For the most part they are looking good. I would like to see them complete a drive with more than a field goal, but overall I’m pleased.
Wow, how bad is Cincy’s D? Cle has 41 on them and there is still 6 min left in the 3rd.
Was a good show by the Steelers. I’m pleased with our first two games.
As an aside, I thought the refs did well. I don’t recall any plays that were badly called.
Boy, that division looks easier and easier. I thought it was a typo when I saw that the Brownies rang up 51 on Cincy. As it turns out, the joke’s on them.
I really, really need to see at least a summary of that game.
I mean, WTF? Almost a 100 points? 6 TD’s by Carson Palmer? 5 by Anderson?
What did they do, ban the use of hands on defense?
And now that I look at the summary… 215 rushing yards by Lewis? Johnson (ocho-cinco) 209 yards receiving? Were they playing an exhibition game or what?
Did I miss some announcement banning defenses in Ohio?
It appears so.
Here is the summary. It looks like a box score from a college football game.
It has precedent. The Browns vs Bengals games now have 2 of the top 8 highest scores of any NFL games in history.
So, hey, check that out, the Browns season isn’t over yet. How novel.
The Ravens just barely squeaked past the Jets. 20-13, but the Jets dropped the ball in the end zone at least twice that I saw.
Unless they get much better I don’t see them as a threat.
Since there’s no general football thread going that I can see, and this relates to the AFC North, I thought I’d say it here.
The Browns O-line is clearly for real. Heavily revamped this offseason.
Cinci pressured Baltimore all day last week and forced a lot of turnovers. This week Cinci got almost no pressure at all on the QB all game long. No sacks, and almost no hurries.
And while hot-young-media-attached-to-Balitmore’s-testicles-McGahee put up 70 yards against the weak Cinci run D, “washed up” Jamal demolished it for 220.
You could point to last week, but if you watched the game closely the pressure was rarely the fault of the O-line, who provided pretty good protection. The sacks were the result of Frye holding the ball for an absurdly long time, as usual. And you can’t really get your running game on track when you’re down 17-0 pretty early.
There’s a very good chance that after years of huge problems, the Browns have the best O-line in the AFC North.
Wow, does 75% of our division suck! I called last week the clash of the incompetents between Baltimore and Cincinnati. Then the Browns and Bengals played!
The Ravens did better, squeezing out a win against Chad Pennington’s backup, but only just. Not too impressive.
Well, except that they did allow six sacks in their first game. I know, you want to attribute all of that to Charlie Frye - maybe even the one that came against Anderson, too. But against the Steelers, they managed a total of 46 total rushing yards. Washed up Jamal Lewis did look pretty washed up with a total of 35 yards.
Perhaps you’re right. Me, I’d point to the Steelers line (207 total yards rushing in Game 1, 186 total yards rushing in Game 2, and only one sack allowed in each game). But I’m just crazy like that. I’m sure the season will tell.
Please, stop right there
Last I checked, this thread as for the glorification of the Steelers.
Get your own thread Brownie 
I think that is perfectly fine to rag on the Browns, Ratbirds and Bungles, but lets have none of this , "
I mean come on… :rolleyes:
No, this thread historically has been a place for NFL discussion. Since the Steelers are my favorite team it naturally leans that way, but the fun is when other people wander in here for their beatdowns. So far I’ve only been one for five, so usually it’s me that gets the beatdown, but what the hell. If you can’t talk smack during football season what fun is it?
Charlie Frye took 5 sacks in 10 attempts, and Anderson took 1 sack in 28 attempts, IIRC. Unless you want to say that the O-line purposely tanked it and sucked for Charlie Frye, that’s pretty clear evidence that, just as he’s been doing for years, Frye creates his own sacks.
As far as running - because of repeatedly turning the ball over on our side of the field early on, it was 17-0 pretty quickly. You don’t have a running game in that situation.
The Steeler’s O-line has always been overrated in general, however they are among the elite in run blocking. Their pass blocking has never been great, and Ben’s possibly underrated pocket presence (at least in his first 2 years) helped to cover that up.
Relating to fantasy football, I argued with people that Jamal would look better here than he looked in Baltimore because the Browns had a better O-line (among other reasons) and people scoffed at me. The Raven’s O-line has been getting by on the rep they built up between 2000-2003 or so, but haven’t been very good in years. Now we have a direct comparison - both teams have played the Cinci defense.
Baltimore’s O-line was dominated as there was pressure on almost every single play, forcing a lot of turnovers. They ran for something like 70 yards. Against the same defense, while executing more plays total, the Browns O-line allowed 0 sacks and if I recall correctly Anderson never got knocked down and rarely pressured. And Jamal Lewis is now the leading rusher in the NFL.
At the very least, Cleveland’s O-line is clearly superior to Balitmore’s. Probably better than Cinci’s, which had the best overall line when they were healthy, but they’ve been banged up in one way or another for quite a while. Pittsburgh’s definitely is in the running. I did say “chance” because it’s not clear yet, but considering Cleveland’s line is only playing it’s second game in its current form (only 1 starter returning to the same position from last year), it’s going to surprise people.
If putting up 51 points in week 2 isn’t surprising enough, that is.
But continue your scoffing - we’ll see how you feel later in the year. I’m not predicting great things for the Browns - we still have a bottom 3 coach in the NFL running the show - but strictly in terms of O-line talent, they’ve gone from bottom feeders to potentially elite. And our best offensive lineman, at least pre-injury, isn’t even playing.
I have Jamal on my fantasy team, pretty sweet, huh?
He was on the bench and I lost.
D’oh!!!
I had both Edwards and Lewis on both of my fantasy league, all benched.
So here’s some crappy news for me (and good for the rest of the AFCN):
He was my favorite to replace the Retarded Walrus In Charge next year.
Clearly you’re very excited about one good game. Who am I to poop on that? It’s pretty darn cute. And it would be nice to have a real rivalry again with Cleveland - the perennial sucking has gotten a little boring.
Just color me skeptical. Next week, it’s another clash of the incompetents, when Cleveland goes up against Oakland. I guess we’ll see in Week 4 how many yards Jamal Lewis gains against the Ravens. I wouldn’t be surprised if Najeh Davenport gets more yards in Week 4 than Jamal Lewis.
By the way, Travis Henry is the leagues’ leading rusher. He’s 16 yards ahead of Jamal Lewis, who is 16 yards ahead of… Willie Parker. In terms of team rushing, the Browns are 8th in the league. The Steelers are 2nd.
I suppose the only stats that matter are 2-0 versus 1-1 (or 34-7, which has a nice funny ring to it).
If it matters at all, there’s November 11th, when the Browns visit Pittsburgh.
I’m not declaring we’re going to the superbowl or anything, and it wasn’t just that game. I’ve been pumped at the potential at our O-line all offseason.
Compared:
Left Guard - 2006 Joe Andruzzi 2007 Eric Steinbach
I’m listing this first because this was by far the biggest problem on the line. As we’ve learned from Andruzzi and McGinest, the Patriots have a pretty good idea of when to let players go. Although I don’t want to lump those two together entirely - unlike Paycheck McGinest, Andruzzi actually seemed to be doing his best.
He had an okay 2005 because he compensated for his failing knees with his veteran savvy, but by by last year his knees were gone and he was an open door on the line. Some people started calling him “matador” Andruzzi. Even a good line would be dragged down by a link that weak.
Left Tackle - 2006 Kevin Shaffer 2007 Joe Thomas
Kevin Shaffer gets a bad rap because he was blamed for a lot of the left side penetration that was Andruzzi’s fault - either Andruzzi missed his block, or Shaffer missed something when he was trying to help Andruzzi who was getting beat. He’s not great, but he’s a solid NFL tackle and IMO we would’ve been better served drafting Adrian Peterson because Shaffer would be more than adequate with Steinbach next to him. Steinbach is regarded as one of the better guards in the league (I personally think he’s a little overrated in some regards) but he was the best available free agent - I hated the size of his contract, but then I saw lesser guards get the same, or bigger, contracts, and I figured that’s just the size of the market these days. I’d rather draft a good guard prospect in the 2nd round for cheap.
Joe Thomas - drafted #3 overall. I only watched his bowl game, but I didn’t like what I saw. They say you can spot an elite left tackle just by watching a series, and I didn’t. That said, he’s done better than I expected in some areas, and worse in others. His run blocking is surprisingly good, I’ve been watching him throughout the preseason. He sprang that 66 yard Jamal TD run by manhandling Justin Smith. His speed against pass rushers was worrisome. Elvis Dumerville owned him in the preseason… he lunged too much and lost his balance. In his bowl game he looked like a quick technician who would be at his best against speed rushers, but so far in the NFL it’s been a mixed bag. He also is too weak against the bull rush - right now he’s the type of lineman who uses quickness and leverage to steer the other guy around, rather than stonewall him, but if he makes any mistake and loses balance or leverage he doesn’t have the strength to make up for it. That said - LT is a hard position to start at, and rookies rarely do. He’s done well all around. He looks smart though (when he gets beat by something he adjusts well to it) and is reputed to have the work ethic you need to succeed at a high level. I would be happy to have him prove me wrong about not wanting to draft him.
Center - 2006 Hank Fraley 2007 Hank Fraley
The only position that’s remained the same, which is somewhat ironic given that Cleveland, IIRC, went through 9 centers last year, with Fraley being the 9th. In general I’ve been happy with his level of play - you look at him and you don’t think “athlete” - he’s got the pot bellied lineman thing going for him - but he can really move and hit people on the second level, especially on screens. He’s a competant veteran anchoring the line. LeCharles Bentley, who, pre-injury was arguably the best center in the game is currently rehabbing on the PUP list. His story is amazing - some of the best doctors in the field didn’t think he’d ever walk right again, but he’s pushing himself so hard that he’s almost in football shape. There’s a chance he sees action this year, but if not, then next year.
RG - 2006 Cosey Coleman, 2007 Seth McKinney
This is the position I’m least sure about. Coleman wasn’t too bad last year, but rarely any good. He was certainly not a gaping hole like Andruzzi, but you could probably replace him with just about anyone and not notice a drop off. McKinney I don’t know that much about either - he’s younger… I get the impression he was regarded as an up and comer until a neck injury took him out for a year. I’ve been paying a lot more attention to the left than the right, so I haven’t watched him too much.
RT - 2006 Ryan Tucker 2007 Kevin Shaffer.
As I said, Shaffer is a solid tackle. He’s a good enough run blocker to be able to do well on the right side, and he can backup LT. Ryan Tucker is still around (suspended until week 5) and is a solid, if aging, backup.
Overall, the line was dramatically revamped - you sneer at the idea of Cleveland having a good O-line because they’ve sucked in the past, but they’ve substantially upgraded almost every position (with Steinbach over Andruzzi being by far the biggest - it alone would’ve turned our O-line from bad to okay).
Parker will, and it’s always tough to run against the Ravens, but I doubt Davenport in a secondary role is going to outdo Lewis. I don’t expect Lewis to have a realistic shot at the rushing title or anything, but I expect 1200/9 out of him this season at the low end. He will most likely outrush Willis McHehe.
Woops, I must’ve jumped the gun when I saw the NFL.com stats page and maybe Travis Henry was still playing at the time.
I’m not saying we’ll beat you, or that we’re even good - I’m specifically talking O-line. This team is hampered most importantly by horrible head coaching, and everything from there on down suffers because of it. Second biggest weakness is bad quarterbacking - Derrick “5 touchdowns” Anderson this week might become Derrick “5 interceptions” Anderson next week, you never know. Quinn I’m starting to believe in, but all rookies struggle.
That said, I’m starting to be optimistic that we don’t finish in the AFC North basement this year. I see the rats tanking big time, and I don’t know how exploitable Cinci’s defense will be through the rest of the year.
He did in Week 1: Davenport - 43, Lewis - 35.
But hey, honestly, you’re excited for your team, and that’s cool. Good luck!
Fair enough. I don’t think Balitmore’s defense will own Cleveland’s offense as much, and more importantly, Baltimore’s offense isn’t going to blow out Cleveland. The rushing yards the first week were from a lack of attempts because Cleveland wasn’t in a position where running was an option for most of the game.
Pittsburgh has mostly owned us for years, but last year Baltimore barely beat us by a last second field goal the first time, and didn’t thoroughly dominate the second game.
It’ll be much closer, and hence, more running. Plus I’d imagine Jamal will be giving something extra for that game.
Balitmore is not that good, and Cleveland is not that bad… hopefully.
I’d say the Browns have more talent than the raiders and have beat them in recent years, although the Raiders are hungry after a game like last week. Opening the schedule 2-1 would do a lot to salvaging the season.
Thanks. I’m a homer, but I’m not blind. I would like to think I’m knowledgable. I can see the faults - I just get really optimistic around the bright spots.