NETA, because editing is bad:
Oh, and as pedescribe alluded to above, I don’t have a whole lot of free time, so don’t expect Batman-level participation out of me in this game.
looks at the player list
Not that any of you would know about how much I posted in Batman, anyway. :smack:
Alright… so to catch everyone up on my current thoughts…
No one has brought up the possibility that Ostracizing could somehow make the lynch target change wincons and become a sinner or a darkheart. Or give the Sinners or Darkhearts the option to recruit them. That would be why there is no definite answer to whether or not the Ostracized person would be removed from the game. i.e. If we Ostracize a townie, he would become a Sinner or Darkheart… but if we ostracize a darkheart or sinner (whichever this applies to) then they are removed from the game similar to a regular lynch in a normal game. Am I the only one who thought of this? Wow…
Along the same lines as #1, what if a player is ostracized and they have the Seed of Sin within them? That could also trigger a recruitment to the Sinners. Again… no one else thought of this? Really? Where’s your head this game Ed?
There are possible reasons that an ostracized player could be more dangerous than someone with a bonus night kill, RYSTO. What if we ostracize the cop and his wincon changes? If he had stumbled on our doc and/or other power roles he could out them to everyone and help his new team win. that would be much more damaging to town than an extra NK.
See Joey P.'s answer, he’s correct.
We’ll find out tomorrow, now won’t we? 
While there are some ambiguities to what ped has said about ostracizing, I’m not too worried; I doubt he’s made the mechanic too unwieldy or OP against the town. We’ll find out more after we’ve done it for the first time.
Pede is pretty clear that Ostracization is a form of lynching. The difference being the player can “ignore the order and do something that night” But you are correct, there is nothing about putting the seed of sin within them.
And, on the subject of the seed of sin. IS there any indication that a Previously Pure Townie will know if the sinners plant the seed of sin within them? Or if it will change their win condition? or If it can be removed by prayer?
It seems that Ostracization is a voluntary removal from the game. I would guess the choice is up to the player themselves.
And why single me out for not having an odd thought? I’m trying to come up with my own odd thoughts. You do yours. kthxbai 
This is a very good point. We’ve been assuming that an Ostracized Townie would still be using their power for Town. There are 3 big assumptions here:
[ol]
[li]The Tpwn player would still have their powers (and not some different power for being Ostracized)[/li][li]The Town player would still benefit from a Town Win[/li][li]The Town player will still be able to communicate with us[/li][/ol]
You’re scaremongering, paul, and frankly that makes me suspect your motives. If what you say is true, then the Town would have no way of winning if the townspeople who get infected after an execution choose not to pray. I flat-out do not believe that pedescribe would create a game that broken.
What the hell, it’s Day One, the deadline is tomorrow and I haven’t seen anything else near this scummy.
Ostracize paul
D’oh!
Ostracize paul
I don’t think an Ostracized Townie will be able to talk to us at all. I don’t remember the novel well enough to comment on what happened there, but when religious groups like the Amish or (better analogy) Orthodox Jews shun their members, they treat them as if they were dead.
In fact, if it weren’t for Pedescribe saying that Ostracized players have a choice, I would think Ostracizing here would mean that the player is not allowed to participate but still counts in the number of players remaining in their team.
Quoth Rysto:
It’s not quite that bad, since we will know one source of Sin. If someone ends up playing Hangman, we know that that person at least has the opportunity to switch to Sin, so we should start looking for Sin tells (whatever they are) at around the point e made the execute vote.
Then there’s the possibility of the Sinners initiating the temptation. As I understand the rules, they can plant the Seed of Sin once per night, in a similar manner to how a normal scum faction night-kills once per night. And a player so infected must know that they’re infected, otherwise they wouldn’t be able to make the choice to Pray or not. So every Morning, whomever got infected should declare that as soon as possible. If nobody declares that they were infected, we should suspect that someone is joining the Sinners. Alternately, if you’re analyzing a particular player for Sin tells and that person did declare infection at some point, that’s where you consider that that player might have converted.
paulwhoisaghost, even if we suppose that there is a downside to ostracization, we’ll find out soon enough. If we ostracize someone and they keep on playing, well then, we have an easy lynch target for the next Day. That doesn’t seem too damaging.
That’s the part that gets to me, The Pstracized player can ignore the Town. It almost sounds as if nothing might happen to them. It’s still an unknown.
That’s very damaging. That means it’ll take us 2 lynches to lynch a person AND someone will end up with the seed of sin in them anyway, since we’ll have to execute them.
From the rules
"Also, on lynching. There are two ways to lynch: Ostricization and Execution. If the town ostracizes a player, there’s a chance that that person might ignore the order and do something that night, but it is the morally appropriate way of clensing the town. Execution ensures that the target won’t come back, but as killing is always sinful, the last player to vote for the execution is infected with the seed of sin. "
From what I can tell the ONLY differnce between execution and ostracization (As far as the lynchee is concerned), is that when someone is ostracized they can use their power role that night* after that they are dead and gone.
*not much help for a investigative type role, but if they are a roleblocker/protector/have a NK/etc, it could be useful to their team.
That’s my reading, too. The lynch is the Town’s primary weapon for winning the game; if pedescribe took it away from us we wouldn’t stand a chance.
I think JoeyP’s understanding of ostracization is the same as mine. What he said in post 372 is what I have thought and acted upon.
I know there is a chance ostracization does not lead to removal from the game, but as for now, I doubt that and I think it is the better option for the town. If we learn toNight or toMorrow morning that we were wrong, then that will be a big surprise and we will learn the difference and be able to proceed from there.
It doesn’t say they can use their power. It says they can “do something” I think we’re assuming that that ‘something’ is to use their own given power. It diesn’t say that. Maybe an ostracized person gets a different power. Maybe they are a one shot Vig as they go away. Maybe they can choose which side they’d like to win with. Maybe the something they do is actually use their power, but it doesn’t say that, and I don’t feel safe assuming that.
Attention! Attention!
Bear_Nenno will be subbing in for Justin Credible. Please give him a kind welcome.
This means that, if GuyIncognitto shows up, I’ll finally have resolved all attendance problems!
Sup, Bitches!!
Alright, this is some complicated shit. It’s 2138 my time, so don’t expect to hear from me until a bit later… like tomorrow! I’ve got some reading and finger-pointing to catch up on! Thanks for having me!!
Note that special ed is also doing this.
Also, we may be wrong to assume that there is no way to remove sin without prayer. The Scarlet Letter did contain two priests and this sounds like their sort of thing (i posted a character list way back at the beginning, there’s dimsdale and someone else).
Some rules questions are deeply important, and some are wanking. This is more on the level of wanking. If you’re right about the game, then things are fairly unbalanced against the town. Besides, we have a very easy way to find out all about ostracizing. Special Ed, I’ve even done you the courtesy of nominating you as the test case. Aren’t I being thoughtful?
Are you thinking a protector, or are you thinking that there may be a power role that can remove the seed of sin from someone? And if it’s the latter, I’d wonder if they can only do it to PPT, or of they can do it to a sinner, do they have to ‘get permission’ or can they remove the seed regardless of if the person wants it or not?
You’re missing my point. My point was, that I didn’t know.
And so, you think you’ll find out what Ostracizing does?
What if it does something that’s not apparently visible. Do you trust me to tell you the secret parts that I might know after being ostracized?
My main point here is:
We are making assumptions. We need to keep an open mind. We don’t know what might happen, and we might not know what happened even after it happens.