I’m of the mind that for teenagers, privacy is as necessary for mental health as food and water are for physical health.
And, just as one can overeat or overdrink, one can have too much privacy. Also, different people have different needs for privacy, just as people need different intakes of calories in a given day. Each child should be given the level of privacy they need. (I know, I know, you’re all just waiting to say “Duh!” )
I know for a fact that I would be much more unbalanced mentally than I already am if I hadn’t had some quiet me-time.
As I recall, one of the Columbine shooters had the barrel of a sawed-off shotgun sitting in plain view on top of his dresser.
While I don’t agree with snooping through a child’s room just to snoop (there’s got to be SOME trust in the parent-child relationship), if there’s ANY suspicion at all that anything’s going wrong, you should check. It’s obvious that the parents of the Columbine kids basically abdicated their duties as parents. All they had to do was walk into their kid’s room, and none of this would have happened. All they had to do…but they didn’t. Maybe they thought their kid wouldn’t trust them anymore. And now their kids are dead, and were murderers to boot.
An extreme example, sure, but if a child’s safety is at risk, what good parent wouldn’t do anything they could to make sure they were fully informed?
my problem is not that my parents snoop in my room, but that my little sisters do, and they take whatever they want.
One of them keeps taking my cologne and today i flushed it down the toilet.
They also take the change from my wallet i. e. any coins or bills up to $5. They have also raided my parents’ wallets for chump change.
They have also taken some singles from 1963 ane a $5 note dated 1981 from my coin collection, and both always deny it.
Those two tell me that THEY CAN HAVE PRIVACY BUT I GET NONE!!
BTW i am moving by the end of march, i do not care what the nursing home is paying me, color me a deep, dark shade of GONE.
I think parents should definitely search the room meticulously if they think something’s wrong, and (relating to the Columbine example) always have a ‘quick check’- eg. just stick your head inside the door or walk from one end to the other. That may be the only way they’ll get an idea if something’s wrong, so if they don’t they’ll never know anything.
To the person who suggested telling the children to show them around: I think that’s a horrible idea! As someone said, if you found porn, love letters or any such thing it would be incredibly embarrasing, and also if they are concealing anything they’re not likely to walk up to the draw they’ve got a bag of cocaine in and go, ‘this is my stash of illegal drugs’. I say stick to what the general feeling has been, and only search to a large extent if you think something’s wrong.
Unfortunatley not. Society just tries to pretend they do by calling them ‘men’.
I have three kids under the age of 8 - I’m hoping to raise happy and responsible teenagers.
As far as snooping goes - the key is that parental intuition that something is awry. It is very easy to dismiss these intuitions, but so often when we look back on a situation, we recall that prickly feeling that something wasn’t right, but dismissed it at the time.
If everything is going well - and I mean, you truly have no intuitions about it, then you will probably have to give your kids the benefit of the doubt, but making sure all the while to be approachable. If you have that sinking feeling that things are not ok, it’s good to investigate those feelings and what was stated previously about looking around and just keeping an eye for things seems like a good idea.
I know I did things my parents didn’t know about, although overall I was pretty “square” as a teen.
I think any nosiness is ok. You don’t need a reason.
And it’s certainly fair if they know it’s coming. Also, they know they can get at anything of yours they want to. If you want something private, you have to convince the other party, just like at work, or between spouses, or at the Elks’ clubhouse.
I’d say that’s okay, IF said parental intuition is well conditioned. In other words, merely feeling that one should snoop isn’t enough. Rather, the intuition should be based on evidence – even if that evidence is just a subtle change for the worse in the child’s behavior.
I know a mother who once threw a fit upon discovering a cassette tape in their family library. The tape had a picture of an attractive woman on it’s cover, and so the mother immediately shrieked, “WHO IS THIS PORN STAR?!?!?” This was a bizarre reaction, since the woman in question was only visible from the shoulders up, and was clearly wearing a blouse. Nevertheless, the mother immediately launched a witch hunt.
As it turned out, the tape didn’t belong to any of her children. It belonged TO THE MOTHER HERSELF, and had been purchased twenty years ago. The mother had simply forgotten all about it.
This was a case wherein someone’s intuition was absolutely off-kilter. Intuition is a good thing – but only if it responds reasonably to reasonable evidence.
And since no one can objectively judge his own intuition (or rather, those who are least competent are also least aware of their own incompetence), I say it’s better to ignore it.
I don’t quite agree. That’s like saying we shouldn’t use our moral judgment – after all, the people who display poor moral judgment are often the least aware of their incompetence. The onus lies upon each person to exercise a modicum of care in exercising his or her intuition.
We need to make our decisions based on the cumulative data available. Sometimes, that means we should use our intuition – provided that this intuition is properly conditioned and grounded in evidence. If the evidence isn’t strong, then we can proceed cautiously, rather than ignoring intuition completely.
As a new poster, I hesitate to post here, but as a teenager with strong views on the subject, I can’t help but do so.
First of all, lighten up. I’m going to be perfectly honest. No matter what you think, your kids are most likely not smoking, drinking, or doing drugs. And if they are, you’re going to know, irregardless. Searching and snooping does nothing but violate trust between parent and child. As a teenager I know firsthand the effects of a mistrusting relationship between the two. No, not all relationships between children and their parents are ideal, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be.
Let me tell you something that you might either know, or be surprised of-- if your children DO find out that you HAVE snooped and searched through their belongings without their consent, your efforts will have an adverse effect. Your children will not only distrust you even more, but may actually develop the negative habits you were trying to prevent. At any rate, you’re going to damage the bond between parent and child and make your child or teen become even more secretive about their actions.
Disregarding the inherent rights of your children may actually INCITE them to adverse behavior, believe it or not.
Let’s use myself as an example. I’m a male, 16 years old. I live in an urban community with a large population. I do not smoke, drink, or do drugs. This does not mean I don’t know how to acquire them. My relationship with my parents is not perfect, but no one’s is. I respect my parents BECAUSE they respect me. I have certain rights and freedoms that I appreciate and I don’t abuse them because I know my parents would not wish for me to disrespect them. For example, I can use the telephone whenever I desire. I can use the internet whenever I desire. I have no internet restrictions, such as parental blocks, and my parents do not read my e-mail or listen in on my telephone conversations. I am generally allowed to be out as late as I wish, provided that I check in with them every so often. I take responsibility for my own actions. For example, if I stay out late and sleep-in the next day, missing school, my parents are fine with that because they know that I respect myself enough not to do so to begin with.
Both my father and my mother allow me to use their vehicles to go out, provided I request so in advance and they have no need of them. I can watch any television show or movie that I desire because my parents trust me. Children learn from themselves moreso than from their parents, but one thing they DO learn is trust. I have experimented with alcohol. I learned that it’s a terrible, terrible thing. Do you know that, had my parents snooped around and invaded my privacy, I may not have been so inclined to stop experimenting?
No, I’m not everyone’s child. I don’t claim to be. But here are just a few statistics, based on my community alone (I live in a fairly large city, in the northeastern part of the country). 1) Of the 400+ teenagers in my class (11th grade), I know of about 3 or 4 who are “troublemakers”. That being defined as, people who “party” (get “wasted,” drunk, smoke, traffic drugs, etc.) You know what the majority of the people I know think of these people? They’re losers. Idiots. And guess what, these people know that they are. They’re obviously into illicit behavior. Their parents would have no trouble picking them out. Neither would you all. Your children aren’t going to develop hideous problems. If your child is a troublemaker to begin with, your snooping and searching won’t stop anything.
Remember yourselves when you were younger. You probably experimented and tried only God knows what. But you stopped. And I’ll bet you that your parents had little or no involvement. You’re right, adolescence is a period of time where children need to develop a sense of individual. They need to find out who they are. A hint for all of you parents who insist that prying and snooping is necessary to maintain order-- don’t. If there’s a problem with your child, trust him or her to come to you with it. That’s assuming you have good enough communication to begin with. If you don’t, that’s probably a mixture of both of your faults. And do you know why communication isn’t good?
Because they don’t trust you.
I’m sorry if you disagree with my reasoning because, honestly, that’s how I grew up. That’s what I know. That’s what all of my friends know, too. That’s what my two twin sisters, age 11, are going to grow up knowing. Trust is a vital part of any relationship- between two people in love, or between a parent and a child. If you violate that trust, just be ready to take the consequences that come with breaking it.
I’ll be happy to continue this discussion, it’s a great topic of debate and I enjoyed writing my opinions. If you read through all of this… thanks.
Now, just allow me to get heated for a second because I really, REALLY got fumed at this.
Wrath said:
And just why the hell not? How does this justify as being reasonable? What’s your reasoning for this immoral, restrictive, suppressive behavior? I hope that, at least, you also don’t use bathroom locks in all fairness. Please, explain your reasoning on this.
I’m with Wrath. My 7 and 3 yo don’t get to lock doors either. It’s to do with motor development. If they went in there and locked it and couldn’t unlock it (and believe me, that’s totally feasible with my 7 yo), it would be necessary to take the door off the hinges. And surprisingly I do have different rules for myself and for my kids. As they get older, they get more freedom. Granted most of the rules are to do with property or with safety.
I’m the step parent of a 20 yo and all I can say, Civil Defender is that it looks very different from the other side of the equation…
First off, I just have to say “Damn Straight” to Civil Defense, you very elegantly basically what I wanted to say.
I think personally that the basic justification for searching the rooms of your children was stated early on by Jawofech(and probably others, but this statement struck me as being particularly concise)
And the answer to this statement is that no, having your children trust you is not more important to protecting them from dangerous situations- having your children trust is necessary if you want to protect them from dangerous situations. Quite simply put, if there is no trust between a parent and a child, then there is not going to be any significant communication on issues like, say, drugs, sex, problems with the law, the number 42 or pretty much anything- and without that communication there is no way for the parent to protect the child.
Remember, during the teen years what is being developed is autonomy, in other words the child in question is learning to function on their own. Now this does expose them to some risks, and that is why a parent must endeavor to maintain communication with their child- to do otherwise is to separate the child from the parents. (This, I believe, is the real danger. Parents, I’ve found, like to state the problem along the lines of being separated from their children, instead of children being separated from their parents, or in other words from the proper source of advice, counseling, and aid during adolescence. Whenever trust is lost between a child and a parent, the affect the parent has on the child becomes simply a matter of physical proximity- if your child does not trust you, they will not trust your advice, and if they do not trust your advice they will not follow it.
I’m reminded of many of the people I knew in high school who smoked. The majority of them had parents who smoked, and I sincerely doubt that those parents had encouraged the habit among their children. However, the people who saw their parents smoking and then proceeding to tell them not to smoke clearly(and sometimes outright state) that they simply disregarded the orders given to them by their parents. Why? It’s simple, they were being told the infamous parenting line “do as I say, not as I do.” Similarly parents who snoop are saying to their children “trust that what I tell you to do is in your best interests” while at the same time manifestly not showing any vestiges of trust in the children.
I believe that someone above(though I am too lazy to look up who) stated that at this point in a child’s life they are concerned primarily with instant gratification-with doing what is pleasurable- and not so much with long term consequences. The need for parenting is obvious given that situation, and the need for trust between parents and children also obvious(a child must trust in the parent to believe that what they are being told is for their own good- the second that is lost so is any hope of it being obeyed if the child thinks they can get away with disobeying it)
I suppose at this point I’m supposed to give personal examples of how my parents betrayed my trust in something and how it led me down to a life of crime and misery, but honestly that never happened. With the exception of a tendency to never know before entering my room my parents generally respected my privacy and didn’t, to the best of my knowledge of course, snoop through my possessions. Personally I feel this is one of the reasons I trusted them to be acting in my best interests on the few occasions when they intervened and forbade me to do something that I really wanted to do- now I’m not saying that my situation somehow concretely proves what I’ve said above (or that I am in any way normal, in fact in many ways I tend to eschew normality(it’s just not worth the effort)) but personally I don’t see how anyone can ask a child to trust them when they manifestly do not trust that child.
Interesting. I’ve never seen this phenomenon before. Perhaps you should teach your children how to work door knobs and locks, or get new locks. Many of the homes I’ve seen lately have inexpensive, simple locks with a small key used to unlock them from the outside. Privacy is a big issue for children, believe it or not, and starting to deny them that this early can lead to later problems.
Well yes, obviously certain rules are necessary to govern safety and well-being. At what age do you believe it’s necessary for a child to learn how to unlock a door?
Please don’t take offense to my reply, I’m merely trying to continue the discussion from a realistic point of view.
Oh, and I have no doubt things look much different from the other side. However, as most parents seem to forget, there are indeed two sides to view each ideology from. I’m pretty confident that, based on how much I know about teenage and child behaviors now, I will not soon forget how we feel-- even as a future parent.
Bravo, Initial Entry. Not only did you summarize my entire case with more brevity than I could ever dream, but you hit on several key points regarding trust between parent and child. Your points are well spoken, and I feel inclined to agree with what you said.
I really don’t see the debate here. It all depends case by case. Every parent-teen relationship is different and specific circumstances may arise that could give a reason for parents to “snoop.” Of course, if suicide, drugs, alcohol and other dangerous substances are involved that gives a green light to parents. If there is any physical or extreme emotional damage that could harm the teen is involved then it is parents’ DUTY to protect their son/daughter. In general though, going through your kids’ private possessions is UNACCEPTABLE and you will suffer the consequences. Trust is not given; it has to be earned!!
Well, in regards to checking a room for sharps and other items to possible kill oneself, I know that searching would be useless, since smart ones know not to write stuff down(evidence,as I call it), and SI-ers know how to use items like staples, scissors, rulers, staple removers, etc. to cut or cause inury. If you want to protect kids from that, you might as well just out them in a bare room, but even then they’ll start punching themselves until they bruise.
With crystal clarity I recall the time that I found my dad snooping in my room. It is enshrined in with the time that my dad told my brother that he was his favourite son in the Bad Blood Hall of Fame.
The notion that there ought not to be anything in your child’s room that they feel like hiding is, to be blunt, bullshit. Each and every one of you has personal papers and effects that reveal nothing shameful but which you do not care to let anyone else see. I have had such papers and effects since at least age 13.
Creating an air of suspicion, mistrust, and fear in your home - which is exactly what is engendered by search and seizure missions in your kid’s room - is what drives kids to crime, drug use, depression, and suicide, not what prevents it. I speak from experience (my own, my brother’s, and my roommates’).
My mother was a snooper. In fact, she still is. Everything from going through my room in search of paraphanalia (Which I never had) to reading my poetry/diary/notes to holding my mail up to the light to see whats in it. (she still does this whenever any of my mail is sent to her house. very odd.)
Her reasoning was always that she loved me and worried about me and wanted to know what was going on in my life. But ya know… after the first time she brought up a note I’d written to a friend about a cute boy in class (I was probably 10 or 11), I never -wanted- to share anything with her. And the more she pried, the more I hid. She would compliment poetry I hadnt let her read (She even let her FRIEND read through my poetry on my computer while I was sleep, oh was I ever pissed) and I just changed my style. I swore more in my writing. I wrote poems full of lies just to shock her. When she found pornography in my room (gasp Sheesh… I used to trace figures when I was learning to draw, I dont think Ive ever masturbated to a picture of a chick with fake plastic boobs in my whole life. Yuck) she confronted me about it and I adamantly DEFENDED the sex industry. My mother has become a devout and somewhat radical Christian and couldnt figure out why I felt the need to be a “deviant”.
I began to purchase CD’s I knew she wouldnt like… and to this day, if I listen to something my mother enjoys, I feel like she won. (Oh yeah, real mature for a twenty-something mother of a 6 yr old, Im sure)
I even wrote a suicide note and left it out where she could find it once. (I was 14 and vengeful.)
Her reasoning was wrong and it’s created a lifelong breech of trust. I love my mother dearly… she’s a wonderful woman in all other aspects… but to this day, I dont trust her and she’s done nothing to make feel any differently.
So is it okay to snoop through your kids’ things? Not without reason…
…There will probably come a day when I’ll get paranoid and check my sons room for c-4 and pipe bombs… just in case. But I hope it never comes to that.
I know that eventually my son will own a porno mag. I would NEVER bring it up to him. Jesus. How sick is that?! Once your parents know you masturbate, it loses all appeal.
If he comes home reeking of pot, I intend to talk to him about it. I also intend to be honest. Recreational every-so-often pot use is probably not going to ruin his life. I dont know many people who havent smoked pot at some point in their life. But I will explain the consequences of being caught with it… and what extended use -will- do to a brain.
If he has a knife, I will keep an extra eye out for ruffian friends or scars on his body that seem out of place. But I understand that kids want to look cool. I had a knife when I was younger. I never used it on anything but guttin’ fish… but it really does depend on circumstance.
I will express my discontent for partying and alcohol, but also my intention of always being there to pick him up when he or his friends are too drunk to drive. Sometimes you have to accept certain behavior in moderation because if you deny it, your child WILL end up drunk at a party somewhere, riding home with someone who would blow a .2 if given a breathalizer test.
Its not worth it to me. I’d rather maintain communication and understand that teenagers will be teenagers.
But if worse comes to worse and I -have- to go through his room… I would find ANY other reason to bring up evidence of a serious problem than “I found this while breaking your trust in me.”
Sometimes you just have to accept that your children dont want you to know everything about them.
I think its also incredibly important to realizing that instilling a good system of values doesnt start at 13 when you realize there’s a problem. Parents who feel this way do a terrible disservice to their children. By the time you have a teenager, they already KNOW right and wrong, they’re just a bit curious.
Sometimes you just have to let the little things go. Choose your battles wisely… and always, ALWAYS realize the consequence of your action.
Well the thing with privacy is that if you don’t have it, you go insane. And when you don’t have your own place and you’re living with your parents, your only domain is your room. If your parents decide to go through your stuff for kicks- be it stuff you’ve written, pornography, or music you don’t necessarily want them to find- then its really disconcerting. My parents don’t do that and I’m glad of it. It would freak me out of they did.
IMO, when they begin to look for drugs and all that great stuff, its different. They’re your parents and if they didn’t care enough to protect you, you’d be better off without them. If they don’t look out for you and basically protect you, who will? Its annoying, but I’m sure its also a benefit to have a parent who cares enough to risk their child getting upset.
There also should be a distinction between parents who do it out of paranoia and those who do it when they really need to. That is, parents should not go through your stuff at the drop of a hat, but in certain situation. Adults should use their judgement. If you go through the kid’s stuff every week, either your children have serious problems or there is a serious trust issue. If a parent rarely if ever “snoops” in order to give the child privacy, then when they do finally feel the need to, then i’m sure the child in question will be able to understand and forgive the parent.
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