The Devil....

What is the significance of the DEVIl holding a trident wherever he is pictured?

Its not a trident, its a pitchfork. Very useful for poking souls bobbing around in a lake of burning sulphur.

Was I mistaken in Posting in General questions for intelligent people or General Questions for bumbling numskulls, CMon

Nu, you have a different answer then maybe?

Actually, it usually is shown as a trident, probably ripped off from Neptune. The Christians liked to make aspects of their devils similar to pagan Gods. Palidors, you’re hardly going to get much response if you insist on being insulting, particularly to respected posters like Dr. F.

“Eppur, si muove!” - Galileo Galilei

Someone told me this once, and I am not claiming this is the truth - just passing it on. They told me that in ancient times, whenever there was a peasant uprising, the peasants would use whatever available farm implements they had as weapons. Mainly, pitchforks. The wealthy landowners caught on to this and began depicting the devil with a pitchfork in order to discourage the peasants. They guy that told me this is an utter moron, so I tend not to believe it, but it does make for an interesting story.

Palidor, DrFidelius is far from a bumbling numskull.

Be nice.

If you’re an optimist, you haven’t been paying attention.

The pitchfork/trident is supposed to represent torture, since souls in hell are supposed to be undergoing torment. The trident is indeed probably a borrowing from Neptune, but if you go with the pitchfork angle, then you get into Pan, who was a sylvan/agrarian deity; Pan is also where the image of Satan gets the cloven hooves and horns. (Cf. also the goat god of Northern European fertility cults, later Wiccan.)

Does anyone have a cite for “devil with pitchfork” that pre-dates Dante? IIRC, he first used the image.

Tridents are neater to draw, that would be why the iconography has shifted.

Pickman’s, Pan was indeed a sylvan diety and that’s where we get the model for the devil, but I have never heard of him connected with farming or crops. That was Demeter’s bit.

“Eppur, si muove!” - Galileo Galilei

The male deity of many pagan religions is usually referred to as the Horned God. (Most depictions I have seen show him as having the antlers of a deer, though not hooves.) He may be the agrarian deity to whom Pickman is referring.

Pan, the Greek demigod, is not usually associated with crops. He was a sylvan being, i.e. associated with the forest (not the fields). The myths tend to imply that he was too busy chasing nymphs to bother much with plants.

Of course I don’t fit in; I’m part of a better puzzle.

Correct me if I am wrong, Auraseer, but I didn’t think the Horned God was a agrarian deity, either. Certainly not to the point that he would be depicted with a pitchfork. Usually fertility and crops were associated with female Gods. The only Horned God I know is the leader of the Wild Hunt.

“Eppur, si muove!” - Galileo Galilei

Actually, Pally, I think the significance is that the Underwood Ham people can hit you up for a royalty each time you use their corporate logo . . .

All in favor of transfering all Palidors threads to the Bumbling Numbskulls forum?

You guys are just tempting arg arent you? :wink:

Mike King—

Hell, go for it. What’s the next fuckin’ question on this enlightened list, the chicken and the egg?

“…send lawyers, guns, and money…”

 Warren Zevon

In many pagan traditions, the Horned One (also called the Green Man) is seen as the personification of the land or the seasons. He dies at the end of the year, when winter approaches, and is reborn in the spring when life returns to the land.

So he’s not a farmer per se, but farmers would consider him very important. And no, he doesn’t carry a pitchfork; I think that bit of the devil’s costume was taken from Neptune.

Of course I don’t fit in; I’m part of a better puzzle.



What? he didnt ask that yet?

Palimino…dont diss the doc.

Cecil also makes the Devil-Neptune connection regarding the Trident.

Speaking of Trident, who wants gum?

I do! I do!

If you’re an optimist, you haven’t been paying attention.