Perhaps so. I don’t know that the Cybertruck front is low enough to make a difference vs. the F-150, but in any case the visibility is at least better in the Cybertruck and you’re less likely to hit someone at all. Regardless, the materials aren’t likely to be an issue here. Stainless vs. mild steel doesn’t make much difference vs. us meatbags.
Yes, but Tesla knows preciely where every single vehicle they ever sold is right now. And Tesla refused to sell Mercedes a car to take apart. The waiting list was long enough to make Mercedes do a silly thing. And I would not be surprised if it was Tesla who told the car rental company what had happened, not the other way around, but Tesla let them press the charges instead of doing it themselves. They would rather reach an confidential settlement with Mercedes back then (I bet they would no longer do so today, but way back then Tesla was a tiny operator and Mercedes the big bully). And Mercedes back then would rather pay than be exposed to even more embarrasment.
Sure they have, but Tesla is now in a powerful position. Regarding the Cybertruck they can refuse to sell Mercedes (and others) one. They can put in the sales contract a clause forbiding the buyer to sell it to a third party during the fisrt year and they do. They may include another clause that lets them swipe the memory clean of data and programs if they detect that someone is trying to read the data. Concerning data and computer I am sure Tesla is better than Mercedes, they could pull this off. They could even switch the correct data for false data undere their noses and Mercedes would fall for it.
If you wonder why I know so much about Mercedes: don’t ask and I won’t lie.
No, but people do spend thousands of dollars on body/paint work because even a shopping cart running into the side can put a giant dent in typical body panels. And they park at the far side of the parking lot because they want to avoid other people opening their doors into yours.
Conventional body panels aren’t just fragile–they’re wasteful. They carry almost no structural load. They’re almost purely for aesthetics and aerodynamics. Automakers have been making them weaker over time to save weight, but they’re still a waste. Occasionally they try plastics and composites, but those still kinda suck.
The Cybertruck is lighter than its competition, despite having the heavy stainless panels, because they’re actually structural and now exist for multiple reasons. It would be stupid to use stainless on a conventional design since the strength would be wasted. But here, they can reduce internal structure and save weight as a result.
Yes, and he’s said as much–that the 48v/ethernet architecture isn’t at all revolutionary, and really just bringing cars into the 21st century. Networking equipment has been doing it for ages. As you say, it’s a logistical problem. And I’ve mentioned before the difficulties in optimizing across supply chain boundaries. It’s not an easy problem.
I don’t particularly disagree here–it’s just that it seems to draw people out of the woodwork who chose this particular moment to criticize this brand of consumerism. Not accusing you of that–it’s just a general observation. People have been buying those F-150 Eddie Ranch Queen Bauer Edition trucks since forever, and those are worse than the Cybertruck in about every way. Just as many resources to build, and not electric.
Somewhere along the way, though, I lose you, since your end point is more or less “stop driving cars,” which I think is undesirable, and more importantly simply isn’t going to happen. The US is bad at public transport, and even excellent public transport sucks. Cars aren’t going away.
And really, neither are the trucks. As long as the monstrosities have a market, they should be electric, and we should figure out how to make them as efficiently as possible and as safe as possible for road users. All of which Tesla is making progress on.
Cars aren’t going away, but we could still use them a heck of a lot less than we do right now. Lots of people could walk, bike, or take public transit to work but don’t, and lots more could do so if people put a higher priority on living close to where they work, when choosing homes.
I don’t understand. If Tesla wasn’t willing to sell MB a car, then the length of the waiting list wouldn’t matter. More likely, Tesla was willing to sell MB a car, but unwilling to let MB get a car ahead of others on the list. After all, other manufacturers were able to get Teslas to dissect.
And why would Tesla press charges when the rental car wasn’t theirs? It was owned by the rental company, and the rental company was the aggrieved party because MB dissected their car. Tesla doesn’t care one bit about any buyer that wants to cut up or modify one of their cars.
No argument that we could do better with bikes and even public transport. And that all of this could be much better if cities were built sensibly. Well, cities aren’t going to be rebuilt anytime soon, but zoning laws and the like can be tweaked.
But suburbs aren’t going away, or truck culture, and we aren’t going to convince everyone to drive a Prius Prime, or ride bikes in 105 degree Texas heat or -40 Minnesota winters. So we may as well build what people will buy with maximum efficiency.
If a car company does not want to sell a car to another company, the second company can order one through an employee. There the length of the waiting list matters. Mercedes did not want to wait, so they behaved foolishly, dissecting a car that was not theirs, but only borrowed.
They did not, it seems. I guess they reached another agreement. Because Mercedes probably infringed on the terms and conditions of use.
I believe they do care.
I have known people who spend $80,000 on a lifted, off-road capable truck, then refuse to take it offroad because a dent or a scrape costs thousands of dollars. Or people with fancy trucks on a job site who spend their days worrying about people driving or working near their truck.
Also, for contractors and workers, tool theft is a huge issue. I don’t know any workers who haven’t had tools stolen out of the back of their truck at some time or another. That’s why so many have those big lockable tool carriers - but they eat up a good chunk of the bed. The Tonneau cover on the Cybertruck is lockable, and it would be harder to break into than the cab of the vehicle.
The same is true for many electric vehicles. Many of them will never pay back the CO2 emitted in making them.
But from a fuel savings and CO2 savings standpoint, electrifying trucks has a muchb bigger impact than electrifying cars that are already quire fuel efficient. Trading in your 40 mpg compact for an electric car will never pay back the CO2, and probably not fuel savings either. But electrifying a truck that gets 15mpg in the gas version is a huge win. Trucks also get driven more per year on average.
The Cybertruck has pioneered some features that help the planet though. For example, the induction motors don’t require rare earths. The 48V system and drive by wire are going to make it into future Tesla vehicles, and will force other auto makers to follow suit. This will save weight and resources, make cars drive better, and enable future electrical expansion. The new structural battery back withlarger cells saves material and weight, and allows the pack to provide full power even at low charge levels.
As the Hagerty review said, the wild shape of the thing is the least revolutionary part of it.
I’m not going to buy a Cybertruck because it’s fugly and Elmo, but I do need/want a truck. I currently have a 2010 Dodge 1500 which averages 16 mpg, which is pretty typical for a full size truck. Getting such a vehicle replaced by electric (or hybrid) is a pretty big deal compared to replacing my wife’s 36 mpg CR-V with a hybrid or electric. A Prius Prime is only a 40% gain over the CR-V, but a hybrid or electric truck is an immense gain over a traditional pick-up. Given their popularity, this is kind of where we should be focussing.
The goal, of course, is to not require CO2 in making them. Which is achievable since it’s mostly electrical input we’re talking about, and that can be CO2-free.
It also depends very much on the accounting. Teslas for instance use a lot of aluminum for weight savings, and that requires significant energy input. Probably more than the equivalent amount of steel. But even when the car is completely at the end of its life, you still at least have a giant block of aluminum that can be recycled for far less energy than it took to make. Things look much better for EVs when you account for recycling and reuse.
Great post overall there Sam.
Moving on from this bit (net of typos):
Countach was a very good idea. Well-played.
Following sorta in suit I’ll suggest an even better comparator is Hummer; both the original military look-alikes and the follow-on monster SUVs.
Hummers were, and CyberTrucks are, vehicles meant to scream “Look at me!!! I’m a trendsetting trailblazer unafraid to buck convention!” And ref @steronz frankly Utopian ideas they also shout “Screw you! I have money, like to spend it, and don’t much care who or how many I offend doing so.” Plus “My vehicle looks menacing just like my jerk-forward personality does”. The latter shouting is arguably the most important of the several messages CyberTrucks are meant to send.
I live in one of the 40 richest zip codes in the USA although my own digs (and bank accounts) are far from top-end by local standards. Ferraris and Rolls are everyday cars here. Mercedes G class are boo-ooring. One of my neighbors has 15 cars and they’re all high end or collectible. Assuming Tesla can deliver Cybertrucks timely, I am dead certain they will be commonplace here almost immediately. And in the other high end zip codes around the USA. As Hummers and (Countachs) were in their eras.
It may well be that some successful working dudes get them too. They’re not that expensive. I see plenty of $80K construction pickups with stuff in the back around here.
And these folks may discover that for urban (not rural) tough-truck construction use or maybe (shortish-ranged) boat haulin’ they work friggin’ awesome. At which point they’ll soon be the go-to vehicle for that market.
But a) they need to be delivered in quantity quickly, not like all the teething pains getting Tesla’s earlier models out the door, and b) they need to deliver on their functional promises.
The early omens are favorable on both those metrics, but they’re only early omens.
If you don’t need a full-sized pickup or extreme towing capability, I would seriously look at something like the hybrid Ford Maverick. Motor Trend saw about 35 mpg from it. And it starts at $35,000 not $80,000.
I’m selfish–I want the performance, too. Plus the Maverick hybrid is unobtanium as I hear.
In that case, I recommend dropping an LS-7 big block in a 1967 Chevy C-10. (-;
My buddies Rivian is just stupid fast, corners flat, has all kind of Easter egg features, and is a truck. Yes the CT is faster, but really the Rivian is plenty fast.
Any electric non-econobox is stupid quick.
I drive a very high end ICE rocket. I don’t fuck w EVs unless we’re already doing 80+.
Is “Multi” Italian for ugly?
Here is the Ducati Multistrada:
That’s just embarrassing. What were they THINKING!!
Are you saying MB infringed on the terms and conditions of use with the rental car company? If so, we agree. The car belongs to them, not the manufacturer, and rental companies don’t want renters disassembling and reassembling their cars.
Or are you saying MB infringed on some terms and conditions of use they might have had with Tesla? Why would there be such terms when Tesla was not the owner?
Mercedes infringed on the terms it had accepted on the rental agreement with the rental company, thereby infringing on the terms the car company had accepted when purchasing the vehicle from Tesla.
I think it is similar to borrowing a car from a friend and driving too fast. Your friend will get the fine in the post, but when he points to you as the driver (and the radar foto shows your face, not his) it will be you who pays the fine and loses his driving license.
Same if you borrow a computer and download illegal material: it is you who is responsible, not the computer owner. Proving who did the deed may be difficult, but in Mercedes case it was clear, it seems. And I believe the telemetry data that Tesla had contributed to that proof.