This is actually a question relayed from my girlfriend. GF and I got some heirloom type silverware (actual silver) from her mother (I believe it was originally her grandmother’s). We used only a couple times with no problems. However, recently (WAG: 15th usage) the spoons have started tasting like garlic. He haven’t used them for garlic or anything like that, and the taste persists even after several thorough washes.
1.) I hypothesize that the silver reacts with something and that reaction makes this funny taste.
2.) I also hypthesize that it’s only the spoons and not the forks because the forks have a much smaller surface area.
MY QUESTIONS:
1.) Why does this happen? What’s going on?
2.) Has this happened to anyone else?
3.) How can I fix them? (When you are eating yogurt, the garlic taste is nauseating)
WAG: Isn’t yogurt fairly acidic? Have you noticed if it only happens when other acidic foods are being consumed? It may be a reaction between the silver and acid.
Most silver salts are insoluble in water, hence tasteless. Gold chloride smells like garlic, and some of the other heavy metals have salts with odd tastes. Are you certain the spoons are silver rather than silver plate ?
Jayrot - Stop Using that Silver right now - IMHO. The taste of Garlic means organic phosphorus compounds in your silver. The phosphorus can come from 2 sources :
1> The detergent or the water you use is high in phosphates. But this will not account for the garlic taste because the phosphorus in garlic is organic while phosphates are inorganic.
2> The silverware you describe is not actually silver but with a electroplated (or chemical depostion) of silver. During the electroplating process several phosphorus complexes are used to reduce ionic moblity to get a better coating. Maybe that phosphorus is being liberated now (you may have used it with acidic food).
In any case unidentified organic phosphorus compounds are a real no-no. Many nerve agents are organic phosphorus compounds. So I suggest, you take the silverware to a lab to get it checked.
Having said all that, I really not certain that it is organic phosphorus, but its an high probablility.
What kind of lead silverware were the Romans supposed to have poisoned themselves with? I thought that it was the lead in their pipes that did them in.
Did they use lead knives? Hard to believe if you you have any experience with lead.
Did they use lead forks? Hard to believe since forks hadn’t been invented.
Was it spoons? Did they use lead spoons and suck on them?
Does anyone have any real evidence of anyone ever being in anyway poisoned by any kind of silverware, ever?
Yeah there are documented deaths in the manfacturing industry for silverware. But not from silverware use.
I have, on the other hand, heard of cases of lead poisoning from improperly fired pottery, ceramics and antique tableware, lead crystal, or pewter dishes. I’m sure that documented cases can be found for those – but that’s cups, plates and bowls, not the knives and forks.
Though IIRC you are correct about the Romans, it was lead pipes that were suspect, not the silverware.
Yeah, Yeah they do. The Romans made utensils from pewter, which is an alloy of tin with up to 60% lead.
The rich folk who could afford to buy metal utensils had more lead deposited in their teeth than the poor people who just drank the water. That’s an indicator of a greater body burden of lead. The story that the romans were poisoned by lead in the pipes is an oversimplification. Roman Pewter lead in teeth
Lots of other metals are also toxic enough that you don’t want them leaching out of your silverware.
Sorry Squink, but no cigar. The post is about silverware. My question was about silverware. Your answers are about drinking and serving utensils, not silverware.
So now we have industrial poisoning, and poisoning associated with ceramic, pewter, and glass vessels. All of this is common knowledge.
You are, however, correct that “Lots of other metals are also toxic enough that you don’t want them leaching out of your silverware.” I would put arsenic, thalium, and lead in this category and I’m sure there are many others. However, the fact that you could be poisoned if you ate forks made out of arsenic does not, as far as I am concerned, consitute evidence that anyone anywhere has ever been poisoned by silverware.
Once more time, does anyone have any real evidence?
The sulfide is a black compound that forms the tarnish on silver.
Sufides smell like garlic. The compounds in garlic that give it the characteristic smell are also sulfides, though organic.
You can reduce* the silver sulfide (Ag2S) back to silver by putting the silver in a warm solution of bicarb and have the silver touching immersed aluminium foil. This is better than scrubbing the silver off, as no silver is removed.
Toxicity - not very (at this concentration) according to the MSDS for Ag2S. You are dealing with small amounts, this salt is ‘insoluble’ in H20.
I suspect most silverware deaths involve puncture wounds.
Electrochemical reaction. Electrons added to the Ag.
Please remove the wax from between your ears and examine the definition of silverware:
Metal Drinking and serving utensils are silverware. Thus people have poisoned themselves with silverware. Since the romans made serving utensils from pewter, it’s quite likely that they also made individual knives and spoons out of the stuff. You just may be pedantic enough to believe otherwise, but who cares ? Pewter was used in spoons, and it poisoned the people who used them.
antechinus, you’d have to have large amounts of the sulfide, and likely need to be eating an acid food, to get any flavor from the tarnish. Silver sulfide is more stable than the flavorless, odorless iron sulfide (pyrite). On the other hand, if the OP (Jayrot) wears braces or has fillings, he might be doing some oral redux chemistry on the silver sulfides. That could give rise to an odd taste.
The problem I with the sulfide hypothesis is that, if it were true, lots of people should already know that tarnished silver tastes funny because it releases H[sub]2[/sub]S in the mouth. Not only is such odor/flavor production from silver tarnish not common knowledge, but searching on terms like “silverware”, “flavor”, “sulfide”, “taste”, “tarnish” etc. don’t turn up anything on it either. Whatever it is that’s causing Jayrot’s problem, it seems to be rare. A redox reaction between the sulfide and some exotic metal in a tooth filling would fill that bill nicely.
Hollowware and flatware made of or plated with silver.
Metal eating and serving utensils.
My point exactly, silverware does not include drinking utensils.
“Since the romans made serving utensils from pewter, it’s quite likely that they also made individual knives and spoons out of the stuff.”
So in your mind its “quite likely” that they made knives and spoons out of pewter? Do you have any evidence other than your humble opnion? I’m seeking evidence.
Do you have any real evidence whatsoever to support either of your claims that “Pewter was used in spoons” and that “it poisoned the people who used them.”
This is really getting boring and it taking a lot longer than I thought but I’m seeking the straight dope. One more time, does anyone have any real evidence?
The author may have confused H2S poisoning with HCN. Both lead to similar signs/symptoms, produce major toxic effect through inhibition of cytochrome-oxidase system and involve the same treatment.
If so, it’s not just this author. I keep coming up with statement like
“No article, polish or other substance containing any cyanide preparation or other poisoning material shall be used for the cleaning or polishing of utensils.”
in regulations governing eating and drinking establishments.
It’s not the tarnish that causes the poisoning, it’s the cleaner, so I guess that won’t satisfy Yeah.
