To be blunt, by your logic pretty much everyone ever born into the Elder Scrolls universe deserves death. It’s a rough place, and nobody in power really has clean hands. And it’s really hard to hold people indefinitely in prison in a world where magic and advanced locking skills are both common (not to mention, expensive).
But apart from that, do you really want to send the message that “Sure, you may have been a bad guy once, but then switched and spent thousands of years trying to teach people a better path - but you’re no longer of use so DIE!” ?
By The Blade’s argument, I mean. They aren’t concerned whether his betrayal of Alduin was motivated by altruism or opportunity; Esbern says that it does not excuse his previous crimes. Rather they think his betrayal of Alduin makes it likely that he will one day betray the Greybeards;
Delphine: “He helped Alduin enslave our ancestors. He may have betrayed Alduin in the end, but that makes him worse, not better. We can’t afford to give Paarturnax the opportunity to betray us in turn, and return to his old master.”
Incidentally it is possible to imprison a dragon; that’s what Dragonsreach in Whiterun is. Paarthy suggests that such a state is actually a fate worse than death for dragons, as Numinex lost his mind and could not remember his own name. However it’s unlikely to work on Paarthy as he already knows the trick you used on Odahviing. Maybe the Dragonborn could use Bend Will or Dragonrend, but neither side would be satisfied - the Greybeards would never accept his indefinite imprisonment until he lost his mind and for the Blades only death is a fitting punishment for his acts during the Dragon War.
Yeah, I was gonna say - even if you try and walk the straight and narrow, stay right off the daedric, the necromantic, the lycanthropic, the vampiric, the magic and even the narcotic ; by the time you have to deal with that particular moral quandary your character’s probably knee deep in blood him/herself. Oh, sure, sure, self-defense, all of it, I’m sure… but when you’re a nigh-immortal, health potion-infused walking god of destruction who can shout the heavens apart (more or less), is it really still self-defense to behead the poor schmuck trying to rob all of 100 septims off of your multi-billionaire arse ? And if you’ve taken sides in the civil war, how many random guys have *you *butchered lately ?
Let the old dragon live I say, and fuck the Blades - fuck 'em twice for letting me trek all the way down a fricking zombie ruin for nothing (“Ha ha, gotcher horn, psych !”). If it turns out Paarthy’s up to no good in the end, well, I’ll be there. Or my progeny - seeing as the first Dragonborn forged himself an empire, I figure the latest might build a new one, go dynastic on Tamriel, why not ?
Until then, he’s not the one who’s bossing me over, playing games or dicking me around, and seeing as I’m a Nord’s Nord I already got quite enough crusading fanatics on my side already, thankyouverymuch.
That’s another thing… No one but a Dragonborn can truly kill a dragon. They are immortal creatures; death hinders them for but a short while. So, you let Paarthurnax live. You live out the rest of your days in Tamriel, and forge a mighty empire. A thousand years from now, your empire has crumbled and the last of your Dragonborn descendants has died. Meanwhile, up in the Throat of the World, something pisses Paarthurnax off… Maybe Anakus Snowwalker is trained in the ways of the Voice and backstabs his master, or maybe the mighty dragon just gets bored. In any case, he decides that humanity isn’t worth saving, and that he made a big mistake when he taught them the Voice. Suddenly, the second most powerful dragon of all time is flying around killing people. The last man, woman, or Argonian who could stop him died a decade ago. Say goodbye to a few million of Tamriel’s citizens!
The point is, there is no guarantee that stopping a rampaging dragon will be an option once you’re gone (do we even know if Dragonborn-ness is passed by blood?). And Paarthurnax isn’t an innocent, fluffy bunny; he’s a monster who has decided to stop his evil ways (for a thousand years, sure, but a thousand years is the blink of an eye for a dragon!).
Wouldn’t the “but they might, maybe, if they want to, and way in the future, someday, maybe, might destoy a bunch of people” be the logic for destroying anything and anyone? Why not slaughter all the Greybeards, it possible that they become corrupted and murder millions of people using their awesome powers? Why not commit suicide? It’s possible, after a few years, you could destroy millions of people? Why not slaughter the Blades, the orphans at Honorhall, or everyone you meet, because they could, in such a bleak world, become murders at some point in the future?
Yeah, seriously, why would anyone switch sides then? Desperation drives people to do many things.
I always spared him, and I got pissed at the Blades, too. I cannot hold people accountable only for their evil actions. It’s like when a person dies having committed a crime. He could have helped the community all his life. He could have given all of his money to charity, sacrificed so much, but everyone remembers him for his crime. I do it too. I think it’s a human thing, to let the evil deeds overshadow the good…
but I know even in my own life everyone is far more nuanced than that.
I let him live. The blades are just bitter and vindictive, and really from a gamer’s perspective, useless. The Greaybeards and Paarty entrust you with some cool shouts and strongly support the path of least bloodshed whereas the Blades…what is it they do again? Oh yeah, start out half-cocked suspecting the Thalmor are sided with the dragons and send you off to a party which, by all rights, should allow you to get sideways of Maven Blackbriar before you get into the thieves guild story arc, and then whip up a really cool potion that is essentially of little use in a fight with a dragon–and they’re snotty about it. The Blades are weak sauce, hangers on to outdated dogma and closed to the concept of repentance & redemption. Screw 'em. To get through the story you’re going to eventually be in a Paarty’s position–hoping to be forgiven for the barrels of blood you’ve spilt in furtherance of your own agenda.
Yeah, on my first playthrough, with no knowledge of the backstory, when Delphine says “The war was over, the Nords were beaten, and now Ulfric is loose, there’s fighting everywhere and the dragons are back… who benefits from that?” my first thought was, “The dragons?”
He’s not some random schmuck with a history of benevolence who maybe, someday, might destroy a bunch of people. He’s a monster, one who has caused untold amounts of pain, suffering, and death. If the Greybeards had, as an organization, committed mass murder and genocide, then I’d argue that they should be disbanded, by force if necessary. But they didn’t. They’re powerful, but when have they ever killed anyone? Besides, anyone can kill a Greybeard if they’re lucky; only a Dragonborn, and absolutely no one else, can kill a dragon.
Neither, if you played Skyrim as anything but a completely altruistic pacifist in the game, are you. I suggest you finish Alduin, and then commit suicide because the risk of you doing bad acts again is just too great and you are too powerful.
Until you said this, it never occurred to me to wonder why nobody called the Greybeards out because Ulfric used the voice to kill the king…
Actually, the Blades were reknowned dragon-killers, and once the Dragonkin deals what whole pesky Alduin situation, if they kill a dragon, it’ll be permanent. That’s why I say, if they want Paarthurnax dead, there’s the mountain. He’s all yours.
Yes, but unless you joined the Dark Brotherhood or went around murdering city folks, you were not anywhere near as bad as he was. Remember, he was Alduin’s second in command; he is responsible for nearly as much death and destruction as Alduin was. If your character slaughtered bandits or joined the civil war on either side, he certainly killed many people; but there is a difference between killing in war and killing because you don’t believe anything under a ton and without scales doesn’t deserve to live.
I’ve finished Skyrim three times; once as a werewolf berserker who joined the Dark Brotherhood; once as a Khajiit Paladin who wouldn’t attack anyone unless attacked first; and once as a more moderate Argonian mage, who would attack bandits before they attacked him, but didn’t go out of his way to kill anyone. I’d certainly not argue with you if you told me my werewolf berserker deserved to have his head chopped off; the other two did much more good than evil, though.
Seconded. generally speaking, all Tamrielic heroes are the kind of people who can and have, without blinking an eye, massacre their enemies by the dozen and by the thousands.
Paarthurnax is notable because he was a servant of Alduin, as pretty much all dragons were (and are). He was literally created a concept of raging tyranny. However, he changed his mind about humanity and embraced a gentler path, dedicating himself to teaching humanity - including teaching humanity how to kill dragons, to the extent it was necessary. He’s been the tutor, directly and indirectly, of at least two of Tamriel’s greatest champions.
To be blunt, he’s better and more successful than all the Blades ever born put together.
(As a sidenote, when I say that I think Paarthurnax should be slain I speak from a real-world moral grounds. Of my three characters, none have killed him; I figured the berserker would have kinda liked him, the mage wouldn’t be suicidal enough to attack a dragon unless he had to, and the Paladin would be far more forgiving than I would.)
Missed edit, but: I think a better way to put this is, maybe the question isn’t if he SHOULD be slain, but whether he DESERVES to. Just because he deserves to be punished doesn’t mean he should be, if that makes sense.
I am willing to give a creature a pass when it was at war with a bunch savages from another species. Considering that the Blades were dragon slayers, intent on genocide doesn’t suggest that hugging all the humans is a logical solution. Add to the fact that Godwin-Hitler at least knew that Jews were the same species and have similar thought patterns, while the dragons could’ve thought that the ancient Nords were loincloth wearing crunch patties, while the Nords thought they were mindless devourers for some time. I’d say P has a bit more moral standing than the Nazis.
If anything, get mad at him for encouraging the obsolescence and extinction of his species.