The song has:
What’s stone wine?
Googling finds “stone wine cellars” and “stone wine cups” and the like.
Google shows 294 hits on the lyrics to this song WITHOUT the phrase “stone wine.” It shows 2 hits on the lyrics WITH “stone wine.”
Here are what appear to be the original lyrics, attibuted to the song’s author: http://www.psgilmore-society.org/johnny.html
As to when and by whom the “stone wine” verse was written, I don’t know, but I’m 52 and your post was the first mention of it I’ve ever encountered. Likewise, I’ve never before heard of stone wine, and have no clue what it’s supposed to be.
Thank you.
I hadn’t considered that it wasn’t part of the original lyrics. It still makes me wonder what the redactor meant by “stone wine”.
Actually, it’s not clear that the Civil War version is the original lyrics. There’s a good argument that the song was originally an Irish song from the turn of the 19th century: Johnny, I Hardly Knew You. The Irish lyrics are also about a soldier’s homecoming too, but the tone of the song is completely different:
While goin’ the road to sweet Athy, hurroo, hurroo
While goin’ the road to sweet Athy, hurroo, hurroo
While goin’ the road to sweet Athy,
A stick in me hand and a drop in me eye,
A doleful damsel I heard cry,
Johnny I hardly knew ye.
With your drums and guns and drums and guns, hurroo, hurroo
With your drums and guns and drums and guns, hurroo, hurroo
With your drums and guns and drums and guns,
The enemy nearly slew ye
Oh my darling dear, Ye look so queer
Johnny I hardly knew ye.
Where are your eyes that were so mild, hurroo, hurroo
Where are your eyes that were so mild, hurroo, hurroo
Where are your eyes that were so mild,
When my heart you so beguiled
Why did ye run from me and the child
Oh Johnny, I hardly knew ye
Where are your legs that used to run, hurroo, hurroo
Where are your legs that used to run, hurroo, hurroo
Where are your legs that used to run,
When you went for to carry a gun
Indeed your dancing days are done
Oh Johnny, I hardly knew ye
I’m happy for to see ye home, hurroo, hurroo
I’m happy for to see ye home, hurroo, hurroo
I’m happy for to see ye home,
All from the island of Saloam;
So low in flesh, so high in bone
Oh Johnny I hardly knew ye
Ye haven’t an arm, ye haven’t a leg, hurroo, hurroo
Ye haven’t an arm, ye haven’t a leg, hurroo, hurroo
Ye haven’t an arm, ye haven’t a leg,
Ye’re an armless, boneless, chickenless egg
Ye’ll have to put with a bowl out to beg
Oh Johnny I hardly knew ye
They’re rolling out the guns again, hurroo, hurroo
They’re rolling out the guns again, hurroo, hurroo
They’re rolling out the guns again,
But they never will take our sons again
No they never will take our sons again
Johnny I’m swearing to ye.
Yes, musically speaking, clearly “When Johnny Comes Marching Home” was derived from “Johnny, I Hardly Knew You.” Their tunes and chord sequences, while not quite identical, are very similar. The “hurroo/hurrah” parts are the same, and they do both have the name “Johnny.”
Beyond that, however, there is really no similarity in the lyrics. In talking strictly about the song “When Johnny Comes Marching Home,” it seems safe to say that Gilmore wrote it and his are the original lyrics. The versions with “stone wine” have the same first verse, and the same overall tone in the additonal stanzas, as compared to the darker and more somber lament “Johnny, I Hardly Knew You.”
Since this is about a song, let’s move it over to Cafe Society. Note that the thread was started in 2004.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator
Wikipedia, however, says that “Johnny I Hardly Knew You” wasn’t published until 1867, and the supposition that it originated in the early 19th Century has been proven wrong. It appears that it’s based on “When Johnny Comes Marching Home,” published in 1863, rather than the reverse.
The actual antecedent for the tune of “When Johnny Comes Marching Home” appears to have been the Civil War drinking song “Johnny Fill Up the Bowl,” published a few months earlier in 1863 than “When Johnny Comes Marching Home” (but probably around earlier than that).
Interestingly, the lyrics refer to “drinking stone blind.” I suspect the versions of “When Johnny Comes Marching Home” that include “drinking stone wine” represent a mis-hearing of that phrase.
Interesting, but Stone’s Ginger Wine is a British brand. Would it have been sold in the US in the 1860s?
I always thought Stone Wine was the same as Sloe gin.
Why on earth would you think that?:dubious: Ginger wine is nothing at all like sloe gin.
I am not sure stone wine and ginger wine are the same, they may very well be. My grandfather made a concoction with sloe plums and called it Stone Wine. Hell, he probably made it up.
There are flavoured liqueurs that are made by macerating stone fruits (of which sloes are an example), or just the stones of those fruits, in alcohol, however…
There doesn’t appear to be any reason to suspect that’s what the song is referring to, and…
I’ve never actually heard these things called ‘stone wine’ - they are called ‘Sloe Gin’, Cherry Pit Brandy’, etc.
Ooh, I forgot about cherry pit brandy. He made that too. My older cousins used to swipe it and drink it in the barn. They got shit faced and caught everytime. It smelled really good in the jar.
A few days ago, I downloaded the song “When Jhony come marching home”. I always heard the music in movies but not the lyrics. When I heard it, I was also struck by what it means “we’ll all drink stone wine”. I have read the comments on this page and, based on one of them, I looked for the meaning in Spanish “drinking stone blind”, From the meaning in Spanish, one might think that the phrase “we’ll all drink stone wine “ would mean “drinking blindly” or “drinking without control.”
What do you think?
I don’t suppose that this is at all relevant, but Stone’s Ginger wine
has been around since 1740 …
(eta, i see uzhu’s link above is a reference to this.)
btw, welcome @Alberto ! “drinking blindly” or “drinking without control.” sounds feasible…
Bad alcohol (with high methanol content, or substances added to make it “undrinkable”) can cause blindness. I would interpret “drink stone blind” to mean that you’re drinking so much that you don’t care what rotgut it is, and going blind from it.
I think the same. both sentences can be feasible
Alberto
Reply to Chronos,
I work in a research area where the toxicological risk of chemicals is relevant knowledge. I knew about the risk of Methanol poisoning. Now I don’t believe that the author’s intention was to “drink wine regardless of going blind.” That’s why I still think that the most likely thing is that the intention was to “drink wine without worrying about getting drunk.” It could be compared to a phrase we have in Spanish that says “do good without looking at who.” This does not mean helping someone as if one were blind, but helping someone regardless of what the person is (religion, race, etc.)
Alberto
Come taste the difference good fruit can make in your wine!
Stranger
Or you’re drinking till you can’t see straight. Even good alcohol can do that, if you drink enough of it.