I’ve been in the market for a handgun, so I went to a shooting range/training academy today and tried out several of their 9mm semi-autos. I shot 50 rounds through each gun, approximately half at 45 ft. and half at 21 ft.
The first gun I tried was the Beretta 92F. I liked it; it had good kick and feel; the magazine was a little hard to eject, but I didn’t have any problems filling it or handling the weapon. Accuracy was good, about 92% of my shots hit the paper, and most hit the actual target.
Next gun: Ruger P93. It was the only gun that had a jam (and only one). It was good and smooth, but I didn’t like it as much as the Beretta. Accuracy was lower than the Beretta.
The last gun I fired was the Glock 17 (not the 17C). This gun was awesome with the exception of filling the magazine. I could never fit more than 7 rounds in the clip (the guy had warned me that it’s really hard), but wow was it smooth. My accuracy was very high: 23/25 shots at 45 feet and 24/25 at 21 feet and most of my short range targets were headshots. It had the least kick, no jams, and if I remember correctly, it kicked the least number of casings toward my face.
Before I make a decision, I’d like to go back and fire the Beretta and Glock again, putting at least a couple of boxes through each. I’ll probably also give the Sig Sauer a look, just to make sure.
But so far, I really like the Glock, and I’d like to hear others’ opinions on it.
I like the GLOCK very much. I personally have the Model 27 chambered in .40 S&W. It’s simple to use, simple to maintain, it breaks down quickly for cleaning, and it’s pretty accurate (as you have seen).
The magazine thing is pretty common with GLOCKs. I can’t load the magazine the whole way either. I’m not sure why that is, but there you have it. On the plus side, there are a gazillion pre-ban magazines that hold 17 rounds for the Model 17, so you can always upgrade from the standard 10-round magazines.
One thing to keep in mind is that GLOCKs, in particular, are notable for a phenomenon known as the kB!. The 9mm versions seem to be OK, but nonetheless you should only fire factory loaded ammunition and you hould never fire unjacketed lead bullets through the weapon.
I like the Beretta. The Model 92 (known in military parlance as the M9) is pretty standard, but just like any other weapon is has its flaws. For instance, an experienced criminal can literally disassemble the Model 92 in your hand if you get close enough, something that cannot happen with a GLOCK. Also, I’m not terribly fond of automatics with hammers, although that’s my own personal preference. The first pull is double action and it’s a bit heavy for me, although that might appeal to you, and the singleaction trigger pulls are too light. The standard GLOCK trigger is 5.5 pounds and is always the same.
The bottom line: you pick what you want. Your comfort and confidence is the most important thing.
My father was a gun dealer and we had a couple of GLOCK 17’s over the years. I liked them and police seem to like them. It is really all about the user-gun fit so go with whatever quality gun you like.
I feel the need to point out one thing though. Pistols do differ in accuracy but it can’t be determined in your shooting style and shooting level. The difference in shot patterns was because of how the gun felt to you and how you handled it. All of those guns are way more accurate than you know when shoot from a bench by an expert shooter.
I think the three biggest selling points for the Glock are
the lightweight plastic frame makes it easy to carry
the price is very reasonable, especially compared with other well-made guns – Berettas, HKs, Sig Sauers, etc.
the polygonal rifling in the bore adds a bit of extra muzzle velocity and accuracy compared to standard rifling in barrels of the same length. Polygonal rifling is becoming common in other brands though.
I’m not convinced that Glocks explode more often than other pistols. There are lots of rumors on the net, complete with photographs of blown-up Glocks, but in almost every case the detonation involves non-factory reloads, which frankly can cause any gun to explode. Some suggest that the polygonal rifling collects lead deposits more rapidly than standard rifling, so if you fire too many lead slugs through the barrel, eventually the gun’s going to plug itself up and turn into a hand grenade. Again, I think this is a reload problem. Factory pistol ammunition should be copper-jacketed – if you buy pistol rounds with unjacketed lead slugs, chances are it’s some kind of cheap reload, and you’d be taking a chance by firing it through any pistol. But if you insist on putting lead slugs through a Glock, you’re probably okay as long as you clean it semi-regularly.
Also, if a round explodes in the chamber of any plastic gun, you probably don’t have the same kind of protection you’d get from a gun with metal frame and slide. Again, this is probably a non-issue if you stick with factory ammo.
The Glock 17 was my first handgun. I have a couple other handguns now as well, but the Glock is the one that I carry–it is on my hip right now. I have never had any problems with it, and find that I am accurate with it. Some people complain about it pointing high, but I think that that depends on the shooter, and you apparently do not have trouble with it either.
There are many good weapons out there. All of them you have mentioned are good in my experience. Try to shoot the Glock at least once more before you buy, and try the Sig Sauer like you mentioned. I assume you would be looking at the Sig P226–very good gun. Try looking for a certified preowned Sig if you decide on that instead as the Glock; from what I have heard, they are just as good as a new Sig, and you would save about $200, which would out you in the same price range as a Glock.
I do not know how much more prone Glocks are to exploding to other handguns, but consensus seems to be that it is the .40 S&W weapons that are susceptible to it. It also seem to happen mostly with reloaded ammunition, not factory ammo.
Just to warn you, people have very strong feelings about Glocks–they either love tham or hate them. Many people complain about the lack of a manual safety, but I think that might be good on your first handgun–it teaches you to keep your finger off the trigger, instead of relying on the safety to keep the gun from firing.
First of all, referring to a Glock as a “plastic gun” offers the wrong image to someone not well-versed in material science. Glocks, and other polymer-framed handguns, are made from a reinforced polymer composite (typically some kind of e-glass fiber in a high strength polymer matrix). This has a tensile strength equal to or in excess of the popular aluminum-framed handguns and is less prone to cracking than either aluminum or steel frames. The Glock frame design has been noted as handling full power .45 Super, .400 Cor-Bon, and 10mm Auto loads that have caused failures in steel framed guns like the Colt Delta Elite and the S&W 1006. Polymer framed guns are somewhat lighter than aluminum frame pistols and definitely lighter than steel frame guns, to be sure, but the real advantage is their corrosion resistance–they simply don’t corrode and are resistant to normal solvents.
Second, there is an assemblege of people who, for whatever reason, have a vendetta against the Glock and perpetrate a number of misapprehenions and ill-founded claims about the propensity of this gun to misfire, slamfire, and explode. The gun has been torture tested by numerous law enforcement and military agencies that require the gun to maintain integrity with a blocked barrel and firing ammo that is well above SAAMI spec pressures. The barrel may bulge or split, but the notion that it will expode “like a grenade” is false. At worst (as happened with a number of pre-mod Beretta M9s in the sandy conditions during Gulf War I) the slide comes free somehow and ejects backward toward the shooter; a dangerous situation, to be sure, but nothing like a grenade exploding.
Third, while it is not common in autoloader calibers like the 9mm, you can purchase unjacked ball ammo. IIRC, Black Hills offers an unjacketed 124 grain 9mmP round, and of course hand loaded can cast and load unjacketed ammo for cost savings. Lead from unjacketed rounds can certainly foul polygonal rifling if the barrel isn’t cleaned with a lead-remover regularly, but I find it more likely that this would effect accuracy long before the gun would explode. In any case, poly rifled barrels are typically hammer-forged and are therefore considerably stronger than button reamed barrels. Lead deposit is a noted problem with gas-operated firearms like the gas-retared delayed blowback H&K P7 and Steyr GB, but that mechanism is (sadly) unpopular and those particular guns have been long out of production.
Fourth, let’s address the statement “if a round explodes in the chamber of any plastic gun, you probably don’t have the same kind of protection you’d get from a gun with metal frame and slide.” The slides of Glocks, and indeed, all other production centerfire handguns I can think of, are made of steel. The Glock, like the Sig-Sauer line of pistols, uses a modified Browning-type short-recoil with a reinforced locking block, which essentially comprises the reinforced chamber area of the barrel, and a cam-type action below that maintains the lockup integrity while the barrel is under recoil (i.e. while the bullet is travelling through the barrel). In fact, the entire operating mechanism of the gun is steel; the only stress the frame should see is in recoil (i.e. action of the slide once unlocked). There’s no reason a polymer-framed handgun would be more likely to “explode” than a steel frame pistol.
As for this specific model of handgun: after all that, I have to admit that I’m not a great fan of the Glock. I find its ergonomics–the frame angle, placement of levers, the funky trigger safety lever, grip texture, and so forth–to be wrong, at least for me. Its chunky shape isn’t partiularly easy to conceal, and the gun points all wrong for me–way too high. The trigger action is sort of crunchy, and the stock sights don’t acquire well. My preference for a stock pistol are the Sig P2XX series (aluminum framed) or the polymer frame H&K USP (I have yet to try out the P2000, but it looks interesting). Both are at the higher end of duty pistol prices, but not far out of reach. (I also like the ergonomics of both the Browning Hi-Power design and the CZ-75, but they’re single action and I’m not particularly fond of double action variants of either of these.)
DeadlyAccurate (heh), you don’t say what you want the gun for–self-defense, plinking, IPSC-type competition, what–but take that into consideration. The 9mmP is a fine round and inexpensive surplus ammo is widely available, but for a defensive gun I prefer the ‘major’ calibers like .40S&W and .45ACP, and these are almost a must for competition should you decide to go that way. Ultimately, though, you should select a pistol based not on what any ‘expert’ tells you is best, but on what feels and handles best for you and what is most reliable and appropriate for your intended purposes. If you like the Glock 17 and it shoots well for you, by all means buy it; it’s a quality firearm that isn’t going to ‘blow up in your face’ as long as you don’t fill the barrel with candle wax or fire a few hundred 9mm+P+++ rounds through it.
I have a 92F Beretta that has had thousands of rounds of all kinds through it and it has not malfunctioned in any way, ever. It’s big and awkward to conceal but it is dead-nuts dependable and accurate enough to suit me.
DeadlyAccurate, as was mentioned by yourself and others, make sure you try out a Sig. I’ve shot a wide variety of handguns over the years, including the Glock in 9mm and .40. I carried and shot the Beretta M9 for almost 15 years. My agency recently switched to a Sig .40 (P229 DAK) and hands down, that Sig has the best ‘feel’ of all of the handguns I’ve ever fired. At first I thought I’d hate it due to the DAK trigger sysytem, but shooting it was very smooth and accurate. It’s a very nice gun, although it’s a little pricey I believe.
While I’m not opposed to Condition 1 (“locked ‘n’ cocked”) carry, I’ll note that external safety levers have a way of finding themselves to the “fire” position. You should never rely on a manual safety to provide for safety. Rule #3: “Keep your finger off the trigger until the sights are on the target.” Following that rule will prevent the Glock (with its trigger safety) from firing prematurely.
But well worth the price, IMHO. These are some of the most reliable and accurate out-of-box pistols to be had, and as Scruloose says, they have great triggers without having to go through the expense and risk to reliablilty of a trigger job.
I probably would’ve tried the Sig yesterday if I hadn’t been starving and my thumbs weren’t so sore. My husband agrees that I should give it a try, since even though it’s more expensive, if it turns out to be a near perfect shooting experience, it’s better to save up the extra money and get the best gun.
I had a lot more fun than I expected to have yesterday, and whatever gun I get, I’m hoping to find some sort of load assistor so I can spend a few hundred rounds at the range.
And off topic, but yesterday we ran to the sporting goods store for my husband to find a paintball mask. Didn’t find a mask he liked, but we walked out of there with two airsoft pellet guns, Beretta 92F models, and 5000 rounds of plastic BBs. We had a grand ol’ time shooting a target in the foyer, (and then hunting down tiny pieces of plastic so we didn’t have to worry about the cat eating them.)