Song of Ice and Fire - Jon (*SPOILERS* for Game of Thrones!!)

The Targaryens are often said to have a similar look (silver hair, purple eyes, I believe). Jon has never been described that way. With the big deal that Baratheon + Lannister = brown hair, would Stark + Targaryen = Stark-like qualities? The supposed long-lost Targaryen was made to dye his hair.

So while R+L=J makes a lot of sense plot-wise, the whole hair color thing has been such a big deal that I wonder if Jon really could be a Targaryen without looking like one. And hey, if he survives and is one, it’s not like he can’t marry Dany anyway (one of my ideas as to how the series might end to unify Westeros).

The PURE Targaryens keep that look, not the ones who intermarry. Jon has been described as looking a lot like Arya, Arya has been described as looking a lot like Lyanna…

King Robert has Targaryen blood, for instance.

Plus, the new theory kicking around the fan sites is that young griff is actually Illyrio’s son.

Illyrio and a Blackfyre female.

Was she definitely a Blackfyre? I remember her having silver hair, anything that specifically ties her to the pretenders other than the hair? I thought that silver hair was uncommon, but not solely exclusive to Targs. Doesn’t Jorah get a silver haired whore in Volantis?

[ul]
[li]The Golden Company, which was founded by a Blackfyre, supports Aegon.[/li][li]We’re told that the male line died out, which implies that there are female Blackfyres.[/li][li]There is some story in AFFC where a black targ sign falls into some water and is washed up later, rusted red. A black dragon is the Blackfyre sigil and a red one is the Targaryen. This would symbolize Aegon, a Blackfyre, coming across water and claiming to be a Targaryen.[/li][/ul]

I don’t recall specifics about the wife other than she had a vaguely Targ look, but these support the idea in general, which requires her to be a Blackfyre.

Absolutely nothing is “definite” in this discussion really, but there are plenty of reasons to think she was.

If R+L=J, he’s still a bastard though, so not really an heir. Although his Mother being high-born makes him a bit more socially acceptable than the average Bastard, he’s still not heir material, is he?

Kings can legitimize bastards like Joffrey did for Ramsay or Robb for Jon.

The main lesson of the whole series is that power derives from where other men think the power lies. Being bastard born will be an objection only to those who would be against Jon for other reasons. Those that would want to support him will overlook it.

Maybe not, but it does make him a contender for one of Dany’s other two dragons and could lead to a reconciliation between the families, plus the symmetry of having another Stark bend the knee to a Targaryen.

I haven’t been watching the show, but it really doesn’t make sense for Jon to be anybody but Rhaegar and Lyanna’s son - why on earth would some of the Kingsguard have left Rhaegar and Aerys during the war to evidently guard the dying (obviously in childbirth) Lyanna Stark?

Did Robb actually legitimize Jon? Or was that something he planned to do before the Red Wedding happened? I know Stannis offered to legitimize him, to sweeten the deal for control of the Night Watch, but don’t remember if he actually did before he rode for Winterfell (not that he could legitimately legitimize until his claim to the throne was realized).

He did, he sent two of his banner men off with the papers before the Red Wedding.

Speaking of the dragons, Jon is a warg, who knows what might happen when/if he runs in to one of Dany’s dragons.
An adult, live dragon, under your complete control is all the legitimacy you need.

Ooh! Dragon Warg! Whata prospect. . .

We hear that Ashara Dayne jumped from a tower into the sea. Does anybody mention having recovered her body? What if she’s off in Pentos raising her/Ned’s son?

It may be called the Narrow Sea, but it’s still awfully wide to swim…

It totally sailed over my head on first read, sounded like a fan-wank when I first heard it, then on watching the show it seemed plausible, and on going back and reading the passages in question, it seems all but proven. R+L=J. I don’t see any other theory that makes as much sense.

BUT with that said, I also don’t expect it to ever matter, or perhaps ever even become known to Jon or the world at large within the story. I think it’s something GRRM planted in the backstory, but has no need to call upon in the “present day”. Jon has proven himself to be who he is regardless of who his parents were. He will die (or has already died, though I doubt that highly) thinking himself Ned’s bastard fathered on an unknown woman.

We know that a Red Priest can restore life to the dead. And we know that Melisandre can do things at the Wall that she couldn’t do elsewhere. . .sooooo. . . .