Stay-at-home wives

The BBQ Pit
161

[QUOTE=DianaG]
Years of washing jockey shorts is not a free ride. You are familiar with the concept of severance pay, no?
[/QUOTE]

This made me laugh out loud. Severance pay for being kept and MAYBE occasionally having to run a washing machine or vacuum. I guess having all ones bills paid, free vacations, car or whatever wouldn’t be enough. It would also require severance for putting up with that horrible life.

If so it should be an accurate number. Let’s see. I pay $70.00 per week for a home cleaning and $80.00 per week for laundry services for a family of four. 25% of that would be $37.50. Of course in the interest of fairness we should subtract her room and board, clothing, transportation, vacations and other incidentals.

I think someone owes someone money but not in the way you’ve figured it.

Fair is fair.

162

I thought when people were married, money that came into the marriage, and all debts, are considered to be owned by both parties regardless of the source. Is this untrue?

163

[QUOTE=Ensign Edison]
I thought when people were married, money that came into the marriage, and all debts, are considered to be owned by both parties regardless of the source. Is this untrue?
[/QUOTE]

As far as I know this is true. I don’t know how it works if you bring a lot of debt or money into the marriage when it starts, but I’m pretty sure that the debts and money that are incurred during the marriage are split 50/50.

Foxy40, you’ve stated your case, and now you’re just basically ignoring anything anyone else has to say. Maybe you should take your bitterness over all the freeloaders in your life to your therapist instead of continuing to crap all over this thread.

164

[QUOTE=Ensign Edison]
I thought when people were married, money that came into the marriage, and all debts, are considered to be owned by both parties regardless of the source. Is this untrue?
[/QUOTE]

What I’ve learned from reading these boards is that there are two ways of looking at this, depending who is doing the considering:

  1. What can get split up in a divorce. Anything and everything is fair game for the parties and/or judge to look at.
  2. What collections agencies and such can come after. No. If you get married, your spouse is not liable for the debt just because they married you.

I welcome the inevitable correction.

165

[QUOTE=Foxy40]
If so it should be an accurate number. Let’s see. I pay $70.00 per week for a home cleaning and $80.00 per week for laundry services for a family of four. 25% of that would be $37.50. Of course in the interest of fairness we should subtract her room and board, clothing, transportation, vacations and other incidentals.

I think someone owes someone money but not in the way you’ve figured it.

Fair is fair.
[/QUOTE]

I think you’re forgetting a few things, though. What about food preparation? In a restaurant, you’d pay between $5 - $10 USD per meal. At three meals a week for seven days a week for one person, that comes to upper limits of $210 a week. Then there’s the cost of per-meal dishwashing. You’d pay a standard laborer about $10 an hour. Total amount of dishwashing a day comes to about an hour, so let’s say an addition $70 a week. Also, do you tidy up before you have someone clean your house? If so, you need to factor that in, too. And what about errands? How much time do you spend on those? May 2-5 hours a week, depending upon where you live and what you need to do? And household paperwork? That can take up to five hours a week (often more during tax season if you have investments), depending on what you’re up to (including paying the bills, managing the budget, managing the investments and taxes and paperwork related to any kids).

I work full-time, but do most of the housework, all the cooking and most of the laundry and paperwork. Even for my little family of three, I agree that it probably wouldn’t take the same amount of time as a full-time job, much less if there were just me and my husband here; however, I think you’re failing to take into consideration all the things that go into running a house. It’s not just laundry and and scrubbing the toilet. The people you hire to clean your house don’t typically do the detailed job you imagine they do when you’re not there - from what I understand from a family friend working in that industry, a lot of it is just a surface clean (vacuuming, cleaning the countertops and the toilets) and doesn’t involve stuff like dusting all the little knick-knacks (sp?), tidying up the floors, making all the beds, etc. You need to pay even more for that (usually amounts to about $150-200 for a weekly cleaning). Plus, groceries don’t just show up in the fridg, meals aren’t magically prepared and paperwork doesn’t write and file itself.

And I think you’re significantly understating the stress that a lot of people associate with housework. There are tons of people who can’t stand it and having someone else to make sure their house is pristine without having to lift a finger themselves would be a godsend and well worth having a wife or husband stay at home. I know I hate a lot of this household shit, but it has to get done and I’d much rather do it in a less-stressed frame of mind, which is why that’s often what I do with days I take off (since my husband is a consultant, we don’t take a ton of vacations).

166

Foxy, we all get that you’re bitter about your husband’s ex (or your ex, or something). Really. However, unless she dug her claws into the couch and clung for dear life while he fruitlessly tried to peel her off and get her out the door to work, then I think you must concede that they agreed that she should stay home. This agreement comes at a price for the person who doesn’t work, and honoring that agreement by helping out the hurt party when the marriage ends should be par for the course. Decent people honor their agreements.

167

[QUOTE=Ensign Edison]
I thought when people were married, money that came into the marriage, and all debts, are considered to be owned by both parties regardless of the source. Is this untrue?
[/QUOTE]

This is true in community property states, which is some states, but not all. California is a community property state, that I know.

Actually, it’s true of money coming into the marriage. Debts, I’m not so sure.

For some details:

Ed

168

My wife works, and while the extra cash is welcome, I personally think our shared quality of life would be higher if she didn’t - because neither of us has much time to do household stuff, which seems endless.

[I say I’d rather she didn’t work as opposed to I’d rather I didn’t work only because I make a lot more money than her - I’m a lawyer, she’s a financial editor - so we could both easily live off my wages but not so easily off of hers.]

She goes to work because she finds it interesting and that’s her choice which I support. But I’d be lying if I said it would not be a great convenience, worth more than her income, if she didn’t work.

We employ a nanny and housekeeper, which we can well afford and is indeed necessary given the irregular hours we both work and the fact we have a young son, but that isn’t the same. For one, there are lots of stuff the housekeeper can’t do, particularly in the realm of planning. I certainly can’t ask her to buy clothes for me, pack my bags for business trips, balance the household finances, plan house renovations … all stuff that does at some point need doing and is hard to do when you are continually at work, and want to spend your time not at work with the kid.

169

[QUOTE=DianaG]
While she’s deciding what makes women look weak, she should take a moment to ponder whether any man alive has ever thought to himself, “Jesus, that one slacker over there makes all men everywhere look bad.”

[/QUOTE]

Isn’t it more on point to ponder whether any man alive has ever judged all women’s workplace abilities based on one woman’s workplace abilities?

-FrL-

170

[QUOTE=DianaG]
Foxy, we all get that you’re bitter about your husband’s ex (or your ex, or something). Really. However, unless she dug her claws into the couch and clung for dear life while he fruitlessly tried to peel her off and get her out the door to work, then I think you must concede that they agreed that she should stay home. This agreement comes at a price for the person who doesn’t work, and honoring that agreement by helping out the hurt party when the marriage ends should be par for the course. Decent people honor their agreements.
[/QUOTE]

Her ex. The story is searchable

171

[QUOTE=suranyi]
This is true in community property states, which is some states, but not all. California is a community property state, that I know.

Actually, it’s true of money coming into the marriage. Debts, I’m not so sure.

For some details:

Ed
[/QUOTE]

No, your cite says:

I’m assuming “this is true” means joint ownership of assets gained before the marriage.

One can do a prenup also, of course. My father’s assets before his remarriage have been kept separate, in a trust.

The whole thing is easier if you come into a marriage with hardly anything, like we did.

172

This is one of those instances where I’d actually feel a little happier about people’s basic intelligence by knowing the OP is a troll than by knowing he’s serious.

If he is a troll, I guess he’s a pretty good one. By troll standards, I mean.

173

It would give me one of the greatest pleasures of my entire life to ensure my wife didn’t have to work. I have always felt that way, and it doesn’t have anything to do with any kind of traditional values as both of my parents have always worked. It’s funny, though, I can remember asking my current father how work was and he would always say “It was work”. The truth of this did not occur to me until I was in my late thirtys.

Why should we both endure the never ending bullshit if we don’t have to?

With Gods help and a fair amount of work on my part, within five years, I will realize this dream.

My wife shouldn’t have to endure all the hate and bullshit that goes with kissing your bosses"'s" asses to simply keep a job.

As for me, somebodys got to do it, and well, I’m a dick. And that age old adage “Money talks, Bullshit walks” has served me well over the years.

174

Look, if you can afford for one person not to work, that great.
If you can afford for both of you to work part-time, that’s great.

If one of you loves their work, lives for it and would happily work 7 days a week if they could, while the other hates their work but would willingly do all the little things that need to be done at home- well, why not.

When the irishbabies eventually arrive, I’ll take my 6 months maternity leave, then get right back to work. irishfella will be working from home part-time. I’m fine with that, so is he.

Whatever a couple decides between them about how they work, and when and where is their business. As long as nobody is in indentured servitude at home or forced to work every hour god sends to keep someone in a style to which they have become accustomed, I couldn’t care less.

Some men like to be the bread winner, some don’t. Some women like to earn their own money, some don’t. some people go quietly crazy at work, some go quietly crazy at home.

You don’t have to make equal financial contributions to a marriage to be an equal partner, you just have to make equal contributions of time, energy and love.

If your every waking minute is spent making sure your spouse’s every conceivable need is catered to and everything you do is aimed at making their life easier and happier, you are contributing more to the marriage IMO than if you sit in an office for 8 hours and never think of your spouse or children once.

175

Just to add my 2 cents:

My personal experience of being a SAHW happened when I followed my husband to California for a job he was taking. The job situation there was horrible and it was a temporary move so finding a job was pretty near impossible. I was ok for the first week, getting things straightened out after the move, but after that began the worst summer of my life. I went to yoga, I cleaned and did laundry, I cooked meals (although I’ll freely admit I wasn’t very good at that). I started a children’s story, and I took on some editing work. Despite all of that, it was so hard to get out of bed every morning, knowing that I had nowhere to be, no one who wanted anything from me. I felt completely worthless, not having a job. My identity is definitely tied up with what I do for a living. So while I logically understand why a woman or a man might want to “not work”, in order to pursue creative writing, hobbies, or charity work, I personally will never really understand it. It just didn’t work for me, in part because I need outside accountability (and outside companionship) in order to function properly.

That said, if the women in the article are happy and fulfilled in what they do, then why shouldn’t they pursue it?

Also, I just want to add that I think it’s cool that as many SAH husbands as wives have been mentioned in this thread. That makes me happy, because society does seem to have a double standard about men “not working,” a double standard which NYT perpetuated in their article, and it’s good to know that reality doesn’t necessarily follow the standard.

176

[QUOTE=irishgirl]
Look, if you can afford for one person not to work, that great.
If you can afford for both of you to work part-time, that’s great.

If one of you loves their work, lives for it and would happily work 7 days a week if they could, while the other hates their work but would willingly do all the little things that need to be done at home- well, why not.

When the irishbabies eventually arrive, I’ll take my 6 months maternity leave, then get right back to work. irishfella will be working from home part-time. I’m fine with that, so is he.

Whatever a couple decides between them about how they work, and when and where is their business. As long as nobody is in indentured servitude at home or forced to work every hour god sends to keep someone in a style to which they have become accustomed, I couldn’t care less.

Some men like to be the bread winner, some don’t. Some women like to earn their own money, some don’t. some people go quietly crazy at work, some go quietly crazy at home.

You don’t have to make equal financial contributions to a marriage to be an equal partner, you just have to make equal contributions of time, energy and love.

If your every waking minute is spent making sure your spouse’s every conceivable need is catered to and everything you do is aimed at making their life easier and happier, you are contributing more to the marriage IMO than if you sit in an office for 8 hours and never think of your spouse or children once.
[/QUOTE]

I agree with this. well said.

177

[QUOTE=starryspice]
Despite all of that, it was so hard to get out of bed every morning, knowing that I had nowhere to be, no one who wanted anything from me. I felt completely worthless, not having a job. My identity is definitely tied up with what I do for a living. So while I logically understand why a woman or a man might want to “not work”, in order to pursue creative writing, hobbies, or charity work, I personally will never really understand it. It just didn’t work for me, in part because I need outside accountability (and outside companionship) in order to function properly.

[/QUOTE]

I do think that’s a big part of being a successful SAHM. It’s the most self-directed job around, and if you’re not good at thinking up things to do yourself, you might not be happy. I have way too many ideas of what to do with my time, and not enough time to do them in; I don’t need someone to tell me what to do in order to fill up my day, nor do I need to get paid to feel worthwhile. (Come to think of it, my paid hours often feel sort of wasted.)

I must say, staying home without actual kids around sounds like a pretty good job. I don’t run the house all that well, and I don’t have near as much time as I’d like for my own interests. I think I could probably be pretty happy staying home after the kids leave, maybe with some part-time work since I do also like my job pretty well (I’m a librarian and I do substitute work a few days a month).

What I mostly do with my time right now (in order of time consumed) is take care of the kids and take them places, run our lives, care for the house not very well, and indulge in my own interests. If I think about today, I spent about 1.5 hours on grocery shopping and housework, 5 hours taking the kids to play (at friends’ house and then the creek with other friends), another couple of hours caring for the kids’ personal needs (baths after creek play are very important), and now I should go make some dinner. And I haven’t done the dishes yet. :o Next week school starts, and I’m not ready yet–I have a lot of hours to invest in school prep and then I will be spending several hours a day on that, since I’m the school and the teacher. This is our summer schedule.

178

So, any rich ladies here looking for a stay at home husband? :cool:

179

[QUOTE=starryspice]
<snip>
Also, I just want to add that I think it’s cool that as many SAH husbands as wives have been mentioned in this thread. That makes me happy, because society does seem to have a double standard about men “not working,” a double standard which NYT perpetuated in their article, and it’s good to know that reality doesn’t necessarily follow the standard.
[/QUOTE]

I think people really are finding their own paths these days - I know two stay at home men (one with kids, one without) who both have wives with kick-ass jobs. When my family gets together, we have exactly two people in the family with traditional, 8-5 M-F jobs - everyone else is a combination of contract, part-time, self-employed, and retired. And we’re all making our way in the world just fine.

180

[QUOTE=starryspice]
Also, I just want to add that I think it’s cool that as many SAH husbands as wives have been mentioned in this thread. That makes me happy, because society does seem to have a double standard about men “not working,” a double standard which NYT perpetuated in their article, and it’s good to know that reality doesn’t necessarily follow the standard.
[/QUOTE]

Hell, I’ve been thinking of Sapo in every single post. Sadly, he hasn’t posted in months :frowning:

I loved his story of being laid off, getting hit with a clue-by-four that “dude, you’re home all day so do something other than job hunt please with sugar on top before I get mad” and discovering that, hey, he likes housework and being a SAHD more than he likes the kind of work he’s trained for.