Some reassurances please (a little long and self involveded)

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Some weeks ago, the SDMB was encountered with an interesting creature…the Panicked, Hysterical, Emotionally Crippled Jarbabyj, and I vowed she would never come back, as it made me look a) ignorant, b) childish and c) irresponsible.

However, PHECJarbabyj showed up at my house last night, wondering how I was reacting to the war starting…and I must say…she made a strong argument to reappear.

So, before I go down the spiral again (as I did last night, staying up until 3:00 watching the news)…perhaps more level headed, intelligent dopers can set me on the road to rights.

  1. When I hear the Taliban and Bin Laden are “fully prepared for holy war”, and they seem very calm and measured about it, I assume this means they have nuclear weapons that can level our country. I hear anecdotally that there are nuclear bombs that can fit in BRIEFCASES and flatten NYC. How can we ever prepare against that?

  2. When I hear that there are two cases of Anthrax in Florida right now, I assume this means we might ALL have Anthrax or it’s on it’s way up the coast. The Butcher at Jewel (who I know is not an expert) informed me that you wouldn’t know for two weeks if you had Anthrax, and that it could kill 100,000 in weeks and spreads faster than a cold. HOW can we prepare against THAT?

  3. When I hear that Iran and Iraq are now condemning our attacks (when I thought at least one of them was on our side two weeks ago), I assume that our coalition is falling apart and bin Laden’s is growing.

And finally, I have almost successfully convinced myself of this, but it would be nice to hear others feel the same. Can we quit calling people who are afraid to fly or afraid to go to the Hancock building “cowards”, “ridiculous”, “stupid” and my favorite “repulsively unpatriotic”? I am afraid. I’ve been mildly to severely afraid for a month or so, and it’s not letting up. The fact is, I’m 29, I’m thinking about having a baby soon, my husband had a big audition last week, my book is with an agent for the second round of edits, I lost 14 pounds, I just got medication to improve my mood and it’s working…consequently, I have no desire to die. I am in fact, AFRAID to die. I don’t care if it’s “my time”, or there’s “nothing I can do about it”. I DON’T WANT TO DIE.

I work in the shadow of the Hancock building in Chicago, in a high rise, in one of the most densely populated square miles in the country. And today I hear “100% of a retaliatory act”. Chicago looks like a pretty good place for it. So when you try to tell me that it’s “useless” to be afraid, I understand that. I am still afraid. When you tell me that being scared means they win…then count me among the casualties.

I’m not panicky yet…but when I see the Hancock go down, or my boss’ lungs turn to slush from a chemical attack, you can bet I’m going to be.

jarbaby

2

The Taliban is a bunch of ignorant goatherds. They’re not so much of a government as a Feudal panel. Their country is rubble, and had little infrastructure to begin with. Now it has less. They reaally don’t have much ability to wage war.

Most anybody with any skills or abilities or even the means of doing so has long left the country.

Iran and Irag are also depleted countries.

What we are dealing with is a lot of posturing with little to back it up.

We were asleep at the wheel for WTC, but I don’t think we’re sleeping anymore. Terrorists will find it very difficult to operate in this country.

A nuclear suitcase bomb isn’t something you can assemble out of camel dung and sand.

The reality is that we should fear no evil because we are the baddest motherfuckers in the valley, and the Lord gives us King Fu in the face of our enemies.

We are righteously pissed off and we are going to kick ass and effectively castrate Bin laden and the Taliban the way we did Hussein, Qaddafi, and even Arafat.

3

I’d give ya hug, but I would probably grope ya in the process.

  1. Calm? So they seem. But they constantly contradict themselves from one statement to the next. I have no doubt they thought they were prepared, but we didn’t react the way they anticipated. IMHO, they wanted us to immediatly launch the bombers and when we when didn’t it threw off their “plans”. Just as they started doubting a strike, we smack 'em. As for the suitcase bombs, bin Laden may be obsessed and a dozen other things, but he is not stupid.

  2. Everyone in the first victim’s family was tested and no one was infected. The owners of the comapny that both people worked for told them they might want to stay home while the place was tested. Anthrax is not contagious.

  3. Iran and Iraq condemn everything the US does and Saddam suspects he’s next after we get ObL.

Finally, a lot of people are scared, but you can’t let it beat you down. It’s unlikely that another hijacked plane will be used as a weapon because we’re looking for it and I’m willing to bet the security in your building and around that area is a lot tighter than it was a month ago.

Don’t let it get you down, Jess. Did you hear ObL’s little pre-recorded speech? He thinks we’re cowering and so he’s won.

Don’t let him beat you.

4

I know you’re definitely not the only one that’s afraid, as I too am afraid. I see no need to die just yet either, I’m only 17. That’s a little bit younger than I was planning on going. I have so many plans, and so much ahead of me, and I believe I’ll get to live it. I believe that we’re not going to die just yet.

And the thing is, everyone who says that you shouldn’t be afraid of flying, they all would piss their pants if they got on an airplane and noticed anyone of islamic descent. They’re just as scared as you (we) are.

And FUCK Bin Laden.

5

I’ll try to address each point with what I know.

  1. It’s real doubtful that the Taliban, Al Kayida, Bin Laden, et al have nuclear weapons. Afghanistan is an incredibly poor country, they just don’t have the money to sink into the development needed. Bin Laden is rich, but again, I doubt he has the scratch, time, or access to the technology needed. If someone else has a more definitive answer, I’ll defer to them, but personally, I’m more worried about being overrun by a gang of stick throwing monkeys.

  2. Anthrax is NOT contagious. It can be only caught by initial contact.

  3. Iran has given tacit support to our actions in the past. These latest denouncements are mainly to appease the hard-liners in their government, but they need to be taken with a grain of salt.

Iraq would denounce whatever action we took, short of us giving Saddam a billion dollars and composing a catchy little tune saying how swell he is.

  1. It’s reasonable to be frightened. The key is that you cannot allow that fear to run your life. You are born and you are going to die. If you fret away your time worrying about possibilities, you’re going to wake up realizing that you’ve wasted a large part of your life.

The only thing that can be done is make sure that you and your family are safe. Control what you can. You have to have some level of trust that others are doing all they can to make us all safer.

6

What has helped me is talking to my American Way of War prof. When he’s not a prof he’s a career Air Force guy and the author of a big book on Pearl Harbor. He’s been on the news a lot lately.

His comments have been alternatingly scary and comforting. The US depends on Reserves in every war, which means we lose a lot in the beginning. Americans hate death, hate long wars, and this is going to be one. We may even lose people, and while some other cultures can accept that, with our love of the individual, we have severe problems with it. This is not going to be fun.

However, This group is small potatos and the US is not. Yea, they can hide in caves and scream and kill 5,000 people with a few planes. It sucks, it hurts, its scary, but we have the ability and resources that they lack. They can pinch us and piss us off. We can and will slowly cut off their every ability to do anything until they give up and/or die.

It may not be fast, which is going to suck. But we are the big dog here and when its over we will be still standing and they will be gone.

7

It’s healthy to be concerned, maybe even a little worried, the same way you’d be worried if you were walking in a wild forest at night and you knew there were bats in the forest who love to get tangled in people’s hair.

Sure, there will be retaliation, and Americans will probably die. But 40,000 Americans die every year in car crashes, and we all still drive. You and those you care about will not be hurt. You’re more likely to win the lottery.

Your trend will continue, your book will be published and be a runaway bestseller, jarhubby will get the part, you and jarhubby will have a baby and name it Fiver, all will know you to be all that, a bag of chips and a cookie for dessert.

8

I haven’t researched this thoroughly so I may be speaking completely out of my ass here. But just in what I’ve been reading about the terrorists, bin Laden as trained by OUR CIA and the pilots were taught in AMERICAN flight training schools. In other words, they don’t have the ability or the resources on their own to develop anything as technologically sophisticated as a suitcase nuke, even if something like that did exist. So, I think the chances of that being true are very slim.

Besides, as I heard one wag say, Afghanistan is so backwards that you couldn’t possibly blast them into the Stone Age. Any blasting would send them forward into the Stone Age.

9

Honey, those camel jockeys don’t know how a light switch works, much less a nuclear device, even if it did fit in a briefcase, which it can’t. Nobody has that capability.

There was no technology involved in the WTC atrocity. They managed to swipe a few planes and turn them against us. We’re a lot more alert now.

Afghanistan has nothing. Their only exports are heroin and terrorism. Although they keep enough terrorism at home to use against their own.

These morons have underestimated America, and they’ll pay for it. It’ll take some time, but it will get done.

And that’s a fact.

Don’t you be worry.

10

Look, get jarHubby to drag you out for German food again, it worked last time…

No nuke yet build can fit into a briefcase. bin Laden, despite his rumored wealth, has nothing like the resources necessary for pulling-off the magical feat of building a “briefcase nuke”. The smallest one I know of is 51 pounds, and would fit into a large-ish suitcase, except that we dismantled them decades ago. No credible source has provided evidence that any extremist organization has anything even resembling a suitcase nuke. In fact, “suitcase nuke” was one of the boogey-men that the various “experts” were nattering on about two decades ago, and it is as much BS now, as it was then.

The cases of anthrax in Florida (One dead, one tested positive, and a building of a tabloid newspaper contaminated. How ironic!) are from an extraordinarilly rare airborn varient, and if you’ve been exposed, anti-biotics are the prescribed treatment. No big beal. I’d be more worried about influenza.

Iran and Iraq? Feh! They were never part of our “coalition”. Iraq is impotent in this matter, and Iran has been supplying anti-Taliban forces with food, weapons, and money for years. Again, no big deal.

Get thee away from the electronics, and take your anxieties out by jumping the jarHubby’s bones. You’ll feel much better, and so will he. Don’t turn on the TV again today.

11

jarbabyj, you’re still a young’n. You were only 18 or 19 and may not remember the “mother of all battles.” That was how Saddam was talking when America came to Iraq. That one took a week.

This is going to take a lot longer, but we’ll win because we’re a lot bigger than they are. Don’t listen to the Talliban or Osama. They can’t say, “Oops. We made a mistake with the Americans. Let’s turn ourselves in and hope for the best.” They’re not even going to have suicide bombers if they give their forces no hope at all of victory. So they’re talking big. They are politicians, and are lying, just like the politicians do here.

12
  1. Nuclear suitcase bombs are unlikely (though not impossible). This question is over in GQ, if someone else doesn’t answer it first, I’ll make an appearance over there in a bit. Not all calm, measured people have nuclear weapons. Look at me for insta… oh wait, strike and disregard that last part.
  2. While still deadly, you still have some misconception about Anthrax.
  3. I wouldn’t base any assessment on what the nations of Iran or Iraq are up to. It is bin Ladens goal to incite a holy war, but I feel the real sign of danger would be moderate states such as Egypt or Saudi Arabia turning on us.

Cheer up, girl. If this works, let me know and I’ll only bill you for ½ hour;)

13

First…could we please dispense with the racist, stereotyping terms? They are still people, good, bad or otherwise and racism is never an intelligent choice just because the United States has struck them and declares them an “enemy.”

Second…

Let’s stick to facts:

From the Online Encyclopedia:
Anthrax – acute infectious disease of animals that can be secondarily transmitted to humans. It is caused by a bacillus (Bacillus anthracis) that primarily affects sheep, horses, hogs, cattle, and goats and is almost always fatal in animals. Transmission to humans normally occurs through contact with infected animals but can also occur through breathing air laden with the spores of the bacilli.

Third…IMHO, I think some respectful fear is necessary. Sure, everyone’s trying to blow this off as a group of disorganized, nomads with little access to technology, but isn’t that what made us vulnerable to begin with? I’m not trying to support or feed JarbabyJ’s fears, but I doubt we’d be hitting airports and training camps with serious fire power if they didn’t have at least a chance at retaliation.

Before September 11th, no one would’ve expected (or imagined) that people from a technological “stone age” would turn America’s own commercial airplanes into bombs against Americans, their buildings and their seat of commerce. Underestimating them is just as unhealthy as fearfully overestimating them IMHO.

14

Look, when I said it’s not contagious, I meant that person to person spreading isn’t going to happen. And the only people likely to be harmed in a purposeful disbursion of Anthrax are the people who breath in the spores initially, or those who have initial contact.

[quote]

From the [CDC](http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/anthrax_g.htm#Can anthrax be spread from person-to-person)
**How is anthrax transmitted? **

Anthrax infection can occur in three forms: cutaneous (skin), inhalation, and gastrointestinal. B. anthracis spores can live in the soil for many years, and humans can become infected with anthrax by handling products from infected animals or by inhaling anthrax spores from contaminated animal products. Anthrax can also be spread by eating undercooked meat from infected animals. It is rare to find infected animals in the United States.

**Can anthrax be spread from person-to-person? **

Direct person-to-person spread of anthrax is extremely unlikely to occur. Communicability is not a concern in managing or visiting with patients with inhalational anthrax.
**

So, I suppose that there is a chance of it being contagious. But, if the CDC says it’s extremely unlikely, that’s good enough for me. Sheesh. :rolleyes:

15

You needn’t “Sheesh” and roll your eyes at me. I was merely trying to provide additional information. I could not tell from your brief post if by “initial contact” you meant with animals who have contracted it.

Also, remember, it was extremely unlikely that terrorists would hijack commercial jets and crash them into buildings in a busy city.

Besides which, the issue goes beyond person-to-person transfer in connection or discussion of the use of it in biological warfare. The latest article on the subject: FBI Probes Anthrax, Terror Link. You will notice they too quote the “extremely unlikely” and still there are two people from the same office that have contracted it, and the doctors have not determined yet how yet. “Unlikely” doesn’t mean “impossible.”

Sorry JarbabyJ – I hope this isn’t adding to your anxiety. I’m just trying to say let’s keep all facts in mind.

16

Jess hon, if this is a ploy to get me to bring you even more cool German goodies from my trip…it’s working!!!

I nderstand your nervousness, and wish I could reassure yu more or betterthan the previous posters, but know that this will pass, it is a tough time but we will be jsu fine. DO NO let this stop you in your life plans!!!

I will talk to you Thursday night.

THere, you gotone of my two posts aus Deutschland…doesn’t tat count for something:)
(if I could beg a mod to correct the typing, myinternet connection here sucksad Idont know how long I will be able to be on…THanks so much)

17

Please note that the second person did not actually contract anthrax

http://www.cnn.com/2001/HEALTH/10/08/florida.anthrax.case/index.html

18

jarbabyj, I don’t have reassurance for you. It’s a sad, scary, complicated world. But I’m encouraged by your email, because you’ve realized that LIFE. IS. GREAT. Life is a fantastic gift, to be lived and enjoyed to the fullest. And you’ve gone from “girl who gets depressed for no good reason” to “girl who understands how precious life is and who is happy just to live it and love the people around her.” That’s a fantastic journey for you to make. Hold onto that “life is precious and I am so very lucky” feeling, and pray or do whatever you do to deal with the bad stuff.

Much love,
Jen

19

I can’t think of a way to say this without sounding insensitive to the victims of the 9/11 terrorism attacks, so I apologize in advance for that. But I think it’s important to point this out.

Jarbaby, it’s very difficult to do a lot of damage to our country. And we’re pretty well prepared. Take the World Trade Center. We focus, properly, on the horrible toll of lives lost and on the property damage and the anguish of the rescue workers.

But consider this. The Trade Center, during the day, may be among the most densely populated places on earth, much like the area around the Hancock building. The terrorists hit the complex with two fully fueled aircraft and completely destroyed about 10 buildings. It was the worst terrorist attack in history. Here’s the amazing part: depending on how you count it, something like 50,000 people escaped from that. A person working at the Trade Center had close to a 90% chance of living. People across the street, at the World Financial Center which is so badly damaged that it will apparently be a year before it can be reoccupied, escaped. All the people at 7 WTC, which collapsed, escaped.

The terrorists will strike again – I’m afraid I can’t reassure you that they won’t. But we’re ready for them.

20

AAAaaah! Turn it off, turn it off, TURN IT OFF!!!

Fortunately, I don’t have cable, and CBC has managed to (mostly) avoid the hysteria.

Too many of those programs masquerading as news are hysterical scaremongering to those who Haven’t Got It Yet. Or pandering to the Prophets Of Doom, who are just tickled pink that they’re getting so much attention. (How do I know, not having cable - many of my friends and family are not similarly enlightened/poor.)

Watch your best unbiased six o’clock news, for NO MORE THAN AN HOUR, then go watch…unnnh…something else. Like Ancient Mysteries/Prophecies, so you can laugh yourself sick at some of the bad science. Or better yet, HOCKEY! (Go Flames!)

We care about you, please keep getting better. And please avoid those frothing lunatics on the boob tube. As demonstrated, they are Not Good For You.