I 100% agree with you. It’s great that we are all talking about mental health problems more, but what we aren’t talking about is how to cope with those problems, without also throwing in a ton of misinformation via TikTok or YouTube or what have you. And I’m just really skeptical about the value of online spaces for people who share mental health disorders. It’s always been a mess whenever I try to engage in those spaces. I have PTSD and the amount of misinformation about PTSD not just being proliferated by laypeople but actual professionals makes me genuinely outraged (I recently started a deep dive into therapeutic pseudoscience and have been learning about polyvagal theory, which is all the rage right now despite it relying on false ideas about neuroscience.) And sort of at the crux of all this is the idea that mental health problems should in all circumstances in every case be accommodated in whatever way the sufferer wants. That’s not how life works. There are always going to be cases where people have genuine limitations and need specific supports in order to reach their full potential, but there are a ton of people out there who aren’t doing the thing because for whatever reason society isn’t making them do the thing, and that’s really what’s holding them back.
Hey, have I told you about Beast Academy yet?? Your kid might be a bit too young still, but this math program saved my kids’ sanity and it’s so fun.
Heh, that… wouldn’t surprise me. My spectrum kid definitely has had a lot going on with her mental health. We’ve been doing a looooot of work with emotional regulation since practically day one and I think that’s finally starting to be in a better place, so now maybe we can start working on the social anxiety that started cropping up in a big way with adolescence. Sigh.
I’m so glad you had your church group, and could surround yourself with the right people. I’ve been reading some about childhood abuse and how basically the kids who turn out okay had other people who were on their side – it’s scary to think how fine that line is sometimes.
I had to quit tumblr basically because I got in a set of people who had depression and talked about it a lot. It’s not quite the same as I’m not generally susceptible to depression myself, but I could feel myself getting more depressed when they talked a lot about it.
Yes! I’ve thought about this a lot as regards my daughter. Ideally I’d like her to know that there are things she has a hard time with (well, she knows that) and that ideally she’d get some accommodation and grace from others. But she can’t expect that, especially from people she’s just met who don’t know her and her life story – and so she will sometimes have to make an effort to do these things that are hard for her, even if her preference is not to. (Obviously, it’s different if she really can’t do the thing at all, or if it’s so hard that it’s debilitating – but I think most of her difficulties are not in that realm.)
I’m going to try and contribute to this thread, but I’ll need some time to get my thoughts together. I grew up on a farm, where my brothers and I worked long hours and had limited opportunities to interact with other kids outside of school and church. All three of us have dealt with anxiety issues, and the middle brother has barely been able to function despite talents in many areas. My wife grew up in the suburbs with successful but emotionally unavailable parents. Our kids have both suffered from anxiety, but have gotten professional help. Our daughter has the double whammy of anxiety and being LBGTQ, and is making progress in her mid twenties. Our son didn’t put forth much effort in high school, but killed it in college and has been living independently since graduating in 2022. For over a decade I’ve worked in a school that draws students from all over DC, with several kids who have been sheltered or protected from consequences. Others have lived with incarcerated parents or worse. I’ve seen a lot of change over the years, some due to Covid and some not. I’ll try to flesh things out over this long weekend.
I am a parent of two teens and there are certainly differences in the environment I was raised, Internet was only a thing later in High School and no one had a phone.
It’s never been easier for care givers to neglect and outright ignore a child. It’s never been easier for that child to find entertainment and not need other people. I grew up in a healthy environment but many of my friends did not, neglect was just never an option then for those bad parents they always had to do something with the kid, bowling, park, pond, something. Now just put and iPad in their face.
However I will say, at least in our school district, the children’s mental health is far more a priority that it was in my day and I think the kid’s need it. So many don’t have important life skills they would have acquired far earlier had they daily interactions with many people.
The violent video games are a distraction for a kid with no other social or intellectual outlet. And that’s the problem I think schools recognize even if they can’t change the home life. The kids aren’t alright and we don’t even yet know HOW they are not alright.
I mean, my kid was one of those non-driving, non-dating kids who spent a lot of time on her (unsupervised) phone, who moved to NYC when she was 18, found a job paying over $50k a year, has been completely independent (financially and socially) for the past 3 years, while putting herself through college w/ no student debt, so who the hell knows?
In addition to what has been mentioned, I think one contributing factor not yet mentioned is the western diet. There continues to be an increased consumption of highly processed junk foods. IMHO high fructose corn syrup in particular will turn out to be a major culprit contributing to the increased rates and severity of childhood depression. Assuming we survive as a society and such things are studied in the future, we’re probably going to end up blaming high fructose corn syrup the way we ended up blaming leaded gasoline for certain problems in prior generations.
It seems like I see more fighting between students every year. This started before Covid, and has continued after. Cursing and talking back is also on the increase. There are kids who will angrily deny they’ve done anything wrong even after everyone saw them do it (wonder who they got that from). Look how adults are behaving in a very public way. Is it that surprising that kids are doing the same thing?
The behavior of students has the adults in the school on edge. We managed to keep most of our staff from last year, but there’s a lot of absenteeism. I’m done after this year; I just can’t do it anymore. I’ll take my pension and get a part-time gig where I can do my work and not think about it once I get home.
Every generation faces predictions of doom, just as elder sages constantly fret about disrespect, depravity and now depression afflicting the young. 
How many of those predictions were based on sober scientific analysis as opposed to the ravings of religious fanatics?
Anyways, I don’t think it’s hopeless - in the “how will humanity end” thread I voted for “heat death of the universe.” But you have to admit, it’s a lot grimmer than in the past.
It depends what you’re talking about:
Climate: definitely. Based on sober scientific analysis.
Economics, ehh not so much. Economics barely qualifies as a science at all.
What? Can you explain what you mean here? Your definition of “neglect” may be different than mine, considering I don’t think bad parents “need” the internet to be neglectful…
IAN Sitnam and cannot speak for them etc., but I read that statement as implying something like:
“It has never been easier for parents to just outright disengage from their kids than it is now. Back in the day, even neglectful parents at least had to interact with their kids to the extent of finding known activities for them to participate in—going bowling, running around in the park, etc.—and dealing with the kids at home. Nowadays parents can just provide what’s effectively an entire alternate mental universe in the form of the internet which the kids can inhabit almost 24/7, while their parents maintain basically zero awareness of what they’re doing or thinking in most of their lives.”
And that’s what’s producing the deprivation regarding “daily interactions” that I think Sitnam is talking about as being a growing problem for kids.
Agree w you @Kimstu that that is what @Sitnam meant. I’m not so sure it’s much true.
Yes, the www / internet is new versus my childhood in the 1960s & teenhood in the 1970s. Many kids got ignored back then too, either plopped in front of a television, or told to go outside, don’t be noisy, and stay the hell away from the parents while they drank, watched TV, fought, did whatever without being bothered by the sprogs they never wanted.
Whole lotta people of my era got raised by being fed and little more. And not always even enough of that.
Concur, but I think Sitnam has a point (if our elaborate fan-fic’ing of what Sitnam seemed to mean is even relevant to what they did mean) that the modern style of parental neglect can be especially pernicious because it’s more immersive.
Ultimately, if you’re a neglected bored lonely kid in the pre-internet era, you’re at least somewhat incentivized to go seek out some of the actual interaction that your parents are refusing to provide you. Your beloved books and TV, however much you may rely on them to nourish your attention and imagination in your isolated state, aren’t going to talk back to you or acknowledge your existence. What relieves your isolation is finding and interacting with actual real-life people (some of whom may be very very not-good choices for companionship, but that’s a whole other volume in the Abuse and Neglect Diaries).
The internet of today is next-level alternate universe.
Granted. The internet is far more immersive and it’s far easier to hide inside it. I’m doing that right this minute.
There’s an old saying that mankind created god in his image. Meaning we came up with just the thing that scratches out spiritual itch. Not vice versa.
Mankind created the www in his image too. But it scratches many of our worst itches in the worst way.
A lot grimmer than the Great Depression, the Dust Bowl, fascist dictators taking power in Europe, WWII, the Cold War and threat of mass nuclear destruction, assassinations and riots in the 60s etc.?
C’mon.
The kids are alright, or at least not vastly more screwed up than they’ve ever been.
Enjoying this discussion. Thanks all.
I feel very similarly to the folk who discussed the pendulum swinging, and looking forward to it swinging back closer to center. I don’t think people have directly mentioned a couple of parenting methods.
-These days, I see toddlers given so many choices over so many minor things. It is not just, “Go to the kitchen sink and wash your hands.” Instead, it is, “Which sink would you like to use?” Yeah, I know there are some theoretical benefits from phrasing it that way, but some things just need to be done efficiently without overthinking. And you have to get used to NOT having a choice about so many things. I’ve seen many scenes in which a kid seems paralyzed over not being able to make a choice over some really minor thing. Or getting overly worked up when they DON’T get to make a choice.
-Re: getting worked up, I often see parents talking AT LENGTH with kids about their feelings - instead of just saying, “You aren’t allowed to carry on like that over something minor.” Or, “You don’t get to scream and yell in public.” And sometimes, “Because I said so” is all the explanation needed.
Please don’t think I’m advocating a return to repressing all emotions and choice. Just a couple of things I’ve noticed that are vastly different from when I had kids - or was a kid. I can’t imagine running a household like that, and - done to excess, I question the long term implications.
I know what you mean - but how much does it really matter if the toddler washes their hands in the kitchen sink or the bathroom sink? I think to some extent the toddlers being given so many choices are reactions to the parent’s own childhood, when they weren’t given any choices. ( and of course, some are because the parents were given those choices as children) I’ve known many parents who got into power struggles with kids about things that don’t really matter , such as whether to wear the red T shirt or the blue T shirt or whether the kid ate corn flakes or rice krispies for breakfast. And I used those examples for a reason - I’m not talking about kids wearing shorts in a snowstorm or demanding pancakes for breakfast when everyone else is having cereal. But in general , if a red T shirt is appropriate for the weather and the occasion, so is the blue one. And sure, there are going to be situations where there is no choice involved - but someone is going to choose the sink , the T shirt or the cereal.
Of course not, but kids have attention that needs to be distracted for a parent to do anything non-kid related. If a parent is neglectful they will want this a lot. In the past the parent’s only option was to take the kid to other kids or let the kid play with others perhaps in organized sports or an after school program like Boy Scouts.
Now the kid can easily entertain themselves and all it costs is a Netflix subscription and an iPad, no other interaction required. The kid doesn’t garner the skills to meet and hang on to friends and so easily convinces themselves humans are not worth the trouble and goes back to their insular electronic world. Also do not need a drivers license in this electronic world where they feel most at home with their few electronic human friends or none at all.