The thing is, we knew from the very beginning that the rebels were allied with al Qaida and others of their ilk. Supporting them was a bad decision.
Weren’t you somebody here once?
Yeah, I guess if ignore the whole “killed 150,000 of his people and sent 2,000,000 to other countries as refugees” thing, then he’s a real peach of a guy.
The rebels had a legitimate beef with* the fucking dictator who was oppressing the people. *
It’s official: Americans want to put bacon on fucking everything.
We do sometimes look on his works and despair.
Which reminds me-Would you like to see some sizzling bacon porn?
It’s the Pit. If I can’t rant a little here, where can I rant? Should we designate a special color font for the tongue in cheek bits?
Plus, let’s face it, these guys couldn’t be larger douche bags if they tried setting up a booth at a GYN convention. I’ll spew a little bit about corpse desecration if’n I wanna.
Although, guys, bacon. C’mon. Let’s not waste bacon on these pustules. Can’t we anger their ghosts with Oscar Meyer or Farmer John wrappers instead? Why do they get the good stuff?
One, I’m not under any such impression. Two, the person who I quoted said that, and their point (that I was trying to share) is that right now, ISIS is a relatively small force of around 10000 men with around 35-50 heavy mechanized vehicles (tanks and artillery).
Keep in mind some groups claim there are 50K ISIS members in Syria and 30K in Iraq. These numbers are not only unverified, they are extremely unlikely. The best estimate was about 4000 men in June of this year. Adding for growth, that means that 10000 is a fair figure and one which most intel types think is about right. The hard core jihadists are about 4-7K of the fighting force, with the others being along for the ride.
That’s right now. But they will draw more fighters in as time passes because their recruiting methods promise money, women and power to men who have none of the above. They also tend to kill people who decline to join when offered. Soooo…
Killing them now, before they become entrenched in the population, is a better idea. They are trying to control large areas of territory with relatively few men and light arms. Kill them now or it will take a much larger force fighting for much longer to defeat them later. As to Assad, nothing says we have to act in concert with him at all. The ISIS controlled areas in Iraq and Syria are contiguous along transportation corridors and are fairly well defined. If Assad tries to interfere in our air operations against ISIS then he will have his air force turned into scrap metal. Since he wants and needs his air force, AND he’s happy to let us kill ISIS for him, he’s not going to make a fight of it.
Here’s are two maps:
The first gives you an idea of the areas they operate in or are staging attacks. It’s a scary looking map.
Now here’s an older map (from June) that adds an important point. Where they are actively in control (in black). The point is, that ISIS may operate in a large area, but it is actively in control in a relatively few areas.
http://blog.foreignpolicy.com/files/fp_uploaded_images/140611_ISISmapiraq06102014.jpg
The end point I’m trying to get to is that there are a few key locations (Mosul probably being the most important one in Iraq) where if they can be defeated in detail, they will have to fall back to minor insurgency and harassment operations as opposed to major offensives against population centers and wholesale slaughter.
Now that’s all military stuff and is fine. But a big part of what we need to be doing is engaging with the money men (Qatar et al) and giving them a list of Syrian groups it is okay to support and telling them that ISIS is not on that list anymore.
BTW, Saudi Arabia is staging 30000 troops along the border with Iraq. They take the ISIS threat seriously since ISIS has apparently said they want to destroy the Kaaba at Mecca. So maybe they can be the primary coalition ground force with US/NATO air support. It’ll be Sunni on Sunni at that point.
Regards,
-Bouncer-
By not walking away.
Nah Assad actually preferred to bomb moderate rebels, he loves his power and could give two Sh*%s about Syria. He wanted ISIS to grow to suit his narrative, a self fulfilling prophecy. Of course ISIS slowly is capturing important military bases and killing hundreds of government troops.
Its not an either or situation, both Assad and ISIS are scums. I would bomb both.
I have little sympathy for government troops killed by ISIS, hey they had no problems bombing their countrymen and razing entire cities for their beloved chin less president, stooge of Iran. They did not show mercy, they don’t deserve mercy either.
Obama thought not supporting rebels will keep Islamists at bay, but ISIS has grown and the moderate rebels were right all along. Now the U.S is back in Iraq, and may end up bombing Syria.
Stupid people should never be rewarded.
Most of the damage has been from the Assad side, and time and again proof that chemical weapons have been used. Russia and Iran have more blood on their hands than Saudi Arabia or Qatar.
Well said John Mace!
He did not kill 150,000 of his people. 150,000 have died in conflict. Its about Sunni-NonSunni(Christians,Alawites,Shias etc) divide in that region. Sunni have radical wahabism sect. Non-Sunnis(Assad front) are more secular, its a fight for survival for them.
Terrorists have as much ‘legitimate beef’ with USA. I guess everyone should start supporting them.
Calling either Assad regime secular obscures the situation on the ground, where sectarian compromises and ideological influences necessitated a delicate balancing act. In an amazingly (and depressingly) prescient paper from 2003 entitled (PDF) “Islamic Education in Syria: Undoing Secularism,” interested parties can read how the Assad regime has used official Islamic education to promote their authority and conduct nation-building.
Essentially, the Syrian state has promoted a traditionalist (rather than extremist, important distinction) form of specifically Sunni Islam whose ideology does not respect the tolerance that Syria is historically famous for. It promotes a fused Arab-Sunni identity as well as a kind of idealized Islamist political ideology and disparages those who deviate from its orthodoxy. While religious education classes (that most students don’t take too seriously and contribute more through osmosis than through direct learning) can certainly not be blamed completely for what is going on now, their contribution to the worldview of young Syrians should not be discounted. If nothing else, understanding this context helps illuminate some of the intellectual currents that are currently influential in the area.
Oh, you’re right. It will be a “slam dunk”. Just kill all the terrorist and then walk way. Brilliant!!
That is, like, the mother of all distinctions without a difference.
66k to 115K of the dead are Pro-Govt. force -
People from both sides are getting killed. Last thing that was needed was countries like the US supporting the rebels. Your country bears some responsibility for the continuation of conflict and for so many deaths.
Are you intentionally trolling or is that a simple accident of you not paying attention to what’s being posted?
My Tea Party kin have the cure for this ISIS problem. They say we can just drop a few precision bombs on ISIS and pay for it by cutting the EPA funding in half. Woot! Problem solved!
How many insurgents were there in Iraq in 2006? You think this is somehow different? It’s the sane fucking guys (ex-SH military) plus ISIS. And they are in Syria as well as Iraq. You’re insane if you think going in there and “nipping this in the bud” is going to be easy.
BTW, if Saudi Arabia wants to deal with this, let them. ISIS is 1000x more of a threat to them then they are to us