Shudder to Think apreciation Thread? Or unappreciation thread? You decide.

This is a continuation of the discussion started in this thread.

Shudder to Think was one of the most unique band out for a long time. They combined dissonance, anger, and raw energy while at the same time creating some of the most beautiful and melodic music I have ever heard.

The problem is there was a point in Shudder to Thinks career
when things changed and fans divided. You guessed it, they got signed to a major label! There are two camps. Those who like Shudder on Discord (their old label) and those who continued to like them after. I don’t think it is an issue of selling out but rather a matter of life changes and lineup changes. ICH BIN made some great observations in the thread I linked to up top and here is my answer.

I completely see what you are saying about Shudder to think. I feel that pony express definitely delves(sp?) into new areas for shudder. Unfortunately the only songs I really like on P.E.R. were written while Shudder to Think was still on Discord (hit liquor, No Rm. 9, Kentucky).

The problem is that Shudder to Think is technically 2 bands. Pre-Pony and Post-Pony. The drummer and guitarist both left before the album. They were replaced by Nathan Larson (Swiz) and Adam Wade (Jawbox). The old guitarist Chris Matthew’s MADE shudder to think what they were. Craig Wedren’s vocals are unique but nothing without Matthew’s. If you’ve had the pleasure of hearing curses, spells, voodoo, mooses which was one of their first albums you will notice how unappealing Craig’s voice can be.

Anyone else love Shudder to Think? Any opinions on the matter?

I think I made up a word! Unappreciation? oh well, you get the idea! :wink:

Here is my history with Shudder to Think: caught a video late one night on MTV, of all places, for “X French T-Shirt” I think that’s the name of the song, could be wrong. Absolutely loved it!!! never heard anything again, couldn’t even remember how the song went, but remembered the title and that it blew my hair back.

Years later, found the cd that had that song and grabbed it. I don’t know anything about the band and quite frankly, can’t figure their music out, but am very interested. Which Shudder to Think is that album from? Are they still around? What’s their story? How the hell do they make music like that?

Album: Pony Express Record
Still around: Nope. They did an album for a movie awhile ago but nothing else. Nathan Larson (guitarist) is now doing solo albums.
Story: If I remember correctly they met at NYU. Got into the DC music scene. Signed onto Fugazi’s label and the rest is history.
Music: I have no IDEA :slight_smile:

I will say one thing about Shudder to Think (well, I’ll probably say more). They committed, for me, the greatest crime possible for a band. And it is this:

Okay, they had a lineup change for Pony. Happens to bands all the time, coincided with the switch to a major. Okay. I don’t begrudge bands for wanting to be in a financially sound position, and I always wish them well when they decide to make the jump. I don’t cry sellout, it just makes me nervous for their future. I have watched so many of my favorite bands go to a major, put out one mediocre album, and disband. It’s distressing. But that’s not the point here (there, I’ve already said more than one thing…). I thought Pony was a great album, but in some ways not a great Shudder album. I think Pony came out in 93ish? by this point in my record-buying lifetime, there were bands I had been following for years, and had seen change and evolve. This is natural. I don’t want Fugazi to release “Repeater” five stinkin’ times. If you like repeater, listen to it. I have called this the “Andy effect”. A good friend of mine in school named Andy absolutely hated the second album by any band you’d care to mention (except Crimpshrine, but that’s a different thread. What the h*ll is up with Crimpshrine fans, anyway?). Second Nuisance album? Hated it. Second Godbullies album? Hated it. Plaid Retina? Has-beens. In on the kill Taker? Don’t even get him started!
So maybe my reaction to Pony was after being subjected to years of negativity, and saying “hey, I don’t have to hate this if I don’t want to!”. Sounds obvious in hindsight. But I tried to listen to Pony without thinking of the history of the band, and found I enjoyed it. It worked as a whole, instead of screeching to a halt at the end of side one while Craig blathered about sugar mountains.

But I haven’t made my point yet. As of Pony, everything is okay in Shudder world. The sh*t hits the fan with 50,000 B.C. By this album, the drummer has left. Okay. We’ll forgive that. So they get a new drummer. Then I look at the album cover. Hmmmmm. Three guys. Where the hell is the new drummer? Are there no drums on this album? Oh, there are? Then what the hell? He’s not a smart enough dresser?

Now, maybe I’m biased. I’m a drummer. But that doesn’t matter. Any band that has a contributing member, on every stinking song, should be acknowledged as part of the band! I mean, at least smashing pumpkins acknowledged that Kenny Arnoff was filling in (what was the deal with those glasses? Did he just get back from the shooting range? But I digress…). When Mac vacated the throne for Jesus Lizard, horrible as it was, the very capable James Kimball became part of the band. So when a band like the Cranberrys has their real keyboard player hiding under the stage, while the pixie lead singer bangs on a keyboard that isn’t even hooked up, it pisses me off. Or the “fifth” member of REM. Who are you fooling? Why?

As of 50,000 B.C., Shudder never acknowledged 50% of their rhythm section. It just seemed very contrived. I actually enjoyed 50,000 B.C. to some degree, but even less as a Shudder album.

I haven’t really answered the question. But I did forgive, and accept, the compromises for Pony. Heck, I loved that album. But at 50,000, the dynamics of the band, their image, overtook the music and soured it for me. And that’s too bad. That to me doesn’t seem to far off from liking or not liking a band based on how snappy they look, or how many tattoos they have. The music should always come first. With 50,000, the weight became too much to became too much to bear.

Okay, now that I got that off my chest I can answer the question. I came by Shudder relatively late in their Discord career; the first time I saw them was on tour supporting Get Your Goat. So my familiarity with them was based on seeing their albums in hindsight. And we all know, that changes everything. I can’t imagine running home with Dark Side of the Moon and hearing it, along with the rest of the world, for the first time. By the time I heard it, it had been a part of musical history, and had been appropriated by other musicians for years. I didn’t have years of time invested in absorbing what Shudder was doing by the time Pony came out. And I admit, the contributions of Chris have been overlooked by me. I focused more on their bizarre timekeeping and Craig’s soaring, and occasionally annoying and out of tune, voice. These two elements were what drew me to Shudder, and they were still there, I thought, with Pony.

I’ll shut up now, for a bit.

Thanks for the discussion

I had a copy of Get your Goat when it came out. Listened to it somewhat, but was never horribly turned on by it. Then I heard some tracks from P.E.R. and really dug them, but for some reason I never picked up the CD. It’s still one that I want, but I never really think about it when I am looking for CDs. This thread will probably pique my interest once again to pick it up.

However, I LOVE the soundtrack to High Art, which they did most (all?) of. It’s moody, bleak and sparse. One of the best interpretations of the “feel” of a movie into the “feel” of a soundtrack IMO. Anyone else heard this?