To the SEALs here, is Marcinko correct in saying his men need to bench press 500 pounds to be able to scale rope ladders at sea, bearing nearly 100 pounds of equipment? Just wondering about muscle involved and that kind of stuff.
In light of recent posts, I would like to make it clear that the post above does not reflect the actual views of the poster, and any similarity to any previous post, dead or alive, real or fictional, is purely coincidental.
Give me a fucking break. What the hell sort of magical liberal douchebag bubble do you live in that anything anyone has said in this thread is shocking?
Oh my god, someone thinks the physiological differences between men and women is relevant for a group that only takes exceptional, elite people of certain strength and endurance ratios. GOD IT’S LIKE THEY’RE HOLOCAUST DENYING AND PRO SLAVERY, I DON’T KNOW HOW I LIVE IN THE SAME WORLD AS THEM.
You forgot to add an important finishing touch to this sentence:
“Oh my god, someone thinks the physiological differences between men and women is relevant for a group that only takes exceptional, elite people of certain strength and endurance ratios” [because if they are able to pass the physical tests and basic training exactly as they are designed in order to select such exceptional people it shouldn’t matter what sex they are. Hah! Sure, the members of this group; their trainers, commanders, and brass who, unlike me, actually have a fucking clue what they are talking about, believe there are female soldiers who will do just that. But I refuse to accept this because…?]
What’re the actual quotes of the people who say that females would qualify? Are they talking about the rudimentary tests to qualify for BUD/S? Those are far less than you’d actually need to go through BUD/S.
The Marines are apparently trying to get a female infantry officer to qualify and so far have been unable. That’s a far, far lesser challenge than becoming a SEAL.
You might start with post 92 in this thread.
Incidentally the top commander of all US special ops has been lobbying to allow females to apply to SEALs for at least 2 years (whether or not they can meet the physical requirements - in this case he wanted female SEALs because of the unique skills they would offer)
"A Navy SEAL himself, Admiral Eric T. Olson said at the opening session of the 2011 Aspen Security Forum that he would like to see female SEALs in combat roles.
“As soon as policy permits it, we’ll be ready to go down that road,” said Olson.
But in the meantime the order Panetta and Dempsey signed prohibits physical standards from being lowered to allow women to qualify. The fact that they are opening eligibility to women without lowering standards indicates that they anticipate some women will qualify.
As has already been pointed out several times in this thread the marine infantry officer program is too new to indicate anything about anything. It might take more than a month or two for the first female infantry officers to emerge.
Crazyhorse, you never answered my question. Why do you keep engaging the brick wall?
If they don’t lower the standards, and women pass, I’d be truly impressed. I’ll be keeping an eye on it. I just think it’s unlikely.
Even the people who are apparently on the other side of this from me posit that there might be 1-3 women who could manage it. We’re not exactly that far apart.
Drewtwo, you’re really trying too hard. What evidence have I shown of being a brick wall? I’m actually one of the posters on this board who has changed their minds on big, serious issues more than once. Your characterization of me is laughable. You have no idea what the fuck you’re talking about. The irony is that most of the things you try to say of me are true of you. You’ve failed to make any argument at all and you only drop by the thread to make unsubstantiated insults.
SenorBeef, I’m really curious as to why he (or anyone for that matter) keeps engaging you. Sorry this pisses you off.
Not at all. You’re easy to brush aside. I’ve shown none of the traits you’ve ascribed to me, nor have you made an argument yourself or refuted any of my arguments. You are doing nothing but occasionally dropping by to snipe me with inaccurate insults. You’re hurting yourself much more than you’re doing anything to me.
Unlike the OP who is just a trolling drunkard, and several he-man armchair warriors we have who will drop into any thread like this, I actually think SenorBeef is open to reasonable argument - or at least I am open to presenting one to him despite the entire thread being little more than troll bait (since this is after all a forgone conclusion and all any of us need to do is let time tell how it turns out).
I might question why any of us are participating at all, but where else can we mix up some reasonable arguments with some drive by insults and trolling? That’s why I love the Pit.
http://www.mca-marines.org/gazette/article/get-over-it-we-are-not-all-created-equal
She (Capt Katie Petronio) does a fine job making your point.
I do believe in letting anyone try but as she says we already eliminate people based on height, vision, other factors one cannot control. I do not find one woman’s experience as a template for all women, in the end only allowing those that want to try will bring an end to this. I do fear what others expressed, a lowering of standards once the attrition rates become an embarrassment but I have been gladly proven wrong many times in my life!
Strange, the last one I had was a woman as well - strange because it isn’t common, not because women can’t do the job. Guess since women will touch poop, all barriers are down. Now, when my father changes a diaper, call me, and we will start working on the ERA again.
As noted the order not to change standards is signed and approved, but even if they did offer gender-specific standards why would that really be such a bad thing?
I shortened the quote from Admiral Olsen for brevity and because we are already at a point the decision has been made not to lower standards, but the entire quote from 2011 is:
As an aside I do think when females are given equal access to combat roles and special ops, they should also be required to register for the draft at age 18 - equal means equal.
Oh you give him way more benefit of the doubt than I do. The only poster I used to feel that way about was Bricker, boy did I have some egg on my face! But yeah I love the pit for the same reasons 
Your arguments have been quite good. There’s literally nothing I can add.
Been there.
That’s not why you have nothing to add. You have no substance. No insight. Ironically, no ability to honestly evaluate oppositional arguments.
I didn’t think that sounded right…according to this story from 2012, they’ve already lost 2 who tried:
No, IOC isn’t as hard as BUDS, but from what I gleaned from my platoon commanders, it’s still pretty fucking hard. Like, humping an 81mm mortar tube 20 miles…on top of the standard gear load. I’m pretty sure I couldn’t do it.
Unless you’re going to argue that no men drop out of the program, I don’t see what your point is.
I work as a wildlife interpreter in the herpetology department at a recreational park/zoo. I’ve had equal numbers of women and men turn jelly-legged and pale when I bring out the snakes for lectures. It’s true that social conditioning by sexist bastards like yourself encourage young girls to display fear and disgust when confronted with certain stimuli, but women who have had the good fortune to avoid your type show no prejudice against snakes.
Oddly, when providing first aid for the numerous boo-boos incurred on the mountain biking trail, men are far more squeamish when it comes to the sight of blood and I’ve yet to treat a woman’s scrapes, scratches, or cuts because they handle those fine by themselves. The men, though, come limping, whimpering and averting their eyes from the sight of the red stuff. Interestingly, 92% of nurses are women, but that isn’t because men are weak pussies who can’t handle the sight of wounds and blood. It does mean, however, that women often handle bloody wounds as a matter of routine.
Women probably handle the lion’s share of diapers, including, probably, your unfortunate mother. Unless she left you to stew in your own shit for hours on end until your father came home which might explain your attitude.
Women have been handling the lion’s share of cooking, too, for quite some time, including butchering and disemboweling meat in the kitchen sink. Fish guts, turkey gizzards, Spam…it’s all the same. No biggie.
You’ve got us there. Most women are probably a little more selective than you, and likely have a wider range of choices, too. Although your statement here implies that you are willing to fuck everything, but Everything called and she said “umm…no.”
700+ women die in childbirth each year in the US. How many men take on procreation with that kind of risk?
We can’t do it alone, though. I suspect you have extensive experience testing that fact, dontcha?