No, the rule is you always bring a gun to a knife fight, unless you want to be the one getting killed.
Keep in mind, this guy didn’t have two concealed weapons for personal protection. He had two concealed weapons for the express purpose of attacking anyone that tried to stop him from shoplifting. At least in Wisconsin when you pull a gun (or a knife) on someone you lose your right to not get shot and killed.
Cool story bro…
But what’s with signing the thread with your username?
It was a joke, based on how annoyed I am (and others here are) by people doing stupid things in parking lots and getting away with it. I have not much sympathy for the guy who got himself killed doing dangerous, illegal things. He’s no innocent victim.
Didn’t you mean to end that with “Regards, Shodan”?
Maybe he thinks we’re so stupid that we can’t figure out that the person writing the post is the person whose username is at the top of it.
And wherever you put the head on the pike, you’re going to want a clean up underneath it.
The hunt is on.
My point is that shoplifting is not something you should be killed over.
The “facts” that he first pulled a gun on the security guys, them came at them with a knife are only what the security guys are saying. These actions occurred behind closed doors with only security and the assailant present. If you believe their story is 100% accurate, then they followed procedures and had no other choice. I think the security guys would have to be pretty stupid if their story didn’t show that they were following procedures.
So, I question if the story we are given is 100% accurate. I question, even if it is true that the perpetrator carried a loaded handgun (it has been reported that he could not possibly have had a CCL due to legal reasons) and a knife, why the situation could not have been handled without killing him. Finally, knowing that it is highly likely the given story is not 100% accurate, I question what really did happen.
I’ve lived in Texas for the past 30 years. I am not totally opposed the the Death Penalty (although I do feel it is overused), and generally in favor of the concealed-carry laws. I also feel, however, that if a store catches a shoplifter, the result shouldn’t be “take him out back and shoot 'em”.
excavating (for a mind)
He wasn’t killed for shoplifting. He was killed because he tried to harm or kill other people. And that IS something that you should be killed for.
Shoplifting should only get you an arrow in the knee.
I can’t imagine why a shoplifter would turn violent. It’s a fairly minor charge. Escalating it to this level is just… ridiculous.
It reminds me of cops getting shot at traffic stops. You’re 8 mph over the limit, get pulled over, and point a gun at a cop. All over a ticket that would cost you less than $100.
There’s some crazy, scary nuts out there.
maybe a little hyperbole, but if gunning down a few shoplifters leads to me saving a few dollars at the checkout, well. . .
Something here sure needs excavating. And it is something produced in massive quanties on Texas ranches.
I’m gonna need to know the race/ethnicity of each person involved here before I can form a judgement as to the likely course of events.
What a surprise.
When you find your mind, let us know, OK?
Continuing our little aside: Since you stated this so definitively, I’ll respectfully disagree. This is pretty much going to be store dependent (and likely vary from state to state based on statutes).
Most stores, including Wal-Mart, have things to buy/do past the registers. If loss prevention approached me past the registers, I’m just going to say I’m getting a Firelog or a case of water or running to the eye store or going to the little bank kiosk or ATM to grab cash so I can pay… You get the idea. Whatever they have in front of the registers. And who knows… maybe I am really going to get money so I can pay.
On the other hand, letting me walk out the door without paying pretty much eliminates any other explanation than shoplifting.
Now sure, if I walk into the vestibule, that might give them reasonable suspicion to detain me, but I doubt it’s going to give them enough probable cause to arrest. And, as loss prevention, I’d definitely want to know any applicable state statutes in and out before I started detaining people who have not yet left the store without paying.
We’ve had several shop lifting threads on the sdmb. Some states have a special shop lifting law that says if you conceal an item while inside the store then they can detain you immediately. For example, placing an item in your pocket or under your shirt is “intent” to steal. Whether the store chooses to wait until you try to leave is up to them.
The OP’s story said he had a cart full of merchandise. In that case it seems like they would need proof he was leaving actually the store before detaining him.
I used to drink a coke while shopping at the grocery and get the cashier to scan the empty bottle. I stopped when I heard how crazy some of these anti-theft rent a cops are. I don’t want to get roughed up over a $1.25 coke.
Dude, it’s Walmart. It serves as its own lesson to others.
Nowadays, the Chicago way would be “arrest him for carrying an illegal knife.”
Like all shootings like this, it deserves investigation, but as presented it seems the security did nothing wrong.
I agree that shoplifting is something you shouldn’t be killed over. Which is why Bradshaw shouldn’t have pulled out a gun and a knife to resist what would have been a minor shoplifting arrest.
Do you have any evidence of this or is this all in your imagination? If it makes you feel better, pretend the whole story is made up and Bradshaw is alive and resting at his home right now.
I think that’s the WalMart motto: “Shoplift here and you’ll end up as dead as Woolworths.”