The Black Vera Wang: West Wing 08 May

***** SPOILERS *********
I didn’t want to hijack Grienspace’s Was there an error in… thread but did want to discuss the merits of last night’s episode.

Overall I liked it, found it very tense. It was good that the silliness was focused on the Helsinki trip (see: Moose) and not on a particular character. No real romance or other things. My favorite part of the whole episode might have been the ever so slight roll of the eyes which Charlie made when POTUS asked him, “If Shakespeare were still alive, how many parts would he write about me?”

I had some trouble following bits of the political intrigue. Particularly, how could Sam’s counterpart (I’m drawing a blank on the name) leak their meeting to the press? Was he wired? If so wouldn’t that indicate to anybody of any mental power that the whole thing was a setup? If it was just his word, don’t they even attempt to verify sources?

Damn. I was hoping that we were going to talk about how CJ looked in that dress.

Well, how do you think she looked in that dress? I thought she looked ok but I think she looks better as just her. I liked her niece, btw, sharp kid.

The TV exec was absolutely correct, IMHO - political conventions are anachronisms that don’t warrant anywhere near the coverage that Toby proposed. Who needs a 4 day long commercial for either the Republican or Democratic Party?

I love the actress who played the niece (who used to be on the now-cancelled Once and Again), so I was all about the niece.

However, I don’t think the dress really “sung” on CJ. The tiny straps and blunt neckline emphasized her more “mannish” qualities. I’d like to see her in something a little more boobie-centric. :stuck_out_tongue:


Well, I’m not about the boobies, but you’re right, she should wear something that accentuates her assets. Ainsley could wear that dress, though.

Decent episode…

One thing I saw on the Druge Report that interested me was that the guy playing the GOP candidate will be James Brolin… that’s right, Barbara Streisland’s (ie, Mrs. Democrat) hubby. That is just amusing :D.

ShibbOleth, I didn’t see this thread. I just posted this to the other one. Darn you for coming up with it first, but I shall explain more thoroughly. Ha! Ha, I say!

I still don’t get the whole issue with the tape.
First, we have to assume that Seaborn’s friend was the one who secretly gave him the tape. That’s what was implied at least.
Now, assuming this is correct, the plan fails. Two scenarios occur:

  1. West Wing keeps the tape. Sam’s friend has no “proof” that WW has the tape and can’t accuse them of anything.
  2. Sam gives the tape back. But since no one SAW Sam give the tape back, there’s still no proof that WW ever had possession of the tape in the first place. Before the story breaks, any reputable reporter is going to call up someone in the WW and say “hey…this guy on Richie’s campaign in saying you had a tape. Did you?”
    the answer: “what tape? What are you talking about?”
    And how unethical would it be to lie in that situation? Because the only reason you’d be getting a phone call from a reporter in that case is when you were set up in the first place.

I’d have to say that it is unethical to lie in that situation. The whole truth would be far more helpful.
“Yeah, we did have a tape. Which we received unsolicited and anonymously. And then I, in a gesture of fair play and friendship, gave it back to my buddy. I am SHOCKED that he or someone on his staff would betray me like that by leaking all this to you. Kind of ironic that they’re pulling this kind of stunt about the ‘Clean Campaign Act,’ isn’t it?”

And plnnr is dead-on about the campaign coverage. It’s four days of unmitigated horseshit unless there’s the remotest possibility that either of the nominees won’t be confirmed.

Whad’ya do this AM Shibb sleep in? :smiley: My first run thru CS before 8 am, no WW thread.

Anyway, I thought this episode was a good set up for what is to come next. Do ya think that the guy in the white coat at Barney’s is THE guy stalking CJ? Do you think he was close enough to hear her say “What about the black Vera Wang?” Or is he a good lip reader? or is it something more insidious.

Do you think that Sam’s talk at the end of the episode with his buddy who had the tape will have no consequence? I just cringed when Sam grabbed for that guy. Sam is a lot of things but physically aggressive is not one of 'em. (At least I never pegged him as the bruise 'em up type.)

I have a question about the moose meat on eBay thing. I thought there was a rule that no government employee can accept gifts from anyone worth more than $20. (You turn your gifts over to the GAO and then you can buy them back if you want to.) So I’m assuming the moose meat was a gift Josh had bought himself for Donna, not a white elephant gift from the Finns that he was passing on to her. Question: why isn’t that meat hers to do with as she pleases?

When Mark Harmon sat down at the laptop and logged in, I thought it would be revealed that somehow he was the stalker. The way the music and camera angle played led me to believe that.

I’m alone in thinking CJ isn’t attractive.

If the stalker didn’t mind dying in the process wouldn’t it still be easy to kill CJ, even with one agent around?

When Mark Harmon sat down to go thru CJ’s e-mail, I thought, she didn’t look at her e-mail all day? or, She left before reading her e-mail, to see if there was anything she needed to do before she left? It was kinda odd to me.

Totally. Which I realized after a few seconds was the point, which probably means they’re double-swerving us.


Yes, you are. Please leave.


It’s an old saying, but it’s still true – anyone can kill virtually anyone if they’re willing to lay down their own lives to do it.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying she’s ugly. My words weren’t quite what I meant them to be. I don’t think she’s a knockout. In fact, I’ve never even bothered to wonder if she’s attractive or not until everybody started going on how great she looked whenver she wears a formal dress. I guess that’s what happens when you put a “woman in a man’s job” to quote her character.

Mark Harmon is still married to Pam Dawber right? Good for him. Lots of actors his age would have traded in for a newer model by now.

The press secretary likely gets so much e-mail that she can never get through it in one day. She probably responds to about 1/100 of all messages.

At some point, she probably just has to say to herself “Ahh, forget it.”

Besides, would you want to read your e-mail every day if you knew there was a stalker after you sending you death threats?

I would gladly have the Secret Service filter it for me.

I do.
Ok, maybe I don’t but I like them. I remember being sat down in front of the television during the 80 and 84 and watching them almost in their entirety. And I know that a great deal of what happened went straight over my head. But I still remember watching the speeches, and the pagentry, and the states entering their votes, and the people. I still think of it as being very symbolic of democracy (though the actual work is done much earlier and isn’t shown on tv, this is something that you can air.) My sister & I (who were 8 & 10 at the time) both still remember Cuomo’s “Tale of Two Cities” speech - which pretty much determined our party affiliation forever.

Even though I admit that it is mostly symbolic today, it is still important.

Loved CJ’s dress. And I was wondering if that was the girl from Once & Again. I couldn’t tell with absolute certainty. If Sorokin plays “I will always love you” I will never forgive him.

I liked the Bruno/Margaret thing. Cute and effective.

Well, since you asked, I am having trouble with my home internet so had to post from work. And I had to get my Diplomacy orders in (England is whooping up on me).

As for the stalker being close enough to hear what kind of dress it was. He could simply have waited for them to leave and then gone over to search the rack. If I were a Secret Service agent I might have contacted the store to see if they kept their surveillance videotapes. You can be almost 100% guaranteed that if they sell V. Wang they have a tape system. And not a cheap one. FWIW am I the only one that recognized the mall that they were in? It’s in Georgetown off of the main drag, I think Wisconsin? (I don’t live in DC but I used to live in Baltimore). I think there was a chase scene in that mall in No Way Out. It’s very upscale.

Do you suppose that CJ has only one e-mail ID? I have 4 right now, and I’m nobody. If I were a public persona I’d at least have a “fanmail” id and a private one for interoffice correspondence.

Finally (for now) when does the season go into Summer break? I assume that somebody will get shot in the final and their survival will be the cliffhanger. Maybe Mark will take the bullet for CJ and she helps pull him through at the hospital. Is this how they did the Rosslyn episode? (I’m probably the only one who can’t wait for summer reruns)

Um… as to how the stalker heard the name of the dress… be warned… this could be a spoiler…


It’s the niece.

It’s gotta be. She heard the dress brand name, she was there when one of the first pictures was taken (“That was when I took my niece out to dinner.”). She was asking very interesting questions of Secret Service Stud… and her character was introduced along with the story line. Also, there were no pictures with the recent email, because she had no chance to sneak off and shoot some.

So, I’m betting, it’s her. Why, I have no idea. But she fits the bill entirely.

So a 15-16 year old girl is sending very serious death threats to and somehow following the cool aunt who takes her out and buys her dresses for the Jr. Prom?

I see…