Okay then, aside from their effect on the STD issue, do you think that unmarried people who regularly engage in unprotected sex negatively affect society?
No. Explain to me why they would.
I think regular unprotected sex is often irresponsible and detrimental to society, especially when it’s engaged in by uncommitted partners, and/or people who lack the resources or emotional ability to deal with a baby.
The women with 4 kids by 3 baby daddies, and the Johnny Appleseeds busy ignoring 7 kids with 5 baby mamas negatively affect society, yes.
One of three scenarios can occur (at least):[ol]
[li]They get pregnant and have a baby they didn’t plan for. More kids are born into single families - increasing the likelihood that these women will suffer economic hardship. Men and women who aren’t right for each other get shotgun weddings - which will increase the divorce rate and create a dysfunctional family atmosphere for the child. Kids are raised without proper adult supervision - which creates a whole gamut of societal problems.[/li]
[li]They get pregnant and have an abortion. This at least creates a societal mindset that fetuses are disposable… that children are a burden instead of a blessing.[/li]
[li]They don’t get pregnant. Then they continue to have unprotected sex and increase the chances of #1 or #2 of happening. The fact that they don’t get pregnant also lends credence to the idea that pregnancy isn’t likely to happen and it further disconnects pregnancy from sex. Society as a whole gets even more accepting of unprotected sex. People forget point #1 and develop an attitude that “if someone’s life doesn’t have an immediate effect on me, then it’s of no concern to me. I don’t believe in long therm consequences.”[/li][/ol]
[quote=“SmartAlx, post:64, topic:515163”]
One of three scenarios can occur (at least):[ol]
[li]They get pregnant and have a baby they didn’t plan for. More kids are born into single families - increasing the likelihood that these women will suffer economic hardship. Men and women who aren’t right for each other get shotgun weddings - which will increase the divorce rate and create a dysfunctional family atmosphere for the child. Kids are raised without proper adult supervision - which creates a whole gamut of societal problems.[/li][/quote]
Well, at least you now admit the existence of shotgun weddings (which you were not admitting in the other thread).
[quote]
[li]They get pregnant and have an abortion. This at least creates a societal mindset that fetuses are disposable… that children are a burden instead of a blessing.[/li][/quote]
They are both.
FTR, I still think that rampant STDs are of more consequence to society than pregnancy. Worse long term problems.
And I don’t know if you’ve noticed that many women have said they wouldn’t change their views about sex because they already take it very seriously, and cannot fathom being more restrictive. Other than being celibate, which many don’t chose to do.
What? Disposable and a burden?
I beg to differ. STDs are a very OBVIOUS societal problem. But that makes the other problems that much more sadistic. They sneak in under the radar and before you know it your world has changed.
And I don’t don’t know if YOU have noticed that many women have said that they WOULD change their sexual behavior. 30% is not insignificant, especially for such a liberal population sample as the SDMB.
They didn’t say they would stop having sex.
But they did say that their attitudes towards sex would change.
No, a burden and a blessing.
I got lost… And in this point I guess we’ll disagree, as I see STDs as a worse side effect of sex than a pregnancy.
Nope, but it is still not most of them, and not all of them have said they would abstain completely from sex (and even, it appears the ones posting here would be abstaining from one type of sex).
The thing is, women aren’t stupid. We know the risks of unprotected sex and sensible women know the failure rates for birth control. You’ve asked how one half of the population would change their behaviour if abortion were illegal; what about the other half?
What responsibility do men have when it comes to preventing unwanted pregnancy and do you think men would change their behaviour if abortion were illegal? Despite feminism and the sexual revolution, there’s still a dichotomy in popular American culture in which women are the ones who are supposed to prevent pregnancy and decline sex while men are supposed to be interested in having sex and not interested in preventing pregnancy. I’ve read that one reason women don’t use birth control, especially condoms is because the men they’re having sex with pressure them not to. One reason teenagers who’ve taken abstinence-only sex education are more likely to have unprotected sex is because using birth control indicates one planned on having sex and was therefore planning on sinning, to use an old word.
Do you think women are solely responsible for the decision to have unprotected sex? Personally, I would guess that men are at least as responsible for that decision as women, but that is purely a guess and I’m not even sure how accurately one could assess responsibility.
You were once young. We were all once pretty stupid. I sure was. The attitudes we have now are built upon the foundation of life lessons that was poured when we were young. Sure we learn from our mistakes, but some of those things that were mistakes never manifested in a way to teach us the healthy life lesson.
He has an enormous responsibility.
Probably not much. After all the man’s feelings about abortion are largely ignored today. Women today might be extra careful because of the fear of STDs and pregnancy and other issues like moving too fast. Men today are more careless because they don’t have much of a say regarding a pregnancy. I don’t know if he would be any more careful after abortions were made illegal… You know, come to think of it, he might be because he’s probably going to have more at stake than he does now.
Well, that’s men and women for you. We are different after all.
ABSOLUTELY NOT! Both are responsible. In a certain way (as a man who has a desire to be the protector) I can almost support the idea that the man has even MORE of a responsibility.
I don’t understand how this would change anything. My husband and I use The Pill and condoms. Every. Single. Time. I would never have an abortion anyway.
Uh, so short answer, ‘‘no.’’
With all due respect, sir, just because you are or were stupid about sex when you were young doesn’t mean all of us were. I didn’t lose my virginity until I was in my late 20s and, when I did, it was to my fiance. Before we had sex with each other, we did discuss what would happen if I became pregnant and, even on our first night together, we took steps to make sure that wouldn’t happen.
It’s funny. On this message board, I see a lot more young men asking how they can get young women to have sex with them than vice versa, and I see a lot of more talk about how women can prevent pregnancy than men. You say you think men are as responsible for unwanted pregnancy as women if not more so, yet, when asked if men would change their attitudes if abortion were illegal, you, in effect, throw your hands in the air and say men are different.
Perhaps men are, but as long as American society continues to push the notion that women, not men, are responsible for access to sex and birth control and that men always want sex and it’s up to women to change, there’s no incentive for men to be different. It’s unfortunate, but there is still a lot of pressure for men to conform to certain male stereotypes which include always being interested in sex and not caring or thinking about pregnancy.
Women have done and will continue to do what they can to prevent unwanted pregnancies. I’d like to suggest something radical. Let’s get men to give some thought as to what they can do.
I wouldn’t do anything different than I already have - birth control pills for about 17 years, and an IUD for the last couple.
I think the current situation would have the opposite effect; if the man doesn’t get to choose what happens after a pregnancy, it would be in his best interests to assert his choice before it has even happened.
Well what sort of say do you want? Do you have condoms available or is it on your partner to provide the birth control?
I think that people having children they aren’t prepared to take care of is a bigger problem than STDs, but that is only an opinion.
Condoms can be a litmus test, and if he doesn’t want to use a condom, then i don’t want to be with him. Two to tango, and all.
I’m not seeing where I said that I approved of unprotected sex, but i pointed out other stupid things people do to themselves… some people just don’t care. I don’t have children and don’t really want any,
Yes! Are you kidding? The first guy I had sex with had a vasectomy. I wouldn’t have done it otherwise. It helped that he’d been married once and had a child and was over 30. The last thing I wanted was to be an unwed mother or even to have to consdier abortion.
Believe me, I was NOT stupid about sex when I was young. But I was still stupid about a lot of other things. Try to understand what I was saying. Our opinions about life are formed on the founation of experience we have in our youth. Not just our opinions about sex. Our opinions about EVERYTHING.
We are different. Men are… men! Women are wonderful, but they don’t act like men.
Actually I said that I was inclined to think that men would change their attitudes towards sex because they would have more at stake if abortion were illegal.
You just described how women are one thing and men are another. Sounds like a difference to me.
Not sure if I would call it “pressure” but things like girls gone wild commercials certainly don’t discourage it.
My point is that women remove men from the decision. They say, “it’s not your choice.” So men leave the whole thing up to the woman. Men have left contraception up to the woman because women have told men that it’s none of their business.
You can’t blame men for it if you don’t give men any say. This is perhaps an unintended consequense of not including men in the abortion decision.
I want to have a say as to whether or not my child lives.
I don’t have sex. I’m not married. And I’m not gay so I don’t have “partners.”
I agree.
Right here. You certainly alluded to it.
That’s why I asked. I couldn’t believe that you supported people having unprotected sex.