook put out by Legal Seafood – and that cookbook disagrees with their “Fish Fact” sheet. Their cookbook says that scrod is cod, period.

Now, I grant you, three restaurants does not constitute a valid survey. This is anecdotal rather than factual. But the impression I have is that restaurants serve small-sized (young) cod (or haddock) as “scrod” … but they THINK that other restaurants will serve anything.

My son thinks (in hindsight) that I asked the wrong question. I should have asked, “What is scrod? what do YOU serve as scrod? What do you think other restaurants serve as scrod?” But, this insight came too late.

If someone in Boston would like to do a more thorough survey, they are welcome to it. Again, merely saying that “everyone knows” doesn’t do it. “Everyone knows” that the Great Wall of China is the only man-made object to be seen from the moon, don’t make it so. If you can verify that every restaurant chef knows… OK, then we can talk.