The rest of your post is pissed off, sort of irrational, histrionics.
Despite what some folks here may have written, it’s fairly unlikely any of them are jackbooted thugs who treat their children like slaves or worse.
You are, of course, entitled to your opinion as to what being a good parent is, but having been a kid once is not really an sort of bona fides when it comes to being a parent. The biggest reason is that when we’re kids we generally have little perspective on life nor any familiarity with what dealing with ALL of the things you have to deal with as an adult. I’m not one to dismiss anyone’s opinion on the subject, but at the same time, having raised to boys to adults, my experience will trump any non-parent’s perspective.
What’s the big deal whether parents snoop or not? A parent’s job is to raise a well adjusted, moral human being with all the skills necessary for their achieving his or her maximum potential in the personal and professional realms.
And that task is certainly a case in which there is more than one way to skin a cat.
So, as long as you get the job done, and it’s a sweet piece of work, does it in any way matter how you did it? No.
So do what works for you and your family, and if you can’t figure out what that is, then go a little further in your search than whatever the currently trendy piece of pop psychology is.
Is a moral, well adjusted human being to believe that other peoples privacy is a non-issue? Should they believe it’s okay for it to be violated any time?
My mother tried snooping on me, and I caught her in it (of course, she didn’t find anything). My dad never tried.
Even had they both gone through every effort possible, they never would’ve found anything, because I was a little spy when I was younger. My phones were 4 digit-PIN locked, the PIN changed frequently, and if you put the wrong PIN in so many times, the phone self-wiped (and as soon as I discovered encryption, I started using it on everything I owned).
My Computers had BIOS passwords on the Hard Drives, then different passwords on the Operating Systems, and then different passwords once again for each of my email accounts, forums, chat programs, etc.
And I didn’t do this to hide stuff from my parents, I did it because it makes sense to take security precautions. I’ve had a credit/debit card my entire life, often with sky high limits (even before I was 18), and I didn’t want to risk should my Phone or computer get stolen that my card got tagged.
I probably would’ve let my father look through my computer, had he asked… he wouldn’t have found anything, even if he knew what to look for. I was honest with him when he asked me questions, even when being honest was the wrong answer… because he trusted me.
Snooping on your kids doesn’t do any good, if they’re smart, they’ll hide it well enough that you couldn’t find it from a “parental overview,” and if they’re dumb, you’ll find it without snooping. Honestly, people tend to underestimate their children. At the age of 8 I had spy-stashes all around the house, and access to every PIN protected system I could find.
Personally, I’m just terribly amused that, even though I’ve repeatedly said that I am not a snooper, Yogsooth has chosen me as the representative of all that is oppressive. Apparently, simply asserting my right to go into any room in my own home, and demanding that my child not do or keep anything that I disapprove of in my own home, qualifies me as a jackbooted thug.
In the other Pit thread about the school spying on kids in their homes, there’s a link to a DIGG page that contained an interesting post. Rewording it a bit, and paraphrasing, it said:
“If you raise kids so they get used to having their rights, freedoms, and privacy arbitrarily suspended or violated, it’s all the easier to make them accept the same shit when they’re adults.”
When I started this thread, I hadn’t even considered such an idea. In fact, I actually find it somewhat compelling and would submit that it’s one more reason not to arbitrarily spy on your kids. By doing so, you are preconditioning them to accept such intrusions from the “parent” they’ll have as an adult. And that “parent” is more commonly known as the government.
People dream that they can actually make their kids become what they want them to. Parenting is a thankless business. You need to give kids room to develop their own personalities and interests. But you are afraid and want to keep close tabs. It is tough to know what the right thing is. I can guarantee you that saying I paid for everything, it is my house and you have to do what I tell you to, will create resentment.
Most parents want their kids to be like them. Sadly most of them end up that way.
You have to learn to trust them to do the right thing. You can not live their lives for them.
One of the hardest days is the first time your kid drives off in a car. You know how poor a driver he is, but he thinks he is good.
And yet obesity, which is almost universally caused by eating more than you need (which you can typically tell by when you don’t want to eat anymore), is one of the – if not the – leading health concern in Americans, and certainly in American youth.
No, they’d be absolutely right . The theory of raising children bears absolutely no resemblance to the practice. Besides, I was a kid too.
In fact, though I haven’t done much research in this area, I suspect nearly all of the posters in this thread may have been children at some point. Some have also been parents, which means they are twice as qualified to weigh in on the subject as you are.
Yeah, I think most everybody is on your side here. Weren’t you the one who weirded some people out when you mentioned buying condoms for your daughter because she had run out? (Or am I thinking of someone else?)
Probably, although I don’t so much “buy her condoms” as “make sure there are condoms in the medicine cabinet at all times”. They go on the grocery list, same as shampoo and sugar.
Well aren’t you all badass? How adorable. Guess what honey… unless you defended your privacy by moving out and getting your own place, you WERE incompetent, albeit probably not criminally.
I don’t know how old you are Yogsooth, but you still think like a kid, and stomp your foot like one. At 17, if you don’t like the rules, you leave. Maybe your parents were as unreasonable and horrible as you say they were. But it never occurred to you that the best way to get out from under them was to be a grownup.
It is a way to make them resentful and a way to make them sneakier. Kids need privacy too. It is part of growing as a parent, to be able to back off. It is easy to convince yourself that being all over your kid will make them better and safer. It will often do the opposite.
You can always make up reasons to justify snooping. But it will do harm. Much of the harm is to your relationship with them.
I was lucky in that I had a ‘good’ kid who, while never the jolliest or sharingest of girls, never hung out with thugs, stayed out all night, came home drunk, etc. I always told her she could come to me with any problem, ANY problem, or discuss anything. I told her it was my job as a parent to help her grow up, and deal with bad things as well as good. But if I ever had to search her room? It was such a mess I wouldn’t even know where to begin, lol! And I certainly wasn’t able to spy on her activities via the computer, I barely knew how to turn the damn thing on. I’m saying unless parents are tech savvy now, kids can hide a lot that way…Myself, back in the caveman days? I hid any contraband (pills, a marijuana joint of dubious provenance, my birth control) in an old-fashioned gray metal lockbox, hidden under my bed along with the winter-clothing-boxes. I can’t remember anyone searching my room, but just in case, I locked up, however feebly, anything I didn’t want found.
Mainly because I think the wrong word is being used, ala snooping. I think the correct word probably would have been auditing. Something that is done occasionally to keep the kids big picture in mind, snap shots of their lives that would advance insight as to why they may have been acting oddly the week before , but would not or could not explain.
Secondly from my point of view, being raised as a Canadian in school. We were told various things by the teachers about having rights, privacy and so forth and would be treated as young adults. In truth, they should have had some lee emory type tell us in no certain terms, that until we turned 18, our asses were his to do as he pleased and that we had no expectation of the right of privacy at all.
A legal adult has rights , a minor has privileges granted or not by both the system and the parental units. A minor expecting privacy is like me expecting freedom of speech from my employer, parents and employers will differ in each approach but thats their right to choose, not mine.
Auditing tools are just that tools and some will use them appropriately and others wont, the reset will simply muddle through as they always have.
Firstly, there is a difference between “auditing” (keeping an eye on things and being a responsible parent) and spying (not peeking, not minor snooping but spying).
Second, if your school paid lip service to privacy, dignity etc, and didn’t follow it, they are liars. Better to have a Marine drill instructor, who at least respects you enough to tell you up front what the read deal is going to be. At least the DI is being honest with you. That honesty, in and of itself, is more respect than expecting people to swallow something they know is a lie. Kis are very good at detecting bullshit.
Finally, “we” talk a lot of stuff about kids learning to be honest, self reliant, how to make decisions, respect other people (their privacy included). How can anyone twist their face to say that, when they are routinely denied that themselves? Doesn’t that seem hypocritical? In effect the message is “you will respect those who have power over you, but you will never get any respect for yourself”. How do you teach honesty, when everything you do, proves that it means nothing and “you” will never be trusted anyway? How do you learn to make decisions, if you are never allowed to, ever? There is a huge difference between being an interested, responsible person and a power crazed control freak.
My parents had their rules, sure. They expected those rules to be followed, sure. Being bull headed, yes sometimes it came down to “my house my rules” - but only sometimes. I had a measure of privacy, but wasn’t given total carte blanche.
The analogy to a place of employment is different and does not fit. If I one day decided I didn’t like the rules at work, I can always quit. That makes a huge difference. So, there is a protection of my freedom of speech at work - I can choose to go elsewhere. I am not compelled to stay there. So yes, I am the one choosing - not my employer.
