Should I have this surgery?

In My Humble Opinion
1

This goes to show you just how dangerous Dopefests can be. I popped my knee at the Bleeker St Bar during the NYC MegaDopeFest Friday night Bar, Beer and Bull Session. I popped it real good. I first tore up my knee 17 years ago and was warned that I would probably need surgery somewhere down the line. I gave up certain activities like handball and dancing with wild abandon (I still dance, but with extreme caution-- wild abandon is out) and lived with the instability and occasional minor sprains and would happily continue to do so, except:[ul][li]This was no minor sprain. It’s been almost two weeks and I am still very much hobbled and in pain. []I tore it up this time while turning around in my seat. Turning around in my seat is one activity I don’t think I could easily give up.[/ul][/li]
However, surgical repair to my ACL would mean:[ul][li]Surgery. I’ve had more than my share of surgeries and one thing I know about it. I DON’T LIKE IT. In fact, I hate surgery.[]I’ll have to spend weeks on a motion machine. Um, no thanks. I don’t think I want to be strapped to a perpetual motion machine. The doc says 6 months worth of rehab. I may not have a job after 6 months of rehab.[/ul][/li]
Yea, surgery will fix this! No, it’s not worth it-- deal with the knee. Flip-flop, flip-flop-- that’s me. What should I do? What would you do? Have any of you had this surgery done(I’m guessing yes, since it’s not all that uncommon)?

DISCLAIMER: No, I’m not basing any medical decision on what a bunch of strangers on a messageboard tell me. What I’m seeking is advice, experience, thoughts, comments and a large dose of sympathy.

2

My SO twisted his knee badly about 5 years ago. He injured the ACL and another ligament (MCL, PCL?? I can’t remember). At first he did PT for a few months, but the pain never went away. He couldn’t work during this time, so he got a second opinion. Surgery was recommended. So six months after the injury, he had surgery, and the pain went away.

So IMHO, if the pain is great, get the surgery done. The surgery was not easy for him, but in the long run, it was worth it. We got on of those ice coolers with built in circulation system so ice water was applied to his knee at all times, that was the biggest pain reliever after his surgery. He is pain free now, and the doctor said he can ski this year! (If we ever get any snow, that is).

3

I think you’ve set up an interesting thought equation for yourself. It will be painful and a hardship to go through, but you have to live with your knee the rest of your life.

You also stated that you may not have a job after 6 months in rehab, but once again, you have your knee for the rest of your life.

My humble comment is to get the knee taken care of soon, because I don’t think that something as vital to motion as a knee injury should be taken lightly. (my old man has had 3 knee surgeries and had to do outpatient rehabbing. It didn’t seem to affect his career too much, but then again, he’s a professor and as such is on his own agenda).

4

I believe the motion machine is strapped to your leg while you are in bed, flat on your back, to exercise your knee post surgery. I don’t remember any patients using it more than twice a day, for more than 2 hours at a time in the rehab hospital.

5

Thanks guys.

You know, when the doc told me about what may be involved with this surgery I thought he was joking about hooking me up to a motion machine. Two hours Cyn? Isn’t there something in the Geneva Convention about that?

I really don’t know what kind of therapy I may need since my knee is still inflamed and they can’t really tell what the hell I’ve done to it this time.

It’s all RTFirefly’s fault, you know. If he wasn’t such an interesting guy I wouldn’t have tried to turn around and talk to him.

6

Get the surgery. The more you reinjure your leg, the more likely you are to have arthritis later. Plus, you heal more slowly and the rehab will be worse.

I had “shin surgery” in November - I fell during a race in a dirty puddle and they had to operate to clean it out - and I have a scar from my knee to about mid shin. The weird thing is the lack of feeling on one side of the scar. You will have something similar, but a much better chance of getting your feeling back. However, the younger you are, the faster it will happen.

7

('Scuse me a minute while I pour lashings of sympathy over Biggirl, fetch her some hot tea, pat her consolingly, etc.)

Okay. Now. Sounds like you’re in a lot of miserable pain now, it’s been dicey for a long time and it can only get worse. It can’t get better on its own and it’ll be almost impossible to avoid future injuries.

I’m sorry to say this, because I’m right with ya on hating and dreading any medical procedure, but the most not having the surgery will do for you is prolong your suffering and postpone the inevitable. The surgery and therapy will be a major bummer. But realistically, you’ll be pain anyway. You may as well just grit your teeth, cuss a lot and just push through what ya gotta do to make your knee better in the long run.

Which of course is really easy for somebody to say whose knee it isn’t . Sigh. But FWIW I find persistent, recurring pain very debilitating. It drains so much energy outta life, just coping with it, I get impatient and say, “T’hell with it.” I’d opt for a bigger but temporary hurt to get rid of it for good. But that’s personal preference, and you have to do what’s right for you.

No matter what, so sorry you’re hurting and stuck in this mess, Biggirl. Here’s wishing comfort and best of luck to you.

Veb

8

I dislocated my knee when I was a teenager, sprained every tendon in it, and tore up some of the muscles.

Lots of crutches, braces, etc. In my case, I opted to see what rehab would do before considering surgery.

It took two and a half years but it healed. Is it perfect? No - I do have some arthritis and it does act up a couple times a year. But I skate, ski, ride horses, dance, and everything else I used to do.

Would this work for you? I don’t know - you have to get some trained medical opinions, and not on the internet, either - they have to be able to see YOU and YOUR condition.

But I emphasized the length of time because knees take a long time to heal Which you already know. But two weeks is very little time at all for a knee injury.

Consider carefully before you get surgery, don’t be too eager for it. But keep in mind sometimes it is the best option.

9

If you don’t have the surgery, you’re going to end up walking like my mother does. Think of Frankenstein’s monster on quaaludes…on stilts.

That alone should be reason enough to get it done. :slight_smile:

I hope you get to feeling better (surgery or not) Biggirl. I can sympathize because I’m falling apart without turning around in my seat and know how much fun it can be!

10

I was told I needed surgery on my foot when I was 16. I had no time for that crap. Then college days, no way I was going to laid up. Then the Marine Corps, Hell, I never even TOLD them I had that problem. Then on to work, too busy, too inconvenient, I always had plans so I couldn’t do it. I finally broke down and did it about five years ago. Thank Gawd it hurt like hell the day before I went under the knife. I was told of the discomfort of the healing process, and the pain, and all that. I was on crutches (NO load bearing on right foot) for three months. It never once hurt any more than it did the day before surgery. Lotsa words. What I meant to say was, “There will never be a convenient time to do it, so do it now.”

11

just wandering in to give Biggirl lots of sympathy. Bummer. Sounds awful and neither alternative sounds pleasant. :frowning:

There’s a new supplement which is recommended over here for joint problems and my mother is totally thrilled with her experience with it. Chrondoitin? Ack. Something like that anyway.

12

Ahh. The sympathy is better than any chemical. Feels good. Thanks.

13

First off, my deep sympathy to you over your knee problems! I always feel SO bad about anyone who injures a knee!

I had ACL surgery about 5 years ago.

I had originally injured my knee in 1993. I jumped off a wall and landed bad (I could feel the bones in my knee moving in ways that bones Are Not Supposed To Move.) I went to a doc-in-the-box and had it x-rayed, nothing broken. Walked with a cane for a few weeks, and took about a year before I could bend it completely (for example., while squatting), but it finally got so it felt pretty normal. (I theorized after the fact that I had maybe partially torn my ACL, or did some other cartilege damage at this time, but It Got Better By Itself.)

Then, at flyball practice with my dog one night, another dog got loose and ran in front of me. As I tripped over the dog, I felt the bones in my knee do the same thing they’d done when I’d jumped off the wall. I tried the same routine as before, but this time it didn’t get better. I’d sit in my chair at work and cry from the pain in my leg. And my knee was very unstable. Even when swimming (kicking while in the water), I could feel the bones in my knee slipping in bad ways.

I finally broke down and went to the doctor, got properly diagonsed, and decided to have the surgery. I had an auto-graft (they used the middle part of my patellar tendon to replace the ACL. I think these days they’re mostly using a bit of the hamstring as replacement tissue.)

I was non-weight-bearing (on crutches) for 6 weeks. I was out of work for 2 weeks, back on crutches after that. Luckily I have a sitting job. I did NOT have the passive-motion machine. I DID have the machine that circulates ice-water in a cuff that’s strapped around my knee – HIGHLY recommended!

I went through physical therapy for about 3 months, I think, going once or twice a week. The hardest part for me was getting back flexion (being able to bend the knee.) FOR ME, physical therapy was the most excruciating thing I have ever endured. I was SO HAPPY the first day I went through a whole session without crying in pain most of the hour. But you REALLY have to do it anyway.

Keep in mind I was about 45 when I had the surgery. I think the time he kept me on crutches was a VERY conservative treatment based on my age and condition. I was not very fit at the time. I believe that many people who are more fit and athletic get through the surgery and rehab more easily that if you’re not-so-fit.

I got a LOT of information and advice (and encouragement) from the folks on Bob’s WWW ACL board (http://factotem.org/cgi-bin/kneebbs.pl). You can read stuff here from folks who had the surgery and were back riding bikes and exercising in about a month.

I DON’T regret having the surgery. My knee is more stable now, and my pain is less. (Pain is not completely gone, but I’m 50 now, and I’m sure I have arthritis to deal with as well. I’ve also got some weird structural issue in my left leg, because my hip joint has hurt almost as much as my knee since I injured it the second time.) But that’s me. Most folks do NOT have this problem.

It was all much harder than I had thought it would be. But it was still the right thing to do. And now I know that I can deal with this kind of hard thing, which is useful in its own right.

Very good luck, and very best wishes!!!

14

I also had ACL reconstruction and orthoscopy about 5 years ago.
This was after “spraining” my left knee over and over again for three years prior.
After the final “sprain” (Doing the can can! :D) I requested to see an orthopedic specialist. They did an MRI and I was scheduled for surgery within the week.
The surgeon told me I had approximately 25% of my ACL left and about half the cartilege left in my knee.

I was hospitalized for two days. Not as much for the knee as for other health issues related to surgery (I have problems with BP–I zip out). I was bedridden for two days when I got home.
Ended up being out 1 complete week, then half to 3/4 days the following week.
Physical therapy for a month. It was really weird when I took the splint and bandages off the first time and really looked at my leg. It looked SO pathetic! My left thigh was a full 1" smaller than my right one.
Used crutches for 3 weeks, a cane for another 2. I couldn’t STAND the crutches.
And I agree with those above about the cold water cuff- FABULOUS!

IMHO, GO for it. I have arthritis in that knee because I waited so long to get it “fixed”. You deserve to get back into the “groove” of things- sitting on the sidelines sucks.

15

of work.

16

I knew dancing with wild abandon would be nothing but trouble.

17

Had the same problem, with an ankle, and ligament.
Finally had the surgery 3 years after the injury took place, it was the best thing I could have done. I regret waiting so long as it would have healed way better. I actually didn’t really wait on purpose, the doctors were just morons… But the fact is, treat it as quick as possible.

18

Another ACL recon here. My surgery was done on an outpatient basis. I missed one week of work and then used an icewater circulating thingy in the office for a few weeks. No passive motion machine. Physical therapy a couple times a week for six months. It took longer than that to feel like I was back to normal but I really think that’s a function of how hard you work in rehab. Definitely research the kind of graft you want–I had a quadricep tendon graft which isn’t used much and it’s been great–no pain, no problems, and, best of all, no kneebrace for sports.

19

Just in case anyone was wondering. The MRI shows a torn ACL but no cartilege damage, so the operation is not madatory-- according to the doc, if both were damage, then surgery would have been the only option.

I’m trying the conservative route once again. My doc has recommended a therapist who specializes in knees (I didn’t know they existed) and with luck and some hard work, I may not need surgery.