Emphasis mine.
Go ahead and defend the rapists, Askia. Maybe rape is natural when people have lost their homes? And maybe it was the non-violent rape you were talking about earlier… why even use the word “rape,” except to criminalize victims who just wanted a little forced hugging.
These people make me sick, and anyone apologizing for them or justifying their actions make me sick too. You’ve found the parameters of my liberal heart.
Emphasis mine.
Go ahead and defend the rapists, Askia. Maybe rape is natural when people have lost their homes? And maybe it was the non-violent rape you were talking about earlier… why even use the word “rape,” except to criminalize victims who just wanted a little forced hugging.
These people make me sick, and anyone apologizing for them or justifying their actions make me sick too. You’ve found the parameters of my liberal heart.
My brother in law finally got a call through to my sister in Arkansas. He’s stuck on top of Tulane hospital, away from a computer or any other sort of media coverage, and has said he has heard shots beating against the building. A hearty fuck you to any cynics that think he’s lying.
Except in the first-hand accounts that we’ve read, pilots had to stop doing what they were there to do, because of the danger, hospital workers halted evacuations, and nobody got beat down.
Oh, I forgot, you haven’t seen it on video, so none of it’s really happening.
Honestly, I don’t understand how you see this as “criminalizing” victims. This is just talking about events in isolation. The people who are stranded in NO aren’t a monolithic block. Everybody understands that the vast majority of people there just want to get out alive, as quickly as possible. Unfortunately, some of the people there are also engaging in violent criminal behaviour, which is making the situation more difficult.
Do you need to see a Venn diagram? There are victims of Katrina, relief workers, criminals, and victims of criminals. There is some overlap. There are people who have technically commited crimes out of sheer necessity. I think most people have enough sense not to get terribly indignant about someone who takes food and water the only way its available. I think most people also have the sense to acknowledge that there’s no excusing shooting at the people who are there to fucking help. There’s no excuse for committing violent crimes against other victims because there’s no law around and you can get away with it. None.
Who here is “justifying” or “dismissing” armed interference with rescue efforts? The absolutely nicest thing said about such behavior is that it probably isn’t substantially impeding the success of rescue work. As far as I can tell, though, everybody here is in complete agreement that such actions are, at best, “way counterproductive (as well as immoral, reckless, and possibly suicidal)”.
And nobody has said even a syllable to excuse or justify or rationalize in any way truly inexcusable acts like deliberate rape and murder.
Please don’t take your excess hysteria and indignation out on people who are just trying to understand what’s going on without getting hysterical. I agree that this is a horrible situation, but losing your head and accusing people of supporting outrageous positions that they’re not actually supporting isn’t going to do any good.
Askia must be on your ignore list. Can’t say I blame you.
cricetus. You’re twisting my words, you’re accusing me of things I never said, and you’re attacking me personally. Knock it off.
I am being skeptical and listening to incoming information. I am processing it as best I can. I have criticized the connotations of words and terms in various reports. I have stated my opinions.
But don’t demonize me for it.
Larry Mudd. You’re patronizing me and it’s unworthy of you.
Let’s keep watching – from whatever sources we deem accurate – what’s going on.
You’re misreading me. It was meant to be ridicule.
Sorry about that.
Hmmm. Reading cricetus’ posts right before yours didn’t help.
My apologies.
None are in order from you – on the contrary, I should be apologizing to you.
Sorry. None of us should be sniping at each other.
I had a little walk which reminded me a little bit of how hard it is to hold onto humanity.
C’mon, dude. Don’t start getting all mushy on me.
I hope all this makes some people think really, really hard about this country’s love affair with guns…laughably regulated guns, unnecessarily many guns, unnecessarily powerful guns, all available to people who. should. not. have them.
Askia
I will take the advice of Larry and no longer snipe with you. Actually, I was never sniping, just a madman with a gun. :dubious:
Seriously, I respect your desire to collect all the information, but at times I took your posts as somewhat ostrich-like. I can understand “suspended judgment” and often advise it, but you seemed more in the phase of “denial.” I was already moved on to “anger.” I forget which is really first in the lay psychology process, but you get what I mean.
The ground reports and news have convinced me that this is an epic tragedy. Not because of the hurricane, but because of the strife that followed. We expect looting, but not the kind of lawlessness that broke out. It is discouraging to see what humans are really made of. I hope I behave better when Minneapolis is destroyed, but who knows.
Amen. I hope people finally realize that private guns can literally mean the difference between life and death in some situations and that criminals will get guns no matter what we do.
That’s … probably more than a fair assessment of me at this time.
This has truly turned out worse than my limited “understanding” is able to process. I can wrap my mind around the reasons behind looting, even non-essential items. However, I’m completely at a loss for some of those in need of help firing on their rescuers. Furthermore, the thought of rape and murder is incomprehensible.
I apologize to anyone who felt I was advocating the increase in violent behavior from what we first saw early on. I was stupid enough to believe that it would never progress this far and would basically remain within the bounds of property damage, etc. That these actions led to anarchy, I am ashamed and humbled at how naive I was. And I am sorry that I didn’t listen to those who saw much further ahead and were much wiser, who tried to explain that to me while I was running around in my rose-colored glasses. From now on, I’ll hopefully view things with a more critical eye and how it impacts the future.
Sorry. 
Never underestimate the depths of human depravity.
True. It’s not gun ownership per se that’s the problem IMHO—plenty of other countries permit gun ownership and don’t have anything like our gun violence problem. The trouble seems to be our unhealthy “gun culture”, where so many people believe that having a gun will necessarily keep you safer or solve your problems. This is how you wind up with desperate people thinking it’s a good idea to shoot at rescue helicopters to make them come rescue you.
By all means, get a gun if you like them or have a particular use for them, and can keep them safe. But don’t imagine that having it is necessarily going to save your ass or get you out of trouble, like in the movies or on TV. In the vast majority of troubled situations, bringing in a gun is going to make the situation worse, not better. And that goes double or triple for troubled situations like natural disaster emergencies, and ten times for emergencies with freely available guns and ammo from looted Wal-Marts.
I was waiting for this.
Prohibition of alcohol didn’t work, and it wasn’t targeted at a Constitutional right of the people. So, how do you find it possible to take away someone’s second amendment right when you can’t even stop them from drinking?
And,yes, I am thinking real hard about guns right now. I’m thinking it might not be a bad idea to go out and get another. I live in a coastal town constantly bracing for the hurricane punch. What if I can’t leave when there’s another Katrina bearing down on me before the end of the season?
I bet if someone air-dropped your ass in New Orleans right now, you’d wish you had a gun.
Sorry for the hijack.
Since none of the guns in question were obtained legally, it’s not about gun control. It’s about security at gun stores or something.