Re: the neice hugging your leg and not wanting you to leave part…
I worked as a ‘teacher’s aide’ in a primary school for three years in college - from K3-to 2nd graders.
The “clingy” kids fell into a few categories:
About 60% or so - more than half of them - would “cling” and whine and cry and wail until their parents were out of sight, and then a few sniffles later, they were the life of the party. I never would have believed it until I saw it day after day. It was unreal. The parents would be so worried, and we’d tell them to peek in a window, and they couldn’t believe that their horribly traumatized kid was happily playing with blocks or dolls less than 5 minutes later.
Maybe 20-25% or so - These were the “it depends on the parent/adult dropping them off” kids. Daddy drops them off - it was like strangers stealing them off into permanent exile. “NooO!!! Daaadddyyyyeleventy1!111” Mom drops them off? Eh, whatever. “Mom? What mom? I have toys!” Either way, these usually also settled down whenever the adult was out of sight.
A few of the ones in this category had grandparents or aunts/uncles dropping them off irregularly, and for most of the kids, it seemed like a good chance to try and see what they were made of - ie “if I pitch a big enough fit, Gramma won’t make me go to school, and we’ll have icecream and go to the park instead, because that’s what we did the last time.” Kids are smart that way.
And here’s the tiny minority - these kids are the ones who really are clingy and not interested in social stuff. They leave off mom, cry for quite a while, and then either find a bigger/older/dominant kid to glue themselves to, or they glue themselves to one of the caregivers, and mostly watch everything with big eyes. It’s a little sad, but being so close to the caregiver does have it’s benefits, and I do think they end up benefitting from the attention.
I don’t know which category your niece falls into, but chances are as soon as you’re out of sight, she’s in a much better state than you are. She’s too little to think about things deeply, so as soon as she’s distracted, she’s not going to be worrying about it.
All of this is assuming a good environment for the school, and since mom wants to save her daughter’s space there, I am hoping that means that it is.
That’s actually the best way to handle a baby when you’re taking care of a toddler at the same time. That way you don’t have to deal with a baby shrieking while you’re trying to play with the toddler.
What really worked well with my son was to make my person accessible to both kids at the same time. I would strap my daughter to my chest in a sling and sit on the floor and play with my son or let him climb onto whatever free space in my lap he could. It kind of sucked for me having two kids climb on me like I was a jungle gym, but it was worth it.
Generally, I tried really hard never to limit my son’s access to me and his activities based on his sister’s needs. Sometimes it was unavoidable, but I wouldn’t tell him we couldn’t go to the park because I had his sister - I’d just take them both and bring a blanket. Maybe your sister could use some tips on managing them both at once? It’s hard to internalize that you’re still just as mobile with two as you were with one - it just takes a bit more planning.
My SIL, sibling and I both work in the city that is a 30 minute commute from our shared town. It would be silly for SIL to take niece to care with the baby in the car and pick her up for 2 hours of driving when we make the drive anyway.
Speaking generally, I’d also like to offer a little insight my mother gave me when I became the mother of two. And that is, the older one is just going to have to get used to getting a little less attention. That’s just the way it is. She’s not being abandoned. She’s not being neglected in favor of the shiny new baby. She’s become an older sibling, and when that happens you get a little less of Mommy’s attention and you start coping with The Way the World Works Now. Though not a life skill that we expect toddlers to grasp and incorporate immediately, it is nonetheless an actual truth — and if it is dosed out to people beginning when they’re toddlers gaining older-sibling status, they’re more able to cope with similar situations as a 4-year-old. And in Kindergarten. And fifth grade. Etc.
This. I can see how it would be infinitely more interesting for the 2yo to be playing with friends her age, learning to socialize, learning her colors and numbers, etc. instead of being stuck home with the boring new baby. And I can see how mom could need the time to rest, given that 2yo’s are notoriously needy and active. And, since toddlers usually nap after lunch for at least two hours, then get up and have diaper changes/snack time/go out and play, it makes sense that mom would wait until 4 pm to pick her up - the alternative would be to get her before lunch, which is not much of a break for mom at all. It works out better from a scheduling view. But I do think that 5 days per week is excessive, 2-3 days would be more like it for me.
Wait wait wait. So every kid in daycare feels rejected and cast off? I don’t think so. My kids were in a wonderful daycare, and they loved it there, and they loved being at home too. There’s nothing wrong with having more adults in a child’s life than just parents to love and care for them.
YOU may think that this particular mother is rejecting her child, because you don’t think that the situation warrants the daycare. But that doesn’t mean that’s what the child feels.
I would never dream of judging someone’s parenting style (except my own parents) and I think daycare is actually pretty good for the socialization aspect of kids. I don’t think it’s a problem and i think you should not only grit your teeth and agree but do it with a smile - she’s your niece, and if you really are advocating for her, you give her whatever love you can.
Your niece is being sent to a safe environment where she is known and well cared for so her mother can cope with the new baby.
You’re not advocating, your judging. Perhaps your brother pushed your SIL to have a second baby. Perhaps she thought it would be great and that had #2 and is miserable. Perhaps she’s not healing well from her c-section despite being medically cleared. I had mine almost 8 months ago and I still have pain in the area which is worse when I’m tired or fatigued.
If you don’t want to help, don’t help. Period. But lets be clear - helping doesn’t mean your facilitating your SIL lounging around all day, eating bonbons and getting her hair done. You’re allowing her to care for and bond with her new infant while still ensuring that her daughter is well cared for.
Be as judgey as you want but understand thats all about you and not at all about your niece.
I used to work in a daycare and I am quoting this post for truth. I would say that once this becomes a routine, the behaviour would stop.
Also, I am all for the parents doing whatever is necessary to maintain their sanity during the transition to having two children. It is a much (more than double) bigger job than having one.
Would it be better if Mom could handle having both of them home all the time? Sure. But better to have a sane Mommy some of the time than a worn out and stressed Mommy all of the time.
No kidding. I suppose having both children there and having mom lose her blob and scream at both of them is better because at least they’re with their mother.
Oh wait - that’s not better at all. That’s stress out basket case mom, screamed at 2 year old and baby with failure to thrive.
Honestly, depending on how mom is coping it could be BETTER for 2 year old to be in a day care.
This is one of those hot topics where everyone feels very strongly one way or another, but has to keep it to themselves to avoid conflict. Ultimately, when I bang up against these arguments, I tend to remind myself that kids have been raised in just about every way we can imagine, and probably quite a few we can’t, over the history of the world, and the vast majority of them turned out just fine.
I agree with everyone else: help if you can, think what you want, and keep your mouth shut, unless you’re very sure of the reaction you’ll get.
It is a little odd - sending her there for five full days, that is, not 2 or3 like Ellen Cherry did while not working; I know a few parents in real life who’ve done the exact same thing as Ellen when on maternity leave with their second child. You’ve made the right decision to just switch off judgemental mode as much as possible and enjoy your time with your niece.
I don’t see the big deal, personally. Kids get a lot of stimulation in daycare that they wouldn’t necessarily get at home while mom is doing daily chores or baby care. As long as your niece is growing and thriving, and has a calm, involved mom to interact with, what does it matter if she’s in daycare?
Besides, it’s not like the daycare staff and other kids are strangers to your niece - they are part of her growing social circle.
Wow. And here’s me worrying that, because we keep our 21-month-old at home even though we could afford daycare, we’re depriving her of all that great socialisation.
Personally I can’t imagine making the same decision as your brother and sister-in-law, but that’s me, thinking about my family - the only family for which I’m remotely qualified to make that kind of judgement. I don’t get to decide where your niece ‘should’ be, and neither do you. Seriously. Unless your brother and sister-in-law are monsters, they’re doing what they believe is best for their family. They’re better placed to assess that than you are, and they’re more likely to be right than you are.
If you want to do what’s best for your niece, then I’d say absolutely drop her off. You sound like you love her fiercely, and being around that can only do her good. If you feel like she’s not getting enough individual attention, yu’ve got the perfect chance to help redress that.
BUT I’d also say be very careful never, ever to let her guess that you think her parents are doing something terrible by sending her to daycare. She’s presumably feeling pretty confused already, given the new baby - the last thing you want to do is give her the impression that you think her parents don’t care about her.
Thinking back to when my six year old was two, if I had a new baby I would have sent the toddler to day care without a second thought. It would have been so hard with her and FOR her because she really was a needy obnoxious little thing. She demanded an audience. Still does. It would have been better for the baby too. More mama time. And it would be better for me, because if baby was anything like six year old, my brain would be shot to hell for the next year anyway. I might as likely put them BOTH in day care at least half-day, if I had the money.
What’s the difference in sending her at two than five? They stay in school eight hours in most schools don’t they? Mine goes from eight to four, five days a week. Forty hours away from me. How horrible! Maybe I should home school her.
Everything has already been said, so I’ll just reiterate.
The child isn’t going to “strangers.” She’s going to teachers that she probably loves (having grown up with them) along with other toddlers who she probably enjoys playing with.
It’s bizarre to assume that the child will receive better care just because she’s with Mom. Guess what? Infants are a pain in the butt and require a lot of attention (some more than others). I’ll bet the girl is doing way more activities at daycare (painting, sculpting, running around, playing the sand) than she would be able to do at home with Mom. Every day, daycare has a schedule of activities that otherwise the parent would have to plan and implement with a screaming infant in tow.
The girl is learning to interact in a safe and supportive environment with adults and other children her age.
Kids generally react poorly to someone new dropping them off at daycare. Just because she’s clinging to you like a Titanic lifeboat doesn’t mean that daycare is a horrible place and that she hates it.
This is your sister-in-law, not your sister, so please do not say anything to her like you’ve said to us unless you don’t want to be part of their family anymore. Nothing is more likely to infuriate someone than other people judging their child-raising from afar (and more infuriating when the judgers don’t even have kids). If you don’t want to do it, don’t, but never, ever say why.
Do you get along with your sister-in-law otherwise? It sounds like maybe you didn’t like her to start with and this just added on to it. Spend a couple days caring for both kids alone and you might change your mind.
It’s human nature, but you just don’t have all the facts to be able to say “my niece should be home with her mommy and her new brother.” She could very easily be bouncing off the walls at home screaming while mom is trying to breastfeed instead of playing with friends and singing kumbaya at daycare.
I am a bit surprised that people are being so judgmental about this. I don’t think it’s any of your business, frankly- if you don’t want to help out, then don’t. It’s really not your place to question the decisions that other people make about their kids, as long as it’s not abusive, and no, this is not- far from it.
If your sister in law feels that nursing and watching the two year-old is too much for her, then it is too much for her. She gets to decide that for herself.
Minus the cesarean and plus me (I have 6 years on Middlebro and 8 on Littlebro), the OP pretty much describes why Middlebro got to go to a Daycare: Mom was in bad health (and hates housework with the heat of a million suns but will never admit it) and dealing with a baby and a toddler at the same time for the 9h/day I was out of the house was more than she reckoned herself capable of.
I hate it when my family takes my help for granted (“you’re picking up The Nephew on Tuesday”) rather than asking for it, but I’m happy to be part of my nephews’ lives and to be able to provide a different PoV on some things - I’ve been the Responder of Difficult Questions since I was answering those of my brothers’…
