The articles I have seen indicate that pricing is not yet determined, but that you could keep the newer battery and pay the difference. Apparently, the owner’s battery warranty will be intact either way (which is 8 years or 125000 miles for the basic 60kW-h battery, and 8 years unlimited miles for the 85kW-h battery).
The technology and infrastructure are simple not in place at this time to make the Tesla S more than a toy for the rich right now. It’s simple economics and the fact that the articles posted suggest the severe limitations on the Tesla’s range, particularly if you are going to treat it as a normal car where you would potentially enjoy normal creature comforts.
If memory serves, the article posted calls into question the Tesla engineers demanding that that the test vehicle driven by the journalist operate at a certain MPH, and with limited heating, etc…this is not the hallmark of an embraceable production car…again, unless you’re rich.
You know what’s a fucking cool electric car? This one: - YouTube
And it’s STILL not practical as a daily driver. Nor are most electric cars right now. The battery tech just isn’t quite there yet.
I own a Tesla Model S with the 85 kWh battery. I have only owned it for less than two months, so many of the issues raised I still wonder about myself.
That’s a bit optimistic. I find it takes longer than 45 minutes to charge a drained battery. On the other hand, I have drained my battery only once. For most trips the superstation will fully charge my battery in 45 minutes or less.
Plan to wait at the superstation for at least 45 minutes.
I can afford to buy a second car, but I have chosen not to.
I disagree. My Tesla works very well as a daily driving car. I will agree that it isn’t very practical for long trips.
The charging plug is not energized until it has been plugged into the car for a few seconds. Even at that point, it is well insulated and weatherproofed, so even in a heavy rain there is not going to be a conducting path from the terminals to your hand.
By your logic, there would be no market for a 2-seater sports car because most drivers, at some point throughout the life of the vehicle, would need to carry more than 1 passenger, or a large item that doesn’t fit in the tiny trunk.
In practice, many people get away with a 2-seater sports car because the other car in the household seats more (e.g. spouse drives a minivan). And some people just choose to live with that limitation, and borrow or rent a different vehicle if they absolutely need to transport things/people that don’t fit.
Every car has its limitations. For some people, the limitations of an electric car are incompatible with their lifestyle. For others, they aren’t.
The Tesla is a great car, but it has warts. I test drove one fairly recently. Here is my take on it:
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Handling: fantastic handling, but it is a very heavy car, and it feels like it. It weighs about the same as a full-size 4WD pickup truck. The center of gravity is very low (most of the weight is in the battery, which literally makes up the floor of the car), so it still handles very, very well - but it feels like driving a very agile tank.
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Power: more power than you could ever want. Unlike a conventional car, the power is available instantaneously at all times: there are no gears, no revving, no shifting, just full power from 0 RPM (though the traction control system prevents you from doing burnouts). 0-60 in 4 seconds for a heavy car like this is ridiculous. I didn’t even drive the model with the performance package, just the standard 85 (which does 0-60 in 5 seconds, I think). Additionally, the car doesn’t lose power at altitude, which is a major factor for naturally-aspirated conventional cars.
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Refinement: in normal driving it is smoother and quieter than a Rolls Royce, since there is no engine noise or vibration to speak of. This is one of the best characteristics of the car. Under very hard acceleration, you can hear an audible electronic whine/buzz from the motor and drive electronics, but otherwise it is eerily silent.
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Exterior styling: the car looks beautiful outside and the attention to detail and build quality is phenomenal. Opinions may vary but I think it looks great.
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Controls: there are no controls or displays in the interior other than the steering wheel, turn signal stalk, wiper stalk, column-mounted electronic shifter, the LCD screen for the gauges, and the giant 17" LCD screen for all the other controls. The screens are both bright, well-designed, and customizable, and after a day or so you really won’t miss having conventional buttons for the HVAC, radio, etc. In general, I think touchscreens are a shitty, lazy solution for a control interface though, and this one didn’t change my mind.
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Interior: the interior is a strange mix of nice materials and design decisions, and comparatively poor ones. The dashboard looks bland and pointless without any buttons on it. It almost looks like one of those ridiculous aftermarket “custom” jobs where someone installs a computer monitor in their dashboard to watch music videos or something.
The rear seats look cheap and uncomfortable, just big flat panels with some padding on them. I was surprised by the amount of cheap black plastic in various places. Weirdly, there is no center console between the seats. I felt like I was driving a U-Haul.
It is not a bad interior, but it was well out of place in a $90,000+ car.
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Range: Tesla claims a 300-mile highway range, 400-mile city range for the 85 kwH model. That’s well beyond what anyone drives on a daily basis. The Supercharger network covers or will cover most other eventualities. Gnashing of teeth aside, this is perfectly adequate for 95% of most people’s driving. If you like the Tesla, you can make it work 100% of the time with a little inconvenience. Most people buying a large luxury sedan will have another car available in their household to cover the remaining 5%.
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Servicing: the Tesla has almost nothing to service. No spark plugs, no drive belts, no engine oil, etc. I think you are expected to replace the coolant at 100,000 miles, and maybe some kind of lubricant in the differential, but that’s about it. So the questions about “Where will I service it?” are irrelevant.
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Overall, the biggest problem is price. The Tesla would be a fantastically cool car if it cost $50,000, although even then, it would be lacking in some ways compared to a $50,000 BMW 5-series. The problem is, it costs $90,000.
I am an electric engineer, and I like cool gadgets, and I like electric cars, so if I were in the market for a large luxury sedan, I could see myself buying one. The coolness is worth the price and inconvenience. But the general public? I don’t know, even at half the price.
Anyway, my advice is: if you like the Tesla, buy it. Ignore the naysayers, the car is well-engineered and works as advertised, as long as you are aware of the need to pay attention to range and recharging.
If you don’t like the Tesla, but still want an electric car, I absolutely love my Chevy Volt.
Regarding the battery longevity, the Volt has a clever solution to this problem.
Unlike a Li-ion battery in a computer or cell phone, which essentially operates from 0% to 100% charged, the Volt keeps the battery between 20% and 80% charged. So, when it says “fully charged”, this is actually only 80% charged, and when it says “0 miles electric range remaining”, it really still has 20% charge left.
Keeping the battery away from the absolute operating limits greatly increases its lifespan. Most of the damage to lithium-ion batteries occurs at those extremes.
Additionally, as the battery gets older and capacity does diminish, the state of charge window increases: so, after 6 years, it might be operating in the 10% - 90% range, with the same rated capacity as when it was new.
Obviously, GM only has this flexibility because the gas generator can always turn on and recharge the battery, so they do not have to absolutely maximize electric range at all costs. I presume Tesla will allow you to drain the battery all the way to 0% if you need it - but again, with a 300-mile range, on most days you will not even be approaching the 20% floor. I do know the computer in the Tesla encourages you to only charge the battery up to around 80% of the maximum for “daily use”, and only use the full charge capacity if you know you are going on a long trip.
Regarding battery temperature and longevity: the Volt (and the Tesla too) has a heating and cooling system for the battery that keeps it in the appropriate temperature range. In cold weather, the Volt’s range decreases because running the heater for the cabin and battery takes substantially more energy than even running the A/C in the summer. In very cold weather (~15 F), it actually turns on the gas generator (i.e. engine) and uses the engine coolant to warm the battery.
This is less of a problem for the Tesla because the Tesla has a substantially larger battery capacity, by a factor of 8 or so. Yes, the range will decrease, but the energy required to heat the car and battery is a much smaller fraction of the total battery capacity than it is for the Volt. You might lose 10 miles of range in the Volt in winter, which is a substantial fraction of the ~40 mile total range, but even losing 20 or 30 miles of range in the Tesla is less of a problem.
The battery pack in the Volt is very well-insulated, so in the winter, once it has reached operating temperature, normal resistance heating from use is usually enough to keep there. The Tesla battery is much bigger and thinner (i.e. has a much larger surface area and little room for insulation) and appears to be visible right underneath the car, so I doubt it does as well, but anecdotally the range loss in cold weather appears to be minimal.
Regarding longevity: the thing that kills battery packs is high temperatures at high states of charge. Both the Tesla and the Volt have cooling systems that will cool the battery packs in hot weather, even if the car is turned off. In the Volt, this stops once the battery gets down to 50% charge, e.g., if you park it an airport for a week. My understanding is that the rate of thermal damage is much lower at this level. Don’t know the Tesla works but I assume it uses similar logic.
What to avoid are cars that have no cooling system for the battery whatsoever, e.g., the Nissan Leaf. This is a lousy engineering decision unless you live in Malibu, where it is 50-80 all year round. There have already been reports of Leaf losing noticeable battery capacity in Arizona after just a few summer months.
Please do buy one. If my Tesla shares keep going the way they have been lately, someday I’ll be able to buy one too!