The FBI may have failed to thoroughly investigate Clinton - Tracking Thread

I agree that it doesn’t directly contradict you, which is why I phrased things the way I did. But the rationale he offered for not wanting to get involved with the Comey firing - that it could conflict with the Mueller investigation - could logically apply to other Trump-Russia matters as well. So that would imply that the investigation has not been expanded.

In addition, the article does mention that the Horowitz report could impact the Trump-Russia case, but doesn’t mention that he is specifically looking at it, which seems like a stark omission if true.

Is there a full transcript anywhere? The only thing I could find was this, which seems ambiguous on the subject.

That’s just Clinton being Clinton. You need to loosen up.

He got Strzok removed from Mueller’s team, so I don’t think he’s avoiding Mueller in the sense that a vampire would avoid Holy Water and the Sun. They each have their own investigation and there’s no value in investigating Obstruction of Justice against Trump when another perfectly good investigator is on the job and it matches his mandate more closely.

There’s sort of one here:

https://www.c-span.org/video/?438042-1/fbi-director-responds-president-trumps-attacks-agency&start=562

You’d do better to just watch the video, I suspect, since it doesn’t give the names of the speakers.

I gather that video is several hours long, which is several hours too long for me. (I couldn’t get that c-span transcript to work altogether. What I’m looking for is one long full text transcript, so that I can search for instances of “inspector” and get any replies that mention him.)

I guess we’ll see eventually.

Search works on it. Just take note of the timestamps so you can undo the search and find the questions that were asked.

Here’s about half of the material related to the Inspector General.

Thanks.

From this quote, it seems to boil down to what “the 2016 investigation” and “the prior matter” mean. I think both of these refer to the Clinton investigation.

What Wray is saying is that once the IG finishes investigating the Clinton matter we’ll be able to better assess what ramifications that has for the Trump investigation. The focus of these questions was the Clinton investigation, and the (presumably Republican) questioner dragged in the Trump investigation by saying “hey, the same guys who were favoring Clinton in the Clinton investigation were also involved in the Trump investigation”, to which Wray responded “let’s arrive a clearer understanding of what happened in the Clinton investigation before extrapolating to the Trump one”.

I don’t believe that’s the correct reading.

If you say that Mueller is investigating the question of Russian interference in the election from a criminal prosecutions standpoint, then that’s something we all agree to as being his mandate. You can find it in writing and there’s no secrecy to that fact.

If you ask whether Mueller is investigating is investigating the question of whether Trump laundered money for Russian mafioso, all you would be able to say - given policy on discussing an open investigation is to say nothing - is that the mandate for Mueller is to investigate Russian interference and any investigations on money laundering would or wouldn’t flow from that as evidence allowed.

OR, you could answer by saying that the question raised - money laundering - would fall outside of the purview of the Special Counsel, and a new investigation would need to be undertaken.

This latter answer you would give if you didn’t believe that the question would reasonably arise and follow as an obvious and necessary continued investigation from the original.

But if you believe that the investigation would reveal information of the sort to lead down that path - if such evidence existed - then you would give the former answer.

I don’t understand what you’re saying. (Sounds like an analogy.)

He’s not allowed to say. All he can say is that it would fall under the purview of the existing case if that’s the way the evidence leads.

So you’re saying that Wray has not explicitly said that the IG is investigating the Trump-Russia investigating but in your assessment what he said is consistent with what he would have said if that were the case. Is that correct?

He’s confirming that it would fall under the purview if the evidence lead that direction.

I’m inclined to trust Horowitz (the Inspector General). He’s an Obama appointee, people on both sides of the aisle have praised his previous work, and one has to assume that the FBI office that backed his recommendation did so on the basis of testimony and evidence that Horowitz shared with them:

Granted, McCabe’s firing doesn’t seem to have much to do with the Clinton investigation in general, but it does seem to have been an action favorable to Clinton. And since McCabe did it in tandem with Lisa Page, that would imply that she (and her work that would affect Clinton) are equally under question. Page isn’t just under the gun for having an affair or whatever.

I believe that we have further investigation of Clinton because Republicans never stop clamoring for an investigation of Clinton, and they won’t stop until someone gives them the result they want. After this, we’ll need special counsel to explore Uranium One, donations to Jill McCabe, collaboration with GPS Fusion and everything else already judged as criminal acts in the vacuum-sealed fact-spaces in conservative heads. An investigation that doesn’t yield felony charges is therefore not a good investigation, it has been corrupted by the Deep State, so there needs to be a new one with higher quality people, etc. It’s noise.

But I also believe Comey’s testimony to Congress to be the dodgiest thing I’ve ever read and I didn’t have a lot of confidence in it. He did speak publicly about Clinton being investigated ten days before the election; he did tell Donald Trump repeatedly that he wasn’t being investigated by the FBI, so if he tells the truth infallibly we can assume that Trump was not being investigated by the FBI as Comey was in possession of the dossier, talking to the then-President-elect, months after receiving it. Whereas they jumped on Anthony Weiner’s found laptop the next day.

And that is the critical juncture where I wonder what is it exactly the FBI does, besides politics, at the highest levels. Specifically, what was the departmental process behind what we’ve been told, that it was a judgment to inform people about one of these things and to conceal the other. By all means let’s find out.

I am not inclined to believe Horowitz, not because I distrust him personally (I know little about him), but because common sense tells anyone with half a brain that something is rotten in Denmark. My understanding is that in civil service terminations there is a normal process that is followed, and it is a process that does not adhere to tight deadlines or timeless – yet this one inexplicably does. Given all of the hyper-politicization of the DoJ the last few years, you cannot simply assume that the bureaucracies are free of political bias. That is not the world we live in anymore, Sage Rat. I acknowledge it’s possible that McCabe actually may have leaked to the media and lacked candor – that’s possible. But the unprecedented manner in which he was terminated leaves a lot of doubt that his case was handled objectively. I don’t trust a president who publicly urges the termination of career employees – not to mention a president who has told more than 2000 whopping falsehoods since becoming president – to be more objective and more truthful than the person he fired. I don’t care which career civil servant put his stamp on McCabe’s termination – this is Trump and Sessions all the way. This is, and never will be, regarded as anything less than a politicized termination. Period.

Based on some more information from Lawfare, it sounds like they fast-tracked McCabe’s termination review process and didn’t get him time to respond to the allegations. So the recommendation to fire may have been a “recommendation to fire, given the facts that we have, but not necessarily the facts that we should have.”

Still I think that, while it’s probably safe to say that McCabe is a decent guy who believed that he was acting in good faith in his job, that doesn’t mean that he didn’t - for example - decide that the Clinton investigation was a “Republican conspiracy theory” and treat it as such, rather than investigating it with an unprejudiced mind and communicating with the press about it in the same way that he would have communicated with them if it had been a real investigation.

And if that’s the case, and that’s liable to be his defense, then he would prove it by finding others at the top level of the FBI to agree with him that the whole thing was Republican conspiracy nonsense that they couldn’t be bothered to act on seriously.

And if he did that, then he’d basically be proving everything that the Republicans would need to go to town on the top ranks of the FBI.

Even if we assume that the Clinton investigation was a load of political, partisan nonsense, the FBI cannot ignore the directives of Congress. You can’t have a rogue secret police organization that’s not beholden to the Legislature. If Congress tells them to waste their time on something stupid, then they have to do it professionally and thoroughly. Anything outside of that, while less demeaning for the agents of the FBI, is a path to madness, and the people in Congress are aware of that.

It’s probably just as well that McCabe did get the axe, before he was able to prepare a response. But it’s also possibly true that he didn’t do his job professionally, according to the word and spirit of the job he was given, and the FBI is purportedly held to that standard.

In other news…

The Republican party is slowly moving towards starting a competing investigation to Horowitz’s.

I feel like they’re in a hard place. I think they want to turn the story to Clinton, rather than Trump. (The Clintons really needs to stop doing things to make headlines, FTR.) But there’s no value in doing so right now when they know that they’re just going to do a worse job of finding people to prosecute for anything than Horowitz will and it’s far too soon in the year to impact the midterms. But at the same time, I think that they’re worried that Horowitz will simply prove that the FBI was 99% in the right on everything and that, beyond some spit and polish, there’s not much that Congress needs to do. And once his report comes out, it has the potential to take the wind out of the sails of anything they do attempt to do on this front later.

That they’re waffling is certainly telling the considerations are mostly politically-based rather than evidence-based.

The questions quoted are so stilted it’s ridiculous. The last one is a straight translation of the Nunes memo, before the fact.

Allegedly, FBI policy would be to fire Sztrok and Page for having an affair, so the fact that they are still in the employ of the FBI is quite strange. The New York Post posits that they are being kept on by Horowitz in order to help his investigation:

I question much of that hypothesis. It doesn’t seem like one would need to keep people employed in order to use them for an investigation, nor would you offer to maintain the employment of two people who have committed a firing offence. You might offer to write them a letter of recommendation or give them a nice severance package, but you wouldn’t be like, “Oh yeah, now that we’ve had to discover that you’re a questionable employee, we’re all okay to keep employing you!”

So I am curious, if the NYP’s statement that the affair is a clear and unambiguous firing offense, what is going on?

I don’t even know if the NYP actually made the statement that an affair is a clear and unambiguous firing offense. The closest that that writer says that is “the two hadn’t even lost their security clearance — which is unheard of, I’m told, even when FBI agents are caught having extramarital affairs.”

Which has a few assumptions. He is “told” this, by whom? I don’t see anywhere in these articles that actually shows a policy, clear or not, that states that having an affair is a firing offense. Not saying that there is not, but this article does not back that assertion, and trying to google to find any sort of policy just keeps bringing up FBI office of public affairs. Are we sure that there is such a policy, before we go on to speculate as to why this policy wasn’t followed?

Also, it is not even the NYP that is positing that hypothesis, but merely one of his readers, "“The reason why the lovebirds haven’t been fired is because they have been granted immunity at some level or another because they have agreed to cooperate in the (Justice Department’s) Inspector General’s investigation into the corruption within the leadership of the DOJ/FBI leading up to and immediately following the 2016 election,” speculated one of my readers., though the author does go on to agree with the speculation of his reader, “Yes, that actually makes lots of sense.”

The OIG Report (warning: pdf) on the accuracy of statements made by McCabe is online. It appears McCabe was found to have had difficulty keeping his story consistent with his counsel and with the FBI Director regarding leaks to the WSJ regarding the Clinton Foundation investigation.