Stay at Home Fathers, your opinions

You know, it’s kind of weird, but I think I see SAHDs (in the abstract) better than I see SAHMs. I think I have a subconscious view of SAHMs as women who make themselves subservient to men and to family life. On the other hand, I think it makes perfect sense to have a parent stay home, at least for the early years of a kid’s life, especially if it works out financially. I have less of a barrier approving of a SAHD. Which is probably a good thing, since I suspect, if/when we have a family, my boyfriend and I will probably decide to have him do the SAHD thing for a while.

Note: all of the above negative statements about SAHMs are prejudices and silly stereotypes which I am working to get over.

Well, I’m glad to see that you’re working to get over it, Helen’s; for a minute there I thought you were Suspenderzzz raised from the dead… :stuck_out_tongue:

I think SAHDs are great; the guys I’ve known have been good guys. My BIL almost did it, and I thought he would be very good at it. Their job situation worked out differently than they thought it would, so it didn’t happen.

As a SAHM I can say that I am never bored, and have way too much to do. I can’t really imagine ever being bored–as above, only boring people get bored. I have plenty to do, and can think of lots more.

You don’t have to be bored. Schools and lots of other organizations are eager for volunteers. I know that my kids’ school has enough volunteer opportunities to keep anyone occupied full time, if they care to be. I was laid off for a few months last year and that’s what I did.

I planned on being one. I was set to stay at home from July until the baby was born in August and then stay at home through my last year of college instead of working and going to school. Just this week, I was offered a 3rd shift job (which I took) because the Mrs. works 2nd and I go to school in the mornings. When I graduate college next year, and we move back home (or toward it) then I might stay at home if we can figure out a way to make that work.

Brendon Small

Bored? You gotta be kidding. The day is not long enough to get the whole thing done. And in the unlikely that you get a minute to yourself, it is the most welcome thing on earth. I have a stack of books to read, the internet to surf, TV to veg out, recipes to explore, and heck, even a window to look out. And then there is the kids. Just pick one out from care and enjoy the day!

My father was diagnosed with Parkinson’s Disease around the same time I was born 26 years ago, and he was retired (as “disabled”) by the time I was in kindergarten (and my eldest sister was in high school and my two other siblings were middle-schoolish age). My mom went to work, and my father stayed home. I think it was great. He and I were incredibly close. He was my assistant Girl Scout leader and soccer coach, we went to punk rock shows and poetry readings together, and I feel incredibly lucky that I got to know him so well before his PD became advanced, which helps me in times when I’m angry that I never had the healthy, normal father my siblings had. By the time I was in high school, my mom started working from home, so I had two full-time parents after my siblings had all moved out. So, while it didn’t necessarily seem it at the time (two parents always around, what a drag), I was incredibly lucky.

Eh, so, to make that paragraph into an opinion, I think stay at home dad’s rock, if you can afford it. But, then again, stay at home moms rock too. It all depends on what the couple wants, and I’m glad it’s no longer naturally assumed that it’s the woman who will stay home.

One thing that strikes me about the ‘boring’ thing; it seems to me that people who can’t figure out what they would do all day are saying that they need someone else to tell them what to do all the time, or they don’t know what to do with themselves. Being a SAHP is a very self-directed job; I write my own job description, and it includes whatever I can fit in. I don’t need a boss to tell me what to do; I have plenty of ideas myself.

Also, in the “how they afford it” area: we may live in a smaller house, or an area where housing prices aren’t so high. We don’t eat out too much (easier, since I’m at home to cook–at least sometimes when I’m not running around), I don’t have an expensive work wardrobe or child-care costs, and we do a lot of things ourselves that WOHPs might pay for, such as housecleaning, yard care, etc. We live on a budget. And most SAHPs I know earn some money in one way or another with part-time work of all sorts. (I got one SAHD buddy of mine to build me a beautiful arbor!)

I know that many people assume that SAHMs are all quite well-off, but that is not true; most of the single-income families I know are on tight budgets, but they feel that it is most important to be home, so they arrange their lives accordingly. It’s not a luxury lifestyle by any means.

Actually Helen’s Eidolon raises an important issue - I too am skeptical of SAHM, and look how I raved at dads! I have always said that SAHM are fine, if they ask themselves the three questions below and have good answers (the problem is that most SAHMs I know DON’T have good answers):

  1. Are you ensuring that you will have job skills (or sufficient savings/insurance) so that you can guarantee financial security for your children if something happens to your husband and he can’t or won’t work to support your family anymore? (And I hate the answer “oh yes, I’m keeping my organizational skills up by managing Johnny’s piano lessons and Cindy’s ballet class while making sure Jimmy gets to the Y for swimming and everyone makes their own beds and helps with dinner!” Gimme a break, that’s nice, but managing a Fortune 500 company it ain’t.)

  2. Are you providing a non-sexist role model for your children, or are you reinforcing the idea that daddy works, mommy cleans?

  3. Are you contributing to the larger world in some way? (And “yes, I’m raising my children to be good citizens!” is NOT an acceptable answer: working parents are supposed to do that as well. You don’t get special credit for being unemployed. And anyway, how conceited is it to think that YOUR children are Og’s gift to society? Do some volunteer work, and/or donate a lot of money to a worthy cause or something.)

So SAHD are automatically in good shape for question 2. Questions 1 and 3 should be asked by all stay-at-home parents (and working parents too I suppose).

Where’s Rue De Day? He did the SAHD gig for a few years and wrote some really funny posts about it.

I took two years off when my eldest daughter was born. it just worked out that way. My wife wasn’t working either. It was great and I’m closer in some ways with my eldest because of that experience. When the twins were born, my work was a lot different and with 3 little mouths to feed, taking time off in prime earning years is a lot harder.

During my 2 years, I spent at least 4 hours a day 1:1 with my daughter. I cooked a lot, etc. Not your traditional SAHD but if it works out I’d highly recommend it.

One of the evident consequences we saw when Middlebro started dating his now-wife was that she’d be making more money than him, in due time. Also, due to the way the Spanish medical system works, it’s always been evident that if she had to move somewhere because of her career, he’d raise stakes and follow.

'twas kind of cute when they finally realized it too. Neither of them had any kind of problem with it.

It’s never come to happen, but he would have been happy to be a SAHD if it came to that. Heck, he’d be happy to dump his job right now if his home hadn’t been invaded by aliens, ehm, I mean, by in-laws (long story that I’m not going to repeat). Trying to fight his MiL for propietorship of the kitchen would be a too-bloody, losing battle; SiL’s had enough problems remembering her mother that “this is MY house, not yours.”

A few years ago, an engineer from the US spent a year at the factory where I worked, in Spain. When she got the offer for the job she was a bit stunned, what do I do with the kids (1yo and 3yo)? Her husband saw the solution right away: “I come with you, of course! We all do!” He’s a plumber, so he knew he’d have no problem getting a job when they returned. Everybody in the factory thought it was a helluva idea.

Questions one and two are valid, but question three? Definitely not. Volunteer work? Where’s the time for that? Donate money? Not easy on a single income. I think that raising a child to be a good citizen is a perfectly good answer to an insulting question.

In my book, someone who spends their days teaching and caring for children, whether as a stay-at-home parent, a childcare worker, or a teacher is doing a lot more for the greater good than a receptionist at a TV station, a candy store clerk, or a file clerk at a construction company. (These are all jobs that I’ve had, just so no one thinks I’m slighting their work.) Having paid work does not always equal “contributing to the larger world” in a good way. Sometimes it just means shilling crap.

My contribution to the world is showing the world that you can live without more more more money. That good enough is enough. That this is not a competition. That once you are happy, you can leave things alone and enjoy.

I never wanted to stay home with the children. I did a lot of babysitting, sitting with very small infants, or older children, or god help me, both at once, and it was not something that I wanted to do full time. I had the skills and could care for children, and I was even good at it, but it was stressful and demanding and icky and the pay sucks. At the same time I know that I hated being in daycare as a child. There were times my mother worked and times she did not, and I liked staying at home a lot better than day care. She even found one or two daycares over the years that I will admit were good, but still I hated it. I vowed not to have children if I had to put them in daycare. I new this is easier said than done. I was willing to forgo having children if I could not find a partner who would stay at home with my children. I like sex and even the best birth control fails occasionally, so when I met my husband, I was fairly pleased that I found someone that wanted to stay at home raising children and through no fault of mine was at best infertile. Sucks to be him, but I loved him and it suited my plans.

So we went through our twenties child free. I always made more than he did working, and as the years went on, made even more. We had credit card debt that we were paying down (debts accrued mostly during college or during bouts of him being very ill), so we were not living on the full potential of our current incomes. As the cards got closer to getting paid off, he became more anxious to have children. So, at his urging, I looked for potential fathers. Quite a switch after more than ten years of monogamy, but he very much wanted me to try that route. I did and to our surprise found someone that was not just passing through. I fell in love with KellyM and she moved in.

Although she believed that she would still be fertile when we first met, before we could bank sperm, (due to snowstorms, and other issues) the hormones kicked in full force and our understanding was that it would no longer be possible. To our surprise and delight, long after we thought the possibility had expired, she got me pregnant. My husband stayed home with our baby and all is well. He now is also disabled, something we were not counting on, but so far he can still care for our daughter. I am having a boy next week too!

As far as affording it, the disability question makes it moot, he has to stay home. Also, now that we have most of our credit card debt paid off, and I have a better job, our income is something we can live on. We do have two household incomes, but KellyM has her own debts and financial obligations, so it is not like we have two clear incomes. The key for making it work for us was waiting until we could afford it. I had my first child at 34, and that was 4 years ago. Had I been 24, I don’t know what we would have done.

I’m a work-at-home Dad. My company has allowed me to telecommute since 9/11, and I’m having the pleasure of watching my kids grow up to a much greater degree than I did when I worked in an office.

I wouldn’t trade it for anything in the world.

I fully understand that, but it doesn’t always seem to be something that every parent thinks of when taking on a SAH role. I’ve seen parents who were overburdened by their kids’ schedules (which sometimes the kids did not volunteer to take on), and others who run out of things to do once their kids are in school full time and become isolated from the world because of a lack of proactive measures to do things like volunteer or form new hobbies to keep them occupied. It seems to be a matter of how many household duties are created via how many kids and how busy their schedules are. One SAHP with one child that has few extracurricular activities is certainly not going to have as much to do in household duties as someone with four or more kids with multiple extracurricular activities, so the time crunch is definitely tailored to the individual’s situation.

I think it’s definitely worth trying as long as the person still has some attachment to the world outside of their children via having adult friends, volunteering, or just being able to get some “adult time” outside of the house on a regular basis. Makes the adjustment to the eventual empty nest a little easier, no?

Isolation is not limited to stay at home parents.

That’s all well and good, but it’s not actually your business to judge whether or not SAHMs are worthy. I actually agree with your first two points and “qualify” for your approval, but your presumption that you get to tell me whether or not I’m a good person is inappropriate. It’s none of your business what I’m doing with my choices, and I don’t need to pass an exam, any more than a child-free woman needs to justify herself to people for her choices.

It’s good to know you’re here to pass judgment from up on high on those who choose to spend weekdays taking care of their children. It’s the Solomon-like wisdom of divinely inspired oracles such as yourself that gives me peace of mind in this crazy world we live in.

Note that I said that working parents should also ask themselves whether they are contributing to the world. While candy store clerks the world over may be offended by your comment, I agree with your larger point that “in the workforce” does not equate to “contributing to the world.”

However, I refuse to accept that stay at home moms/dads get a pass on this. Either you believe human beings have a moral obligation to think of something besides themselves or you don’t. If you think there is no such obligation, we’re so far apart I won’t even try to argue with you. But if you agree with me that we should think beyond our selfish horizons and do our best to leave the world a better place, then I think you have an awful lot of explaining to do if you want to make a cogent case for the idea that staying home with kids is intrinsically making a contribution to the world. Having kids puts pressure on the earth’s limited resources. You have no idea whether your child is going to grow up to solve global warming or become a serial killer. Sure, you’re going to strive for the former not the latter, but guess what – so do working parents!!!

Taking good care of your kiddies once you’ve produced them (accidently or on purpose) is an obligation. You don’t deserve special credit for it.