I am pretty scared of big dogs like that, and my first thought was that the cops were probably in the right. After watching the video, though, I agree that they could have handled it better.
That being said, anyone who gets this outraged over a dog meeting a quick and untimely death needs to read the news a bit more closely.
It was a terrible situation. 95% of the blame is with the dog owner, and 5% with the cops. The dog owner was an idiot for not turning down the stereo. Don’t like the officer’s conduct? File a complaint. Don’t endanger you pet to prove a point.
I don’t think the dog breed matters. Most any dog would protect its master. I feel so bad for that poor dog. I wanted to cry.
The cops didn’t fail. A dog died, no humans were injured. Cops do not assume the risk of someone else’s dog. The dog owner does.
So I watched the new reporter’s version of the video and I don’t see what the cops did wrong. Sure they could have been more “dog whisperer” but I don’t see where they failed. They were getting attacked by a dog and they shot it. They have no obligation to let the dog bite them before they react.
Hindsight is 20/20. Its easy to think of ways to avoid problems after the fact. the whole thing (from handcuffing to dead dog) takes maybe 30 seconds. I don’t see why they should be expected to have done anything differently. I wouldn’t even spend time training them for that situation rather than some other situation where human lives can be spared.
Really? Then why all the outrage over cops shooting a dog that was attacking them?
Its not the only way, its the best way. I don’t want to train every cop to be an animal handler, I’d rather teach them how to look for signs of comestic violence or neglected children.
Thats monday morning quarterbacking.
Because humans and animals are different. I think that’s where you might be having your disconnect.
If I hit a person with my car, I have a duty to stop and call 911, if I hit an animal with my car, I don’t even have to slowdown.
Perhaps one day our descendants will look back with horror at our slavery and butchery of animals but I think they are just as likely to look back and wonder how people held the sort of stupid notions that the PETA crowd held.
The cops didn’t fire right away, shooting wasn’t their first response. Their first response was wait and see. They waited a while and then fired when the dog lunged at them.
Clear to us, knowing that at the end of the event that dog ends up dead. The cops may or may not have noticed the dog until it had already come out of the car. We have the benefit of seeing the entire scene play out with a wide view, distance, and hindsight. What we know and see when we watch that video is nothing at all like what each of those cops saw and were reacting to.
Do we know the circumstances and background? Did the subject come upon this scene while out with his dog? Hard to blame him for the dog’s presence. Yes, he could have minded his own business. But he wasn’t the only one watching. Crowds of cops draw crowds of spectators.
And it didn’t appear that he was objecting to any officer conduct. He was just filming the action, as indeed clearly several others were as well. His dog was irrelevant to the situation. He never threatened anyone with it, and in fact took the trouble to confine it in the car before answering the officers’ (apparent) summons.
Were it me, I’d have thought the cops were going to give me a ration of shit, threaten me, and then tell me to take my ass elsewhere, refusal of which could result in my arrest. I personally would have had zero expectation of actually being arrested at that point for – what? failing to turn down my music and filming some non-action by a bunch of police? Subject looked perfectly relaxed, as did his dog (until the handcuffs) and subject was totally cooperative while being cuffed and detained. The dog became agitated in response to the actions of the cops.
So maybe 50/50, or slightly higher on the cops’ side. They’re the trained ones, they’re supposed to be keeping people safe and situations under control. Not letting shit hit the fan.
As for the “aggressive dog” meme upthread, that’s just bogus. The dog wasn’t the least bit aggressive. It was calm and controlled while in the owner’s custody, then became agitated but not aggressive in response to its master’s distress. Even then its actions were more excited than aggressive. Had the cops backed off and let subject reassure his dog no further drama would have ensued. So on second thought, 70/30, cops more responsible than interfering man.
The way that situation deteriorated was eminently predictable and entirely avoidable. The police involved are fucking morons and certainly not safe to carry guns.
Were they deaf and blind? They saw the dog before, on the leash. We don’t know what was said, but they may even have told him to put it in the car and come to talk to them. His actions could support such a possibility.
Then they cuffed him and it was barking its head off out the window. Even if they weren’t proactive enough to take subject over to car and have him roll the windows up, once the dog came out they still could have simply let the guy walk away. He wasn’t going to escape, he was in cuffs and wasn’t resisting, he surely wasn’t going to hurt anybody. You don’t need to be Cesar Milan to see that holding the dog’s master with his arms behind his back, crowding around him, and (I am guessing here, but I’ll lay high odds) shouting at the dog and the guy is going to make the dog less controlled and more likely to bite.
Nonsense. Their first response was to shoot. They did not wait a while. The dog came out, approached them, and made a slight lunge/jump, and they shot it dead.
A dog that attacks people who are attacking its master isn’t “aggressive”, it’s loyal. Would you have a dog killed for chasing off a burglar or a rapist?
Yes, we do know the circumstances and background. The man being arrested had a prior claim against one of the officers that he was filming. He knew that not complying with the officers instruction, hell, hanging out at the scene never mind blasting music would lead to a confrontation. He was 100% being an asshole. He put his dog in danger to prove a stupid fucking point.
I would ask if you think that police officers placing a suspect under arrest are “attackers” equivalent to burglars or rapists, but we’ve taken enough detours into Moronville in this thread already.
OK, good to know. Still, I wouldn’t go past 50/50. Officers have an awful lot of discretionary power, but merely being present, and having music playing that doesn’t violate a noise ordinance, runs pretty close to Constitutional protections. I see nothing that required his arrest, but I accept that it may have been within statute and procedure.
But further, even upon arrest, I’ve identified two separate means by which the dog could have safely been taken out of the equation and all parties – cops, subject, and dog – could have remained safe and whole.
P.S. His ridiculous excuse for not turning down his blasting stereo immediately is that he wanted to “make sure nobody’s civil rights were being violated”
Question for the people (unbelievably) claiming that the dog showed no aggression: Do you dispute any of the following?
The dog was barking in the car.
The dog jumped out of the car.
The dog ran towards the officers.
The dog lunged at the officers right before being shot.
All of this was in response to the owner being arrested.
I mean, do you have some bizarre definition of “aggression” that you’d like to share? Or did you just really not pay attention to the video?
The context of his “excuse” seems to relate to his stopping and filming, not the music itself. I’m convinced that he was being provocative. But his dog was simply an uninvolved bystander that the cops could – and should – have negated as a factor if they decided to arrest the guy. It looks to me like there was spite on both sides. And the dog was the needless victim. So I’m still holding to 50/50.
Seriously? You are dealing with armed robbery suspects and some idiot rolls up in his car with the windows rolled down and the stereo blasting, you order him to turn the music off because you can’t hear what is going on, and instead of turning it off … he parks and gets out and walks his dog and films possible “civil rights violations”???
And you think the deciding factor in armed robber capture interference is if you violate a noise ordinance? He was being a total asshole and he has a history of being a total asshole and his dog paid the price this time.