Stuck this in MPSIMS as I’m not sure whether anyone can advise me. Bit of a sounding board.
I’m playing a friendly game of poker tonight with around 5 friends. Low buy ins. No limit. I’ve only played 4 times so far and rather enjoyed it upto the last time…
First night: Won by a long way
2nd: Won by a smaller margin
3rd: Slightly up
4th: slightly down
My style is pretty tight and I only play a few hands, but when I do, they usually win. However, I was faced with a different player last time. He was extremely loose with his plays. When anyone stayed in with him, he bet big and invariably took the pot after folds. He was called a couple of times but usually won those too!
I’m torn as to how to play tonight. (Last time I had appalling run of luck btw, getting outdrawn on the river several times).
a) I just stick to my game plan and play few hands. problem is that people are cottoning on to the fact that I hit hard on good hands and fold on poor.
b) I mix it up. Could be useful early on to just dump a couple of mid strength hands to make them readjust their thinking.
Now I don’t consider myself a good player, but I would say that I’m better than 2/3 of the players there tonight. I expect this one fellow to do the same as last time and come in heavy on 3/5 hands… do I call his bluff or not?
Incidentally, I’m having trouble working out any tells on him and think that in fact he may have one or two of mine. If you have any tips for me please help.
Bear in mind that the most I could lose is really not alot. Spend far more in a night out. Yet, somehow I am very protective of my chips, even though they represent such small amounts.
What I’ve found works well is to play tight at the beginning. Let the bluffers lose out early, as someone invariably hits their flop when there are 7 or 8 people in the pot. The problem you have, is you’re playing with 6 people total. That means you need to play tight until the first or second person goes out, then ratchet up the agression. That doesn’t mean playing garbage, it just means that hands that weren’t too good earlier become much better the fewer people left.
When faced with an unusually agressive player, I usually stay out (especially if the blinds are still small) until I have a hand I think has a better than 50% chance of beating him…then I re-raise that person all-in, and take the chance to bust them. This is, of course, better done later when fewer people and high blinds make the risk less.
I agree with Jman. That’s how I play 6-handed sit-n-go tournaments, especially at low buy-ins. People will go all-in and bluff early and quickly the field gets whittled down. Yeah, you’re a short stack as a result, but you can work with it because the blinds will still be low. I’ve tossed hands I might be willing to play heads up or with a different group of players because the people playing are so aggressive and loose that I can hang back and let them knock each other out. In these sit-n-gos, only the top two pay, so being somewhat passive can definitely work in my favor. (I just won another one for a net profit of six bucks using the above strategy. Not much, sure, but it’s more for the fun of it.)
With this guy, you can let him be aggressive and fold to him as long as it’s not taking a big bite out of your stack. (Are you playing a ring game or a tournament setup?) When you finally have something–and it doesn’t have to be the stone-cold nuts, but it wouldn’t hurt–see if he’ll commit or overcommit. Yeah, it can backfire on you (my “favorite” bad-beat story is having a nut flush being beat by an inside straight flush on the river and Kyy loved doing it to me) but most of the time it’ll pay off. Hold back and let him open the betting. Depending on what you have, you can then either just call all the way down and let him drain chips like that or push back hard (maybe even coming over the top) and see if he calls. Just remember what’s on the board if you’re slowplaying less than the nuts and imagine all possibilities. You’re in better shape if you’re heads-up than if there are other players in the hand as well. For instance, I’d never slowplay a set with four or five other people in the pot. Too many chances of a suckout. Bet it hard, see if you can push everyone else out, and if not take it from there, being ready to fold if it looks like a guy might have hit his draw.
And as for tells at this level, forget them. Unless you’re playing with people that play the game at that level the same way they’d play at a much higher level, most people will only be playing their cards and not paying attention to things like tells. If you can get a reliable one, use it, but I’d have to say it’s not a big part of the game.
One thing I might try is a big bet with junk. Best done if you have a bit of a lead or are in position to steal the blinds (so say on the button with no previous callers.) Something like 7-2 offsuit. If they call, well, maybe you’ll get lucky. If they fold, flip 'em over and show the cards. Then never bluff again, at least not until much later in the game.
I don’t know that you have to bluff with junk, but it sounds like you need to loosen up your starting hand requirements a little. If as you say people are twigging to your only paying premium hands, you’re not going to get any action.
If I’m understanding you correctly, the player in question is letting people see relatively cheap flops, then betting hard no matter what comes up. If that’s the case, suited connecters are your friend. Get some cheap four way action with 78 suited, and be prepared to fold if it doesn’t hit, but be able to take his entire stack when it does.
Are you playing tournament style or is this a ring game?
Are there re-buys?
Without knowing too much detail, you could try and beat him into the pot with a reasonable, if not premium hand. Remember, 6-handed you really should start to expand your definition of playable hands. It sounds a lot like to me that he is taking advantage of the tight play of yourself and potetnially of the rest of the table. Since it is low buy-in, maybe experiment with your play, try bullying the bully. Although you generally do not want to show your cards if you don’t have to, you could show when you are bluffing or chasing a couple of times.
Although I don’t fancy myself anything more than an average poker player, I do play a lot of fake money poker at 25/50 Limit ring games (online), which means I see this type of player quite a bit. When people don’t care much about their stack (and I care about mine even though its not real money) they bet much more aggressively and you’ll see folks raising pre-flop with 9 3 offsuit, betting hard all the way though, and then either folding on the river if you stand up to them or pulling out a miracle and eating your lunch. It’s obvious their entire game-plan is to make it miserable to get into a pot, make it miserable while you’re in the pot, and then hope everyone folds. It’ll really irritate you. There isn’t any skill involved, they just care way less about the outcome than you do.
I’m not sure if this guy is the exact same type of player. I mean, is he loose because he’s really in tune with the table and knows how to push a decent hand to steal the pot? Or is he just plain dumb and happens to get lucky enough to squick people out when he bets?
Assuming he’s stupid and lucky, there are a few ways I handle this.
As already mentioned, stay out for a bit unless you get a great hand. Let him either A) eat up some of the other guys or B) get called and lose some of his stack which will probably cause him to tighten up a bit as well.
Change seats so he usually has to bet before you. At least that way you’ll know what he’s going to do before you’ve made your initial investment into the hand.
And as my third thought, I agree with Otto. If people nail you as a tight player you won’t get much action when you do enter into a pot. Sometimes a lost bluff (or even better, pulling off a miracle flop with lousy cards) will show people that just cause you are in doesn’t mean you have Big Slick.
Sat down to the table. He sat to my left… However, in walks our friend Phil. Wasn’t expecting him and he is a loose cannon and totally unpredictable. Even worse than the first guy but in a fun way. In short, this new guy totally upset his style. I lost my first stack pretty quick. Ring game, re-buys in between at will. Had a couple of big plays pretty much taking cash off Phil and the the player in question. Tripled up over the space of just a few hands.
I know I’m predictable, and the other players were none too shy in telling me that I dont bluff. But it works. And I figure I can use this to my advantage from now on. Obviously some players don’t fully believe that or they wouldn’t stay in the hand and allow me to suck big pots out of them.
Anyway, was played in very good cheer cept for the fellow in question who had a face like a “well slapped arse.”
Strange thing was that every player had pocket aces dealt to them twice throughout the night.
