It’s my understanding that the men immediately shot the grandmother after breaking into the home. It seems quite probable that they weren’t planning on leaving any witnesses
The 12 year old saved himself and his grandmother. That seems pretty positive to me.
Yes, it’s tragic that it became necessary for a child to be put in this situation. But home invasions are a part of life. Especially in lower class neighborhoods. I live in one and worry constantly. Our mailman got held up 5 blocks from my house. Stuff like that gets your attention.
By declaring that any story involving guns, and having at least one “good” gun user standing at the end of it as a positive is a pretty pro-gun violence stance.
In theory, there could be a thread for debating stories of gun use, but I don’t see how it wouldn’t end up in the pit or closed eventually, so may as well just stick with this one.
Yep, it was pretty much trolling from the get-go.
So, on the whole, a story of defensive gun use. Not really a positive story.
Do you think that this is the sort of story that this kid will tell to his kids to comfort them about the dangerous world they live in?
The 12 year old only had to endure the trauma of seeing his grandmother shot, and then that of taking another’s life, because of easy access to guns in the first place.
Seems a pretty negative story about guns to me.
Yep, especially since they have such easy access to guns.
I live in one, I had a fatal shooting 2 blocks from here on one side a couple months ago, a few months prior, a few more blocks on the other side.
I don’t worry much about it at all. Don’t have a gun in the house, and rarely lock my doors when I’m home.
But that’s just the position of the OP and the news posters in that thread. I don’t see that as a stance of “this board” which you seemed to imply. Nor do I see a counterpoint position as trollery.
But you know what, that’s debate and I had posted I’d rather see debate elsewhere so I’ll leave it at that here.
There was a very long and contentious debate in ATMB, and that was the final word of the board powers that be.
I do consider that thread to be trolling, as it is well known that a significant number of posters to this board would question the positivity of these stories, and it was created with the specific intent of framing these stories as positive.
If you want to start a GD thread about the positivity of these stories of defensive gun use, go ahead. I entirely support that.
Just don’t think it will last long before it gets relegated to the pit or closed.
I don’t remember specifics, but I’m pretty sure that it was explicitly said that this was the place to question such stories by TPTB.
There is definitely an argument to be made that any story that ends with someone dead is not really much of a “positive” story. I made that argument in the thread in the past, was informed of the “safe space” rules, and accepted that, which is why I don’t jump into that thread every time the gun crowd gathers round to celebrate another killing. I’ve accepted that ruling. Snowflakes gonna snowflake .
THIS TIME, my objection is that - even if things ended up well in this particular circumstance - the idea that a 12 year old kid can EVER access a gun is simply NOT positive.
The 12 year old brain is not fully developed yet, and this kid had access to a deadly weapon in a matter of seconds. This story could easily have gone another way, with the 12 year old with access to a loaded firearm showing it to his friend and blowing his brains out by mistake, or getting dumped by a girlfriend the same week he is viciously bullied and responding by shooting up his school. THAT is what was particularly disturbing about this story in particular that brought me back to the thread.
Yep - I just had my GD gun thread closed because the snowflake gun nuts can’t handle their “right” to murder others being questioned. I guess there’s nothing left to do but point and laugh at them in this thread.
I don’t think that anyone carries the weight of ending someone else’s life lightly.
Except sociopaths, of course.
It is indeed a story of defensive gun use, but a positive story about guns? Not really.
Had the home invaders not had easy access to guns, his grandmother would not have been shot, and he would not have had to kill someone.
Like I said earlier, if you consider any story about guns where the “good” guy is the last guy standing to be positive, then sure, you can consider it that. I just don’t agree with that pro-gun violence stance.
Yeah. Let’s not make light of it, it is a serious thing. It may be a case of “I did what I had to do” so one does not go around tormenting oneself over it, but it’s still not per se a happy moment.
Yep, I took a look at it, and decided not to participate. Gun nuts cannot argue in good faith, and they really can’t, as they have no good faith argument to stand on. They just whine and troll until the thread gets shut down. Rinse repeat…
I am not a gun owner, nor do I support unfettered access to guns. I have posted in that other thread a couple of times questioning whether specific posts were actually positive.
However, your statement is a hasty generalization. There are areas in the U.S. where guns for hunting and recreation are part of everyday life and children are raised around them, and given proper training and respect for them. I have no idea if this is the case in that particular story, but you can’t make a generalization that no 12-year-old can ever learn to handle guns responsibly.
The fact remains that this 12-year-old very possibly saved his grandmother’s life. Remember she had already been shot. But this story shows the dangers of easy access to guns by criminals. No amount of gun ownership by law-abiding citizens can offset the ready availability of guns to criminals, and so I find the story to be negative rather than positive. The “good guy with a gun” argument leads to the arms race where you have these shootouts happening everywhere, unlike other civilized nations with sane gun controls. A story that ends with a criminal dying of gunshot wounds is a smug argument for gun ownership but I have to believe we would be better off with fewer deaths overall, even if some of the saved lives were that of criminals. Few people are all bad or all good.
Yes, there are parts of the US where idiots give their kids guns to hunt with. There are also parts of the world where slightly bigger idiots marry their 12 year olds off to 40 year old men. A child cannot consent to sex nor should they be given tools of killing for many of the same reasons. Just because it is “normal” in some areas doesn’t make it right.
You ignored the point of my argument. A 12-year-old can learn to handle a gun responsibly. Not all 12-year-olds can, but it is just wrong to make a blanket statement that no 12-year-old should ever touch any kind of gun. My kids learned riflery in summer camp at about that age and it was a very positive experience.
In fact, a child is incapable of understanding the full consequences of shooting someone. “But my 12 year old is so mature! They can handle it!” Cry the parents whose kid shoots up a school the day before it happens, or the proud parents of the child bride.
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