Sex before marriage? (Christian viewpoints)

Great Debates
1

The ‘sex within marriage’ thread that Satan started made me wonder about what the different sorts of Christians posting here think is acceptable sexual conduct between unmarried people at various levels of commitment.

For instance, do you believe that sexual intercourse between unmarried people is wrong? How about oral sex, handjobs, and other forms of mutual/reciprocal gratification? Is the level of longevity and/or commitment in the relationship a factor? I’d be interested in seeing the range of views expressed.

BTW, I’m thinking in terms of unmarried adults, to distinguish this from any debate about the ethics of teen sex; that’s a whole 'nother debate.

2

A friend of mine – very Christian – said that he told his now-wife on their first date: “I don’t believe in sex before marriage. Of course, I’ve been married once, so…” :slight_smile:

3

I didn’t get married until I was 37, so I had plenty of time to reach some personal conclusions on the subject. During college, I was in a relationship that went ‘all the way’, as people still put it back then, and after a few weeks of that, I concluded that God was telling me I’d gone over the line. I’ve continued to believe, since then, that for Christians, sexual intercourse outside of marriage is wrong.

However, the relationships I was involved in before I was married included their fair share of sexual satisfaction by other means, including frequent oral sex. If God was trying to tell me that any of that was wrong, he wasn’t talking very loudly, and my experience has been that he can make His voice heard if he wants to, even when I’d rather not hear. My personal conclusion is that God doesn’t have a problem with oral sex, or any of the other stuff I alluded to in my OP, as part of intimacy between unmarried people.

I don’t have anything to say about anal sex; it never interested me or any of my girlfriends, so I didn’t go there. (Or come there, for that matter. ;))

4

So you’re saying God supports Bill Clinton’s contention that oral sex is not “sexual relations”? :wink:

5

David - you’ve got me ROFL with that one! :cool:

6

‘That one’ being your FIRST post, doggone it - I can’t keep up with you this morning! :wink:

Oral sex is certainly sexual :p, but what ‘sexual relations’ means is one I’d prefer leaving to the publishers of dictionaries. But is it an intimacy less serious, from a Christian point of view, than genital intercourse? My personal belief is that it is.

7

Knew I’d find the appropriate place for the smiley with the tongue!

8

Ok… this happens to be a case where the slippery slope probably does apply… (not KY :stuck_out_tongue: )

Speaking as a fun-loving fundie…

Intercourse is a definite answer in my mind… don’t do it before marriage. (Even though I did… do as I say… not as I do).
I wish I had waited even though I ended up marrying the one that I didn’t wait with… and no… it wasn’t a shot-gun wedding and I wasn’t pregnant. We married for the old-fashioned reason. Love.

As for the other things… oral sex… heavy petting… whatever… it’s too hard to stop once you get started IMHO… it’s a seriously slippery slope. I wouldn’t go so far as to say no kissing or hand-holding, but I have heard other fundies who ascribe to this.

So… that’s my opinion on the subject.

Beth

9

I would just like to point out that this is not a “don’t do it” not due to the eleventh commandment “Thou shalt not have fun or enjoyment of life” but for very practical reasons.
My wife and I engaged in premarital sex when we were first dating. She got pregnant and we decided to get married. That was five years ago, and I do not regret it…exactly.
We are in a lot of debut and finacially we are not secure becasue we were not prepared for this. Neither of us had medical insurance (medicare covered the birth) I have worked a lot of overtime and multiple jobs to make ends meet. If our grocerys were not paid for by a third party we would not have food even now.
This of course is not the only reason, but it is the reason I deal with day by day. All because we did not wait.

Heaven…One to beam up!

10

Beth, would you say, then, that they’re not wrong in and of themselves, but only in that they might lead to premarital sex?

Ann Landers got into a tussle on this one a year or so ago, saying that it was difficult to imagine that people could sleep together without engaging in sexual intercourse. She got flooded with letters to the contrary.

In the 17 years between my college girlfriend (see my second post, above) and my wedding day, I was intimately involved with a number of women, including several who made it known in no uncertain terms that they would prefer fucking, as opposed to orgasm through oral and manual stimulation. For me, it just wasn’t negotiable: I’d been down that road once, and didn’t want to go there again. Going against what I perceived (and still do) as God’s will in that manner was like the sun being blocked and having all the colors go out of the world. What pleasure could balance that out? During those 17 years, I was tempted by sexual intercourse about as much as I was tempted to put my thumb in a light socket.

11

Just one guy’s opinion, but the decision to have or not have any sexual relationship is not a matter of religious conviction, but basic human maturity. The reason it is wrong for some people to have sex before marriage is that they may be lacking the maturity to handle this kind of relationship. On the other hand, I’m a Christian who engaged in sex prior to marriage. I and my partners were mature enough and responsible enough that there were no negative reprecussions. What’s wrong for some can be right for others.

Other than a few exclamations of pleasure, I don’t remember God playing a big role in the events…

12

I’ve thought about this one as well, as I am agnostic in my outlook, but with a relaxed catholic upbringing I’ve come to the conclusion that casual sex is wrong. This is not to say that I believe that sex outside of marrage is wrong, but rather that sex is something to be shared between two people that want to reach a much more closer intimate knowledge of each other. So, to me one night stands, or just doing it cause it is fun with someone barely known, is not right. It should be with someone you know well, and truly wish to know better, and I don’t mean know better physically only. :slight_smile:

>>Being Chaotic Evil means never having to say your sorry…unless the other guy is bigger than you.<<

—The dragon observes

13

Oh, and I dont mean that my view is the agnostic view, obviously I can’t. What I meant was that I’ve come to the conclusions that I posted in part from my background and from my worldview. Your Milage May, And Probably Will, Vary Wildly. :stuck_out_tongue:

>>Being Chaotic Evil means never having to say your sorry…unless the other guy is bigger than you.<<

—The dragon observes

14

Personal Anecdote to follow:

No, I haven’t gotten any yet.

But my best friend is a guy who can (and does) get just about any girl he wants. He’s not Christian, but he doesn’t believe in premarital sex- or at least, he thinks he’s not ready for sex yet.

Now, I saw him, DRUNK, making out with a girl and when she wanted sex, he told her no, because he didn’t think it was right.

If a drunken, horny, nonreligious teenager can say no, I hope that adults can resiste the “slippery slope.”

Then again, I’m sixteen and never had a girlfriend. I probably don’t belong in this debate.

–John

15

Absolutely you belong in the discussion, John. RTF didn’t ask for opinions from sexually active people specifically. ('Course he did specify Christians in the OP, but hell, if David can post, so can I.)

But some ramblings during my lunch break:

I grew up in a christian family, and attended church, well, religiously. I was thoroughly steeped in the “no premarital sex” party line. And like many others with my background, I did it anyway.

I got lucky (in more ways than one), in that my g/f required us to use several concurrent systems of protection/birth control. Smart kid.

I don’t see sex as inherently “bad” at any time. But our society (as with most in the world) has placed a huge stigma on sex, and therefore it carries a load of baggage that isn’t IMO necessary.

I believe sex can be recreational. It’s fun. It doesn’t require an emotional commitment, but thanks to our hangups we usually assume it does. Problems with premarital/nonmarital sex come from:

People (often kids) who choose not to control their urges and scrog like bunnies w/o protection. Stupid, but understandable. (Which is why I’m generally in favor of honest sexual education and opposed in general to anyone having sex before they are emotionally mature.)

And situations in which one partner places a different meaning or emotional attachment on the act than the other. If I feel sex requires a commitment to marriage or monogamy, and my partner is just looking for a fun time and an orgasm or two, we’re going to have problems.

And the only other problem I can come up with at the moment is in association. Because we often place great emotional importance to sex, often trysts can be soundly thumped into our memories. Then when intimate with another partner, we have a tendency to remember those past occasions. This is not always bad, but it’s a problem when you’re in bed with a person you love and keep remembering the psycho hosebeast you dated in high school.
I reckon all of the above boil down to maturity, maturity, and maturity. It is possible to talk about sex (I know, it’s a shock to some), and how you and your partner view it. It is possible to approach sex without emotional commitment (although it’s not nearly as much fun). And as near as I can tell, it’s only “wrong” because of the possible pitfalls for the uneducated, the unwary, and the immature.

Yipe. That was pretty incoherent. Y’all feel free to ignore the above completely.

-andros-

16

Absolutely you belong in the discussion, John. RTF didn’t ask for opinions from sexually active people specifically. ('Course he did specify Christians in the OP, but hell, if David can post, so can I.)

But some ramblings during my lunch break:

I grew up in a christian family, and attended church, well, religiously. I was thoroughly steeped in the “no premarital sex” party line. And like many others with my background, I did it anyway.

I got lucky (in more ways than one), in that my g/f required us to use several concurrent systems of protection/birth control. Smart kid.

I don’t see sex as inherently “bad” at any time. But our society (as with most in the world) has placed a huge stigma on sex, and therefore it carries a load of baggage that isn’t IMO necessary.

I believe sex can be recreational. It’s fun. It doesn’t require an emotional commitment, but thanks to our hangups we usually assume it does. Problems with premarital/nonmarital sex come from:

People (often kids) who choose not to control their urges and scrog like bunnies w/o protection. Stupid, but understandable. (Which is why I’m generally in favor of honest sexual education and opposed in general to anyone having sex before they are emotionally mature.)

And situations in which one partner places a different meaning or emotional attachment on the act than the other. If I feel sex requires a commitment to marriage or monogamy, and my partner is just looking for a fun time and an orgasm or two, we’re going to have problems.

And the only other problem I can come up with at the moment is in association. Because we often place great emotional importance to sex, often trysts can be soundly thumped into our memories. Then when intimate with another partner, we have a tendency to remember those past occasions. This is not always bad, but it’s a problem when you’re in bed with a person you love and keep remembering the psycho hosebeast you dated in high school.
I reckon all of the above boil down to maturity, maturity, and maturity. It is possible to talk about sex (I know, it’s a shock to some), and how you and your partner view it. It is possible to approach sex without emotional commitment (although it’s not nearly as much fun). And as near as I can tell, it’s only “wrong” because of the possible pitfalls for the uneducated, the unwary, and the immature.

Yipe. That was pretty incoherent. Y’all feel free to ignore the above completely.

-andros-

17

Absolutely you belong in the discussion, John. RTF didn’t ask for opinions from sexually active people specifically. ('Course he did specify Christians in the OP, but hell, if David can post, so can I.)

But some ramblings during my lunch break:

I grew up in a christian family, and attended church, well, religiously. I was thoroughly steeped in the “no premarital sex” party line. And like many others with my background, I did it anyway.

I got lucky (in more ways than one), in that my g/f required us to use several concurrent systems of protection/birth control. Smart kid.

I don’t see sex as inherently “bad” at any time. But our society (as with most in the world) has placed a huge stigma on sex, and therefore it carries a load of baggage that isn’t IMO necessary.

I believe sex can be recreational. It’s fun. It doesn’t require an emotional commitment, but thanks to our hangups we usually assume it does. Problems with premarital/nonmarital sex come from:

People (often kids) who choose not to control their urges and scrog like bunnies w/o protection. Stupid, but understandable. (Which is why I’m generally in favor of honest sexual education and opposed in general to anyone having sex before they are emotionally mature.)

And situations in which one partner places a different meaning or emotional attachment on the act than the other. If I feel sex requires a commitment to marriage or monogamy, and my partner is just looking for a fun time and an orgasm or two, we’re going to have problems.

And the only other problem I can come up with at the moment is in association. Because we often place great emotional importance to sex, often trysts can be soundly thumped into our memories. Then when intimate with another partner, we have a tendency to remember those past occasions. This is not always bad, but it’s a problem when you’re in bed with a person you love and keep remembering the psycho hosebeast you dated in high school.
I reckon all of the above boil down to maturity, maturity, and maturity. It is possible to talk about sex (I know, it’s a shock to some), and how you and your partner view it. It is possible to approach sex without emotional commitment (although it’s not nearly as much fun). And as near as I can tell, it’s only “wrong” because of the possible pitfalls for the uneducated, the unwary, and the immature.

Yipe. That was pretty incoherent. Y’all feel free to ignore the above completely.

-andros-

18

Absolutely you belong in the discussion, John. RTF didn’t ask for opinions from sexually active people specifically. ('Course he did specify Christians in the OP, but hell, if David can post, so can I.)

But some ramblings during my lunch break:

I grew up in a christian family, and attended church, well, religiously. I was thoroughly steeped in the “no premarital sex” party line. And like many others with my background, I did it anyway.

I got lucky (in more ways than one), in that my g/f required us to use several concurrent systems of protection/birth control. Smart kid.

I don’t see sex as inherently “bad” at any time. But our society (as with most in the world) has placed a huge stigma on sex, and therefore it carries a load of baggage that isn’t IMO necessary.

I believe sex can be recreational. It’s fun. It doesn’t require an emotional commitment, but thanks to our hangups we usually assume it does. Problems with premarital/nonmarital sex come from:

People (often kids) who choose not to control their urges and scrog like bunnies w/o protection. Stupid, but understandable. (Which is why I’m generally in favor of honest sexual education and opposed in general to anyone having sex before they are emotionally mature.)

And situations in which one partner places a different meaning or emotional attachment on the act than the other. If I feel sex requires a commitment to marriage or monogamy, and my partner is just looking for a fun time and an orgasm or two, we’re going to have problems.

And the only other problem I can come up with at the moment is in association. Because we often place great emotional importance to sex, often trysts can be soundly thumped into our memories. Then when intimate with another partner, we have a tendency to remember those past occasions. This is not always bad, but it’s a problem when you’re in bed with a person you love and keep remembering the psycho hosebeast you dated in high school.
I reckon all of the above boil down to maturity, maturity, and maturity. It is possible to talk about sex (I know, it’s a shock to some), and how you and your partner view it. It is possible to approach sex without emotional commitment (although it’s not nearly as much fun). And as near as I can tell, it’s only “wrong” because of the possible pitfalls for the uneducated, the unwary, and the immature.

Yipe. That was pretty incoherent. Y’all feel free to ignore the above completely.

-andros-

19

Absolutely you belong in the discussion, John. RTF didn’t ask for opinions from sexually active people specifically. ('Course he did specify Christians in the OP, but hell, if David can post, so can I.)

But some ramblings during my lunch break:

I grew up in a christian family, and attended church, well, religiously. I was thoroughly steeped in the “no premarital sex” party line. And like many others with my background, I did it anyway.

I got lucky (in more ways than one), in that my g/f required us to use several concurrent systems of protection/birth control. Smart kid.

I don’t see sex as inherently “bad” at any time. But our society (as with most in the world) has placed a huge stigma on sex, and therefore it carries a load of baggage that isn’t IMO necessary.

I believe sex can be recreational. It’s fun. It doesn’t require an emotional commitment, but thanks to our hangups we usually assume it does. Problems with premarital/nonmarital sex come from:

People (often kids) who choose not to control their urges and scrog like bunnies w/o protection. Stupid, but understandable. (Which is why I’m generally in favor of honest sexual education and opposed in general to anyone having sex before they are emotionally mature.)

And situations in which one partner places a different meaning or emotional attachment on the act than the other. If I feel sex requires a commitment to marriage or monogamy, and my partner is just looking for a fun time and an orgasm or two, we’re going to have problems.

And the only other problem I can come up with at the moment is in association. Because we often place great emotional importance to sex, often trysts can be soundly thumped into our memories. Then when intimate with another partner, we have a tendency to remember those past occasions. This is not always bad, but it’s a problem when you’re in bed with a person you love and keep remembering the psycho hosebeast you dated in high school.
I reckon all of the above boil down to maturity, maturity, and maturity. It is possible to talk about sex (I know, it’s a shock to some), and how you and your partner view it. It is possible to approach sex without emotional commitment (although it’s not nearly as much fun). And as near as I can tell, it’s only “wrong” because of the possible pitfalls for the uneducated, the unwary, and the immature.

Yipe. That was pretty incoherent. Y’all feel free to ignore the above completely.

-andros-

20

You are making your post increasingly difficult to ignore, andros. :wink: (You can delete this post when you clean up andros’ mess, David)