I mean, seriously. Sure, he’s approaching ancient and he’s showing quite a leftward slant in his attitude.
But how does his presidency fail? What is it about him that should make me facepalm the Democratic Party when he nudges Hillary out the door?
The fact that she can beat Jeb and he probably can’t. A self-ID’d socialist on the ballot would mobilize the RW vote like not even Obama could ever do.
He proudly describes himself as a socialist (or at least, as something which is just a slight shade of nuance away from being a socialist). A comfortable majority of people in this country are far enough to the right that they don’t want a socialist. That’s why the far right keeps trying to hang that label on the likes of Obama and Clinton, but there, the refutation is simple enough: They’re not socialists. With Sanders, though, that doesn’t work. The refutation needs to instead be “Well, yes, he is, but socialism is a good thing”, and that’s a much harder sell. It’ll work someplace like here, but it won’t work for the majority of Americans.
It’s unlikely that the Democratic nominee can win without picking up some middle of the road votes. We have a lead in the Electoral College, but not a lock - and, of course, we have the patented Democratic technique of stepping on our dicks. We’ll need to be able to attract all the “fiscal conservatives” who voted for Obama because of how hard George shit the bed. If we give them half an excuse, they’ll vote R again, and tell themselves that the Left is too loonie and they had no choice. Putting an actual socialist on the ticket is more than half that excuse.
Mind you, I’m not convinced that putting another Clinton on the ticket isn’t half an excuse as well, but we’ll see. I’m not convinced that we have a viable alternative, either, though, soooooo…
Except that whatever label you put on him, the positions Sanders is taking generally poll well.
So maybe Americans are more “socialist” than they realize.
Our so-called liberal media hates him.
First, he has a long history of being Bernie Sanders. Not exactly an overwhelmingly popular position with the national voters.
Second, Hillary’s machine seems to have sucked up most of the big money campaign contributors, and she’s still looking to make her $1 billion goal. Sanders will have to survive on millions.
Good luck Bernie.
If he does that then he will be, at least theoretically, electable. The trick will be doing that, of course.
If he does, I don’t believe that he will appeal to centrists or independents, and US presidential elections hinge on that. If Jeb gets the nod and he goes against Clinton then I believe the advantage will be with Clinton, since neither right nor left will be energized by either candidate (for or against), so it will come down to independents and unaligned or quasi-aligned centrists (like me :p). If it’s Bernie boy though, I don’t believe he will appeal much beyond left wing types, and he will definitely rile right wing types…and I don’t see him appealing to independents and centrists. Of course, that’s why he won’t beat Clinton (well, that and the money thing, which shouldn’t be handwaved as it’s pretty important).
Everybody thinks they’re a “centrist”. Well, most people do. But poll them on the positions Sanders has taken, and those positions are quite popular.
So I think this notion that you have to appeal to the “centrists” is wrong. You have only to put forward progressive positions that poll well. And there are a lot of them.
It’s one thing to be socialist, another to call yourself socialist.
You have to go where the votes are. And by definition, they’re in the middle. The Democrats have been winning national elections by running centrist candidates not liberal ones.
No surprise there–the Liberal Media, as well as the other departments of the Ministry of Propaganda–are owned by a few moneyed interests. “The News is just another show” to vector advertisements in your direction. the content is secondary and now I’m beginning to rant off topic. Sorry.
I get that. Socialism has been sold to us for decades as Communism Light, or as a gateway drug to Communism. And we all know Communism is E-vil. The fru-it, of the De-vil.
And the comments so far are all very accurate and valid in my opinion. I guess my skepticism is based on the premise we’re going to choose between a Jeb Bush and Bernie Sanders (I am convinced Hillary is going to flame out–her own actions as well as the relentless efforts of her opposition). It’s a no brainer each candidate will get his 15-25% of die hard R or D votes that even I could get if I made the ballot. That means just over half of the more central 50-70% of us will make an active choice:
A 3rd Bush: Dynasty, potential Middle East war hawks (2 out of 2 Bushes committed troops to the ME), implied deference to corporate welfare as opposed to applying government power to the benefit of Everyman.
A Hippie: whose pet topics poll well, whose more extreme views can be checked by congress, and then there is the inevitable Supreme Court appointments.
Well one point is wherever the economic polices he believes in have have been fully enacted they fail to a high degree. For the latest example check out the situation in Venezuela.
I, for one, prefer to live in an economic system in which there is toilet paper in the stores. I am sure the vast majority of those in the USA do also. That is why Bernie is unelectable.
If my options are Bernie or Jeb, I will gladly vote Bernie. Hell, I also self identify as a socialist, too, and I, too, would poll well on Bernie’s positions. But the old people, who do most of the voting, won’t stand for it. Aside from that, I’m not honestly convinced that Democrats can win with “Anybody But The Republican” strategy.
Also, I think it’s too important to get the presidency in the next four years that I don’t think we can afford to play around like we did 2000. Another Republican presidency means Ginsburg gets replaced by Scalia 2.0. It also means permanent military bases in Iraq and possibly Syria, with the concomitant world headaches that would ensue.
I like Bernie. I like him a lot and I think he’d do an ok job. But this is too important to take a chance on him.
What policies are you referring to, exactly? I’m fairly sure Bernie does not believe in sham democracy, mass expropriation of private property, or expanding the US energy sector.
RUN FOR YOUR LIVES! SANDERS IS AFTER YOUR TOILET PAPER!!!
That left wing rag, The Wall Street Journal, finds that liberalism is making a comeback in 2015. Bernie Sanders is infinitely closer to the American center than Ted Cruz or Rand Paul. The trouble is Bernie is that word “Socialism”. In a nation with socialized roads and socialized health care for seniors, it really shouldn’t be a dirty word. Yet it scares the bejeezus out of the ignorant masses. Sadly, it makes a national treasure like Sanders unelectable.
Nevertheless, see post #5.
Which might have been a problem sometimes in Soviet Russia. Of course, Sanders is no Stalinist, he is a West-Euro-style social democrat (which makes him a “socialist” by American standards, more’s the pity for American standards), and AFAIK countries where such politics and policies prevail have never endured a toilet-paper shortage since WWII.
But this isn’t some hypothetical candidate that has the positions that Sanders has. This is a specific candidate, Bernie Sanders, who is old and has wild hair and has previously called himself a socialist. I’d like to think that voters could overlook those things, but image and labels do affect people. I wouldn’t say that Sanders has no chance, but I think it will be really difficult for some people to get past the term socialist. They might second guess themselves and figure it’s better to go with someone else.
It’s like I’ve seen polls before where a generic Republican would beat Hillary Clinton. But it won’t be a generic Republican, it will be a specific Republican running, with his own history and baggage. People are influenced in voting by a lot of things, including superficial things like height. Polling is different regarding positions and actual candidates.
Sanders could maybe get across his message about how voting for him really would be for the best, but it would take money, and I’m not sure how much he has coming in.
I’d like to know if there’s been a candidate before who has views that line up very well with what a lot of voters want, but had a label that would hurt with the voters. I wouldn’t know how to search for that, but if there was one, maybe that can indicate how things could go for Sanders.
Here’s how Bernie can win:
- Hilary dies.
- One of the worst of the Republican clown car candidates gets their nomination, someone that even mainstream Republican get a bit nauseous about. Like Santorum maybe.
That’s not to say he will win such a race, just that he would have a decent chance at it.