Television: it was never all that good to begin with.

A few days ago I accidentally posted this in a thread instead of starting a new one, as I intended. Sorry for the inconvenience (if any).
[/quote]
In another thread, someone asks a question we’ve all considered at one time or other: “When did Television get to be so awful?”

I would propose the following theory (or is it more properly a hypothesis at this stage?):[ul]Television has always consisted of huge mounds of audiovisual KREP. Within that steaming, noisesome mass lie a few choice nuggets that beguile us into venturing once more into the vast wasteland in a pathetic search for yet another golden morsel.[/ul]
As evidence, I give you some examples:[list=1][li]“My Mother the Car”[/li]A man discovers his mother has been reincarnated as his antique automobile. Right.
[li]“My Living Doll”[/li]An Air Force scientist tries to teach a(n emphatically) female android (Julie Newmar – ROWR!!) how to get along in human society. Hilarity ensues.
[li]“Captain Nice”[/li]A mama’s-boy police chemist uses a secret formula to become a superhero, aided by his mother (played by Alice Ghostly – who would be embarrassed about this show if anyone besides me still remembered it).[/list=1]What evidence do we have that Television was ever “great”, apart from a few isolated examples? Tell me, oh Teeming Masses: what were the best (and worst) examples of television programming ever perpetrated?

~~Baloo

The Simpsons

'Nuf said.

Other “isolated” moments:

MAS*H up until Frank left.
The Carol Burnett Show
The Muppet Show
All in the Family ('bout 90% of it)
The Straight Dope show :slight_smile:
From the Earth to the Moon
The Lost in Space episode with the 6-foot talking carrot
(I’m serious! This is camp at it best)
Mystery Science Theater 3000
Monty Python’s Flying Circus
The Prisoner

…next…

[ul][li]The Outer Limits[/li][sup]AT ONE MILLION PER EPISODE IT BLEW AWAY THE COMPETITION UNTIL STAR TREK HIT THE SCENE.[/sup]

[li]The Twilight Zone[/li][sup]ROD SERLING GALLANTLY TRIED TO AVERT THE CRASH COURSE TELVISION HAD WITH THE “VAST WASTELAND” THAT MURROW ENVISIONED.[/sup]

[li]Kraft Playhouse[/li][sup]A LITTLE BEFORE MY TIME BUT QUITE AN HONORABLE EFFORT FOR EARLY TELEVISION.[/sup]

[li]Alfred Hitchcock Presents[/li][sup]SEEING ALMOST EVERY ASPIRING ACTOR FROM NIMOY TO REDFORD COME UP THROUGH THE RANKS WAS FUN. WATCHING HITCH BARB THE SPONSORS INCESSANTLY MADE IT IT ALL WORTH IT.[/sup]

[li]One Step Beyond[/li][sup]A DECENT ATTEMPT TO BRING THE SUPERNATURAL INTO YOUR LIVING ROOM BACK IN THE 1950’s.[/sup]
[/ul]


[sup][/sup]


[sup][/sup]


[sup][/sup]


[sup][/sup]


[sup][/sup]


[sup][/sup]


[sup][/sup]

I always thought “Cop Rock” deserved better than it got.

Baloo, the thing you need to remember is that, even though we get a lot of shitty TV shows, they live short lives (generally). Granted, this fails to explain stuff like Power Rangers or Poke’mon, but Kids Shows are exempt from the hypothesis. The good shows are around forever, while the crappy, short-lived shows keep trying to copy them.

Wow, I get to use my TV Producer creds twice in one month!

TV boils down to this: Too much demand, nowhere near enough supply.

Throw in cheap-ass shareholders (read: people who want a 15-20% annual return) and it gets worse.

Yes, there are good shows… and yes, TV attracts lots of boneheads who are in it for the glamour potential. (I think there’s some of inverse law between Talent/Responsibility and Ego :slight_smile: )

But there’s one other thing you’ve gotta remember about TV: You get what you pay for (and the cable company doesn’t give any money the TV stations that provide programming).

[Homer Simpson]
But TV gives so much and asks so little.
[/Homer Simpson]

Television is, like everything else, subject to Sturgeon’s Law (“90% of of everything is crud.”). There has always been plenty of bad TV, and small oases of good TV. And, in like TV like everything else, quality and popularity are independent variable (Rothman’s Law). So shows fall into four general catgories:

Good and popular:
The Simpsons
MAS*H

Bad and popular:
The Love Boat
Full House

Good and Unpopular
Once A Hero
The Duck Factory

Bad and Unpopular
Turn-On
Tales of the Brass Monkey

(I suppose you could also add a “mediocre” to the quality criteria.)

BTW, Alice Ghostley has nothing to be ashamed of with Captain Nice, Buck Henry’s attempt to do for the superhero genre what he did for the spy genre in “Get Smart.” It was a fairly good satire, and miles ahead of “Mr. Terrific.”

[nitpick]
I believe that, rather than “Murrow,” you mean “Minnow.” Specifically, FCC Chairman Newton Minnow, who made the remark in 1961. He also said, “When television is bad, nothing is worse.”

The reason there is so much bad is that television operates under the Parsimony Principle: Use the largest number of familiar and recycled program elements that are the least offensive to the greatest number of viewers.

Television today is better than at any time in its history.

Examples? A huge offering from PBS, Discovery, History Channel, Weather Channel, home and garden shows, live sports, AMC, TMC, the Arts Channel, etc. etc. etc.

I’d even guess that, by and large, today’s comedies are better written than those of the 50s or 60s. “I Love Lucy” was an exception of that era, as was Steve Allen. And I’d also hazard to guess that some of that old programming that we miss so much today is not because it was so good, per se, but because we are nostalgic for the supposed values and stability of that era.

I’ve seen vintage Sid Caesar shows and most were terrible, yet he was a god back then. Howard Stern–who deserves to be burned at a stake–was right about Caesar when he said, “Sure you were big back then. You were competing against a test pattern.”

From my television, I can learn how to install a sink, cook Cajun style, improve my golf swing and learn more of other cultures around the world. That said, lots of programming is contemptible. The solution is discretion. Be selective and you can find plenty of good programming. But not so if you watch every day, and especially if you watch several hours at a stretch.

I don’t have much to add, except to remind everyone that most popular culture is crap.

Music: for every Beatles there were 10 Paul Revere and the Raiders and 100 Gary Lewis and the Playboys. For every Mozart there were probably a thousand Salieris.

Books: For every John Steinbeck there are hundreds of cheap detective stories, formula Westerns and enough Barbara Cartland romance novels to clear a forest.

Film: Citizen Kane never had a sequel. Weekend at Bernie’s did.

Religion: Whether you like Him or not, there’s only one Jesus. There have been more Jim Jones and L. Ron Hubbards than you can count.

1.) James Burke’s series “Connections”, “The Day the Universe Changed”, “Connections 2”, and “Connections 3”

2.) Nova

3.) Masterpiece Theater

4.) PBS Mystery Theater (especially the Jeremy Brett Sherlock Holmes)

5.) “Police Squad!”

6.) “The Dick Van Dyke Show” (STill my choice for best comedy ever)

7.) “60 Minutes”

I’ll second Twilight Zone and The Prisoner and MASH. Outer Limits is, I think, pretty over-rated. They’d get their hands on a good idea and not have the slightest idea what to do with it. That said, some episodes were among the best SF ever on TV – “Demon with a Glass Hand”, “Soldier”, “Feasibility Study”, “Adam Link – Robot”