You say you are not married, sixseatport? Boy, there’s a shocker.
May I introduce you to the modern invention of a partnership in a marrige? As I said, I took my husbands name, but that does not mean he is the “head of the household”, nor does he hold the “authority”. We are both the head of the household and we make desicions together. As it happens, he is supporting me now, because I am in school, but when I graduate, I fully intend to be the main breadwinner, and allow him to do whatever he wants, as he has allowed me to do all these years. If he decides to watch Gilligans Island and play golf all day long, it will be my privledge and pleasure to allow him so to do. And I assure you, as a member of the armed forces, he is far from spineless.
If you equate having your wife changing her name to you holding the authority in the household, perhaps it wouldn’t be a bad idea if your wife did keep her name.
Damn, Lucretia, why didn’t we both meet before we got married? I helped put my wife through school and am still teh main breadwinner. I could’ve bee watching Gilligan and the gang had I met you first.
Just my luck.
Only if you had been one of our boys in blue, Mr. Zambezi. What a man in uniform can’t talk me into…
Sixseatport, which decade were you born in? Life ain’t that way anymore. If you get a wife who is willing to play that game, she’ll probably end up being some worthless skank, user who is marrying you SOLELY for the support! Wake up dude! Partnership is where it’s at. My sister-in-law (the skank) is using her “old-fashioned” husband to death. He had the same attitude you have, and his world is exploding in his face. You reap what you sow.
Lucretia, I’m not married because I think I’m a little young, although I do know people younger than myself who are married. It is not because I couldn’t find someone willing to marry me. 
The thing about partnership is that the jobs don’t have to be split evenly – you don’t have to share everything 50/50. In fact, I think it’s a bad idea to do so. I think partnership in a marriage is great – but it should be a partnership in which one partner compliments the abilities of the other, not overlaps them. That means having areas in which one partner handles just about everything (‘just’ about – not absolutely. There does have to be some help).
We’re drifting off the subject a lot, ladies. I’m out of town for a couple of days, so fight amongst yourselves for a while.
I’ve been running through all the posts here and running through all my married friends. Most of the wives took their husbands’ names, but not completely. Among the iterations:
Each kept their own names (married, presumably happily, for 24 years.)The child uses the father’s name.
Wife uses her original name professionally, as a middle name in social situations and signs with both names (it seems to work, consistency is the key).
Hyphenated wife, original name husband, children take the husband’s name (Mrs. Kunilou tried this for awhile, but the hyphenated name wound up being six syllables, 16 letters plus a hyphen, running off the edges of computer forms, one or both names being unpronounceable and she gave up after about a year.)
Husband and wife BOTH use both names, hyphenated, and use the hyphenated name for their children.
Of course, there’s also the question of what the woman does if the marriage breaks up. Most of the divoced women I know went back to the former name if they hadn’t been married too long. My sister continued to use her former husband’s name until she got married again, then used that husband’s name and continues to use it now that the second marriage is over. My first wife always adopted her husbands’ names, and then went back to her former name when she got divorced. She’s been divorced four times now and has enough driver’s licenses and social security cards to outfit a small city.
This is in reply to carlon’s post on 12/28, 2:14 am.
I have been given a response, from the soc.culture.korean newsgroup, to the question of why women in Korea do not take their husband’s name.
In contrast to what you said, that it is because they are not worthy, I have been given a response that it is a matter of heredity. The wife does not carry the man’s genes, so she does not carry the man’s name, but the children carry the genes (half), so they must take the name. I suppose this can work vice-versa. But in a male dominated society…
I suppose, in a sense, the term “worthy” can apply to the fact of whether or not one carries the genes associated with the name. But it’s relative. It’s all about how you want to interpret it. Regardless, the system makes sense in a logical (natural, genetic) way, whereas the Western system makes sense in a political way.
There’s always another beer.
Officially designated “do not prune” thread-bumping post.
Hey, hyphenating the kids isn’t so bad. I kept my name, Mr. Lestrange kept his. The lestrangelets are hyphenated. No problems so far.
As far as the “how will you explain it to the kids” thing, I don’t think that’s really a valid criticism. Kids (especially little ones) tend to just accept that their family is the way it is, and that’s that. Once they’re old enough to really question something like that, they’re old enough to consider the straight answer to their question. And I know from personal experience that it’s not fatal to have a family that’s “different” from the others around you.*
I have no difficulty with school understanding what my name is and what my daughter’s name is. They’ve never had any problem keeping it straight. My only problem with how it’s listed in computers or files comes when some software accepts hyphens and some doesn’t, and I can’t always remember which place is which. Computer can’t take a hyphen? Just leave it out (run the names together)–it’ll work fine. I make a point of mentioning this when we’re getting signed up somewhere new, so I can be sure that no matter where I go, I’m searching under the same letter of the alphabet.
Everyone understands that we’re a family. Anyone who doesn’t is someone so peripheral to my life that their opinion on the matter is of no importance to me. I grew up with a stepfather, and find different surnames in the same family to be quite normal and comfortable. Ditto with people thinking I’m not married–who cares? Why should my marital status matter to anyone? I don’t see anyone advocating husbands changing their names so people will know they’re married–why should women be any different? I would never dream of trying to use my husband’s credit cards, just as I would never try to write a check out of his personal checkbook. I use my own, or I use the checking account with both our names on it, or my personal account. If some legal question were to arise, I can go to the safe deposit box and get the papers. Otherwise, it’s a non-issue.**
My husband often gets mail addressed to his first name with my last name, or the hyphenated version, and doesn’t care in the least. I’ve been called by his last name, and the hyphenated one, by people who didn’t know better, and I didn’t care in the least. The kids have been called by any conceivable permutation of names. So what? Conversations with people who need to be informed go something like this:
Me: I keep my own name, and the kids are hyphenated.
**Other:**Oh, I’m sorry, I used the wrong last name!
Me: No big deal. You couldn’t know until I mentioned it.
And that’s the end of the matter.
As far as hyphenating kids posing problems with their marrying in the future–hell, let them sort it out. Mr. Lestrange and I came up with our own solution, one that has worked quite well for us. I expect that my kids will be intelligent and resourceful, and will figure it out for themselves. Although I must say, I liked that complicated matrilineal/patrilineal name sharing thing for hyphenated names–I’m half tempted to print it out and save it.
Now, if hyphenating doesn’t seem like it will work for you, then by all means, don’t. But a lot of the objections I see to having different names within the family, or having hyphenated names, etc. just don’t seem to be real problems, or at least they haven’t been in my experience.
*Freshman year of high school, I made some number of new friends. When they’d come over to dinner at my house, I would become completely mortified that my family’s wierdness was on display. I didn’t care about my parents being divorced and remarried, which was quite uncommon at the time. I didn’t worry about different names, or that my mom and step father (who really qualifies as my dad) lived together for years before they went to city hall and got a certificate. No, I lived in dread lest someone should say the word “fork” while I had friends over for dinner. That word invariably triggered an elaborate family in-joke that was noisy and undignified, and funny as hell if you were a family member, in on the joke, and not self concious. But at 13, I was sure it would drive all my new friends away.
It didn’t, and I learned a valuable lesson from that.
**For what it’s worth, I didn’t have any outside employment for three years, and still never found any need to use my husband’s credit cards. Anyone considering a single wage earner arrangement would be well advised to consider in advance how to portion out the money–make sure each person has an amount available for personal use, and make sure any joint funds are easily available to either partner and are used appropriately.
My 2cents:
-I hyphenate my name. The reason is that I couldn’t decide which name to use, so I legally changed my name to include both.
-At work, I generally go by my maiden name (it’s what they’re used to). In my personal life, people use my husband’s name (i.e. “Hi, I’m Jeannie [hubby’s last name]”). The only time I use both is generally on legal documents.
-My husband didn’t care one way or the other what I changed my name to. He considered hyphenating his, but found it too bulky.
-I didn’t want to use my maiden name as a middle name. I already have a middle name that I never use.
-When we have kids, they’ll have my husband’s last name. We may use my maiden name as a second middle name (i.e. Michael Patrick [my maiden name] [hubby’s last name]). If they want to use it as a middle initial or a second last name or whatever, they can. Otherwise, they can do what I do with my middle name-ignore it 
I like the idea of the blended names after marriage, too. Instead of using hyphenated names, I like the idea of using the first syllable of the man’s last name and adding it to the second syllable of the woman’s last name (use the whole name if only one syllable). eg. Joe Jabowich marries Fran White and they become Mr. and Mrs. Jabwhite. The kids are all Jabwhites as well. This indicates to people who know them that they are now married (both the man and the woman make a change, not just the woman), and the family unit has a unique name. This also allows for following patriachal lines through the males and matriarchal lines through the females, which is better than just following patriarchal lines through males.
(BTW, what’s up with the coding in this thread? Is it just my computer?)
Oh yeah, I forgot to mention; I’ve heard rumours that French-Canadian women in Quebec were not allowed to change their last names when they married for some time here in Canada. I don’t know any details of this, or even if it is factual, but it was told to me by someone who was born and raised in Quebec.
Wait–I’ve got it!
No, wait…
So, just changing both your last names to Winkelried is out. Nuts!
I think giving both your kinder both last names is the best bet if you’re really worried about the names dying out.
Thalia Scalia? Shelley Morelli? Jeannie Cassini?
OK, A: That sounds like President Reagan’s family, and 2: Changing your name doesn’t cost jack. They can call her whatever.
And here I thought “Julius” was Latin for “fuzzy”.
Okay, here’s my personal plan.
My last name is…mediocre. No problems with it, (I’m related to a half cute actor even!) but I’m not over fond of it.
I’m all for the “find your own last name” game. do some fun research and pick something cool.
But, the people who are involved get the choice.
I’m a Watts, and he’s a Rankin. Would you suggest we use Ratts or Wankin?? 
Before we got married my husband told me that it was very important that a man and wife share the same last name to show their new unity before god and society. I told him that I was glad he was going to take my last name then. He was surprised and pleased that I would share my name with him and did nto hesitate to take it.
The county clerk said that he could not change his last name. I spoke to some nice person at the ACLU and asked him what to do. He sid that if she wanted to fight it out the ACLU would help, but that this right had been settled in all 50 states and to tell her that. I told her of the conversation, she went in the office and spoke to a few people on the phone and then agreed that my husbane and i could change our last names as we pleased when we got married. My name has always been the same and He tooke his “maiden name” as his new middle name and has my last name.
I didn’t change my last name when Cal and I married because I had that name for a long time, it was mine, and no one was going to take it from me. Also I didn’t whan the hassel of having to chang everything to a new name. Cal liked his last name and I saw no reason why he should have to change it either. This did and still does not make some family members on both sides upset that I didn’t change my name, but that’s their problem, not mine. When we found out I was pregant that’s when the discussion came up abput what to name the offspring. We went through all the aguments that are posted here and decieded that the baby, be it boy or girl, would have Cal’s last name with my name as a middle name. I do get called by Cal’s last name a lot. I just accept it. The hospital has me listed under my name and A.K.A my name-Cal’s name. That’s fine too! And if our daughter ever is asked what her mother’s “maiden name” was, I’ll tell her to use her grammy’s former last name.
In Ontario, when Dave A marries Sam* B, the spouses have four choices for names specifically allowed by law: both take family name A, both take family name B, both use hyphenated family name A-B, and both use hyphenated family name B-A. I don’t think that there’s any impediment to other name choices, but I suspect that that may fall under regular name-change legislation, rather than arriving as part of the marriage.
According to the Ontario Government Name-Change Page:
And at other times, it costs $25 for marriage-related name-change, and $137 otherwise.
Interestingly, the site also states that “You must have a minimum of one forename (first name) and one surname (last name)” by which they mean, ‘personal name’ and ‘family name’, respectively. I wonder what happens if someone from another country, who has only one name, decides to move in? Do the police arrest him/her at the border?
I always kinda liked the system that works like this: Dave A marries Sam B. They both take a new middle name that reflects the marriage. Let’s say, ‘Dreamweaver’. This name becomes the family name of the kids. So then you have Dave Dreamweaver A, Sam Dreamweaver B, and their kids Tom and Alicia Dreamweaver.
Twenty-five years later, when Tom marries Julia Chan, they take a new marriage name, say Greenleaf. Thet you have Tom Greenleaf Dreamweaver, Julia Greenleaf Chan, and their kids Fred Greenleaf and Mei-Win Greenleaf.
Advantage: equality anong partners. Disadvantage: loss of name continuity on both sides of the ancestral tree (as opposed to the traditional English (or European or whatever) system, where we lose name continuity on the female side.
*Samantha, of course. What did you think?
Sunspace’s solution is my favorite so far. It addresses the idea of family identity and individual identity, and gives both partners equal billing and the kids something consistent. I think this method is sensible and progressive. However, I think many people would object to the loss of continuity, since names are still emotionally-loaded for many people. I know that, like Arnold stated, the idea of honoring ancestors is still a strong motivation in maintaining a certain family “identity” and I think many are not ready to let that go. The main “problem” (which, as others have already stated, is mainly a problem for bureaucrats) is that there is no longer a set method; this is what creates confusion, that nobody can just rest on their laurels and assume that they know someone’s familial status based on their name anymore. Our society is in a state of flux in many ways, and family structure and family names are no exception.
I think the only reasonable thing to do is work out something you’re both comfortable with, and let the kids figure out their own solution, just as you did. Name them as you wish, and when they form their own families, they can make those same decisions for themselves. It just means we all have to be a little more conscious of our assumptions and more open-minded and flexible. But I think society is of necessity evolving that way, anyway. You just might be ahead of the curve for now, but likely your children will no longer be unique by the time they’ve grown up.
I love my wife’s last name–it rolls off the tongue quite alliteratively with her first–and never insisted she change it (heck, she wouldn’t have even if I tried). I like my last name, but it’s bulky and awkward, and we think the hyphenating thing ultimately doesn’t really work. What if our hyphenated kids married another hyphenate? What happens when people inevitably start abbreviating the hyphenate, or if application forms don’t have enough spaces in the last name field? Seemed like way too much trouble. So we’ve kept things as is.
As for the kids, we’ve also agreed that if we have them, the boys would get my last name and the girls would get hers. Again, simple, fair, with a roll of the genetic dice making the call. But won’t that confuse the mixed gender siblings? cried my mother. Well, to be honest, if they grow up with Daddy and Mommy having different last names, and they can’t, at some point, figure out that the kid down the hall is a blood relation, well then I think we’ve got a lot more to worry about then…teasing? Mild perplexity?
The only hitch is that we have spare copies of our marriage license because situations where we would ordinarily be trusted if we shared the last name (picking up a package at the Post Office, signing off on forms, etc.) we have to show proof that, yes, she is my wife even though her name and mine are different.