Are you really saying that kids didn’t have unsupervised playtime or the ability to entertain themselves before electronics?
Yes, my parents had plenty of time to do non-kid related things. They accomplished that in various ways, from having four of us (built in playmates to some extent) to sitting us in front of the TV to sending us out to play until lunch/dinner/dark with the other neighborhood kids.
Yes, that is what I think. 
Another thing I’ve noticed/suspected - I seem to encounter many families in which the kids do not have much in the way of designated chores. Of course, it seems more common (in my area) for folk to hire out housecleaning, yardwork…
This is wild to me that you think this. My parents were not at all neglectful (indeed they were more like helicopter parents than most) but I remember frequently getting kicked out of the house and going biking and exploring with my sister for hours without any parental supervision whatsoever (not even a cell phone! because we didn’t have them!) and also days where we literally watched TV for hours. (remember Nickelodeon, anyone?) (Not many days like that! Usually mom and dad weren’t into us watching too much TV. But there were definitely days where it was the easiest option. And I certainly knew kids who watched TV like that on a much more regular basis.)
Haha, lol, well, I was that parent, to a certain extent.
-Toddlers get upset about everything (true story: Older Child once got upset as a toddler because I was walking in front of her, the horror!) and also generally speaking don’t have a lot of choices or autonomy at all, so the basic idea is to give the kid at least the illusion of autonomy. Those toddlers who got overly worked up when they didn’t get to make a choice… would have gotten worked up regardless of whether their parents let them make choices at other times.
However, that being said, Older Child would freeze up as a toddler when given choices sometimes, because her brain would perceive it as a question to which there was a right or wrong answer, and she’d often just flip out.
Oh, the joys of having a neuroatypical child. Older Child knew perfectly well she wasn’t allowed to carry on like that over something minor, and that she wasn’t allowed to scream and yell in public. (She’d get sent to her room so she could scream and yell in her room.) I also talked to her at length about her feelings (though are you seeing this while the kids are screaming? Because that’s not useful at all). But she still did it. Her brain just wasn’t developed enough, and once she grew up a bit it all worked a lot better.
I also knew I wasn’t allowed to have crying meltdowns when I was a child, and I got a) yelled at A LOT, b) spanked a couple of times, c) a lot of emotional manipulation tried on me (“do you see how much you are embarrassing us??”) and… it didn’t work. My brain wasn’t developed enough not to do it, and also in retrospect a lot of those meltdowns were because I get hangry (which my now-husband figured out decades later). Not only did it not work, my takeaway was “uhhhhh, why do you think that yelling at me will STOP the meltdown, it clearly just makes me feel worse which makes the meltdown worse?? Don’t you have any rational capability to be able to realize this?” and it just ended up with my not having a lot of respect for my mom’s critical thinking skills.
But I agree that this is also a pendulum thing. While there are reasons to do it that way, there’s also the standard that some behavior is acceptable, some is not, and although there are reasons that a particular child such as mine might not be able to hold to the standard, at least I think it makes sense to be aware that there is a standard! This is a trickier line for me, though.
Lastly, I will say that I have always hated because I said so as a reason, but I’m also the parent who will drone on about “well, we do it this way because it’s a cultural standard, and while you may not see the point of this particular cultural standard, you are sending a message by not adhering to them which might not be the message you want to send --” and my kids probably wish I said “because I said so” instead!
When my daughter was four, I had some work I had to complete instead of playing with her. She tried to argue with me about it, and I said, “I can’t play with you now, it’s not negotiable.” She screamed back, “YES IT IS! EVERYTHING IS NEGOTIABLE!”
I busted out laughing, which probably wasn’t the right response. But I also learned that she was a kid who needed to understand the reasons.
Fast forward to this past weekend, when the same kid–now fourteen–saw me being stressed about how our clothes dryer was broken. She looked up from reading and said something like, “We should be using a clothesline, so we’re doing something for the environment.”
I wasn’t best pleased, given how much work I’d already done that day and how she’d been enjoying her novel. So I suggested she look into setting up a clothesline. “We’ll just hang it from the bird feeder poles,” she said.
I started to explain why that wouldn’t work, but stopped myself. “Tell you what: I’m putting you in charge of this project. Research how to set up a clothesline and the materials we need. I’ll give you the money to order these materials, and you set it up, and we’ll use it.” She wanted me to do the research, but I refused: if she wanted to do something for the environment, she needed to put the labor in.
About an hour later, she was back on the couch, having completed the research. “Every site says we need to dig three-foot holes and fill them with concrete and put the poles in those holes, so I don’t think we can do it.” I told her I thought it’d be something like that, and she got really annoyed. “If you thought it wouldn’t work, why did you make me do the research?”
Some kids will accept “because I said so.” Other kids won’t.
Know your kid, and know what they need to do to learn.
Edited to add: my kid is freaking amazing, and I’m super-proud of her. This story isn’t about her doing anything wrong, it’s about her needing to learn in a specific way, and about how “because I said so” would be exactly the wrong way to parent her.
That’s one of my biggest concerns with my kids (Boy age 9 and Girl age 6). Boy is highly functioning on the autism spectrum and his main interests are Lego, Lego or brick-based videogames like Minecraft or Lego Worlds, or YouTube shorts about those topics. Girl also feels compelled to have a screen in front of her if she has to sit still for more than 2 minutes.
I’m more concerned with Boy because he doesn’t really have any friends and doesn’t make efforts to socialize. And unfortunately these interests allow him to just sort of occupy his own world where he is in control of everything.
For both kids, just staring at screens for hours seems like a massive time suck to me. And I actually like watching TV and playing videogames. But I feel that’s time that could be better spent reading, drawing, really doing anything that will build actual skills.
Of course, these days we can’t just kick them out of the apartment until the streetlights come on.
Oh nice! I think it’s really great that you had her do the research. I definitely err too much on the side of telling my kids stuff, but they would learn a lot more if they had to figure out the reasons for themselves.
I have another secret weapon phrase I use, with students and with my own children, in response to the combative/whiny “But WHYYYYY?”
I cock my head curiously and say, “Do you want an explanation, or do you want an argument?”
About half the time, the kid realizes what’s going on, and accepts the forthcoming explanation. If, after telling me they want an explanation, they argue with explanation, I feel no compunction against saying, “Oh, you told me you wanted an explanation. I’m not here for an argument, and I’ll remember this, next time you tell me you want an explanation.”
It’s a little more time-consuming than “Because I said so,” but I do believe kids deserve to know why decisions are made, even when they don’t like the rationale.
Oh! I have a secret weapon phrase with this one! “Why do you think?” (Said in a reasonable, mildly questioning tone of voice.)
Often I get a smart-alecky reason back, but that’s usually when the kid actually wants an argument rather than an explanation, and it usually defuses things down. Sometimes the kid actually tries to figure out why, which is great.
I read an interesting article about this recently, that noted that in the worldview of “gentle parenting,” the adult’s feelings don’t really factor into the equation. “Gentle parenting” IMO is an outgrowth of other trendy parenting things like “co-sleeping” and “attachment parenting” that eventually turn into the Mommy suffering Olympics where the goodness of one’s parenting is predicated on the extent of one’s sacrifice (at least as I observed it in online forums - obligatory caveat that I think you can do attachment parenting or co-sleeping or any kind of thing with your kids without it being a status thing, it’s just very much a status thing online.) And personally I don’t think that’s a healthy message to send to my kid - that the world revolves around his feelings and I should sublimate all of my feelings in service to him. He’s got to learn that he’s not the only member of this household.
In contrast, I was raised in a very strict environment where it was reiterated to me repeatedly, literally, in these exact words, “You are a child. Your feelings don’t matter. You have no rights.” I had no right to speak out about horribly unfair treatment, neglect and abuse. Obviously I am not going to raise my kid that way, either.
I once saw in the wild on the internet that a parent’s primary job is to create space for your child to feel anything, without judgment or repercussion, and it really stuck with me given how I was raised. But I also need my kid to differentiate between being able to express any feeling and always getting his way. The goal is to teach him to navigate his own feelings in a healthy way when things don’t go as planned/wanted. This is something I was never taught, that I had to teach myself, and I’d rather it be easier for him.
He’s three. He can’t control his outsized emotional responses to things. But we try to strike a balance. When he’s upset, we comfort him briefly, as in, “Aww, I’m sorry buddy, I know you really want more YouTube, but it’s been a long time and it’s time to turn it off.” If he’s REALLY upset we hug him and coach him through some deep breaths (sometimes as much for us as him!), then we tell him, “It’s okay to be upset. But you can’t have X thing right now. You can have X thing later.”
At which point he says, “You can have X thing on [insert random day].”
“Sure.”
Then he’s fine.
I think I have the most reasonable three year old in the world.
I wouldn’t say chill, exactly, because he has very rigid ideas about The Way Things Should Be. He has to brush his teeth with These Songs and he requires These Eight Things to sleep and there’s only one way to play with toys, ever, and that’s to form them into the shapes of numbers. Those are just aspects of his autistic brain.
But his default state is happiness, so it doesn’t take a lot to nudge him back to happy. I hope to God he stays that way. I don’t want him to suffer like I did. But part of the reason I suffered is that I didn’t know how to navigate my own emotions until well into adulthood. And that’s something I think is going to be easier for him because we try to model it every day.
I understand your concern but I wonder if it is as much of a concern with an autistic child? Is he happy? Something I ask myself. When I see my kid playing by himself in a room full of kids I think, gosh, how horrible for him, but you know, he just doesn’t care about that right now. He’s usually having a blast by himself. So I think it could depend on the kid and what genuinely makes them happy.
(For the record, I also retreat into a world where I’m in control of everything - my fiction writing. I can see the appeal.)
I might say it’s never been easier for well-intentioned otherwise thoughtful parents to neglect a child. My kid is doing well but my own daily phone use is a constant struggle, I’ve had to implement rules to put my phone away and discourage him from using it except for teeth brushing. I feel like I’m not as present as I could be. But it’s often hard for me to gauge whether my concerns are reasonable or I’m being too hard on myself. (I also have to say, I frequently find myself spacing out when I do spend time away from my phone, so my attention regulation is a factor here beyond just cell phone use.) Lately I’ve implemented phone-free Wednesdays and Fridays so I just sit with him while he eats dinner and we play silly word games.
I’m on the fence about that one. There’s a study my daughter (a therapist) described to me which revealed that people tend to have one of two approaches to problem solving. The first is a belief that if you try hard enough you’ll succeed. The other is that, if you aren’t already good at something there’s no point in trying. It’s obvious that the first one is healthier, right? Except for example, me. I am gifted. I taught myself to read when I was three. I’m 99th percentile in verbal and written skills. I always have been. I also sing, write novels, dance, draw and paint, and make art with textiles, clay, and really, anything. What can’t I do? Anything that involves numbers. It really doesn’t matter how much effort I make, I have dyscalculia and I have the math skills of a third grader who is bad at math. So I am that second person who believes I will only succeed at things I’m already good at. Now I’m old, and having tried my hand at many many things I can say with some certainty that my belief is not inaccurate.
I’m also an example of an introvert in a world completely designed for extroverts. It won’t make me more adjusted to what to me is an enormously loud, shallow, crowded, stress-filled, and ugly world to say, “just try it, you’ll enjoy it! Learn to cope!” I know because people have told me this since birth. Just like they said that everyone could learn math if they tried hard enough.
My child is a similar type (not bad at math though) but she had the supportive parents I did not. The support was mainly just thinking she was great as she was, and trying to enable her strengths. It’s surprising how far that goes. And how few actually receive it.
Yes, I absolutely understand your point. I think there’s a middle ground to be had. Everyone, every single person, has real limitations. I’m not terrible at math, but I’m never going to be an astronaut. I’m not that good at math. No amount of work will make me that good.
But there are certain things most people have to do, and when you live in a rural or suburban area, driving is one of them. Obviously there are disabilities that preclude this. But I have significant driving anxiety, and I still have to drive places, because it would be prohibitively difficult for anyone else to do it. In 2016 I had a bunch of seizures on one day, and I wasn’t allowed to drive for six months. I had to pay for uber instead, which caused my transportation expenses to skyrocket. So I know that the alternative is not sustainable. My husband can’t bear the entire burden of shuttling our kid to therapy, for example. So, even though I don’t like it, even though it stresses me out, even though it causes intense anxiety sometimes, I drive. Sometimes I even drive into Detroit even though I’m so nervous the night before, I lose sleep.
Most people, whatever their real limitations, will be better off mentally if they test their limits to make sure they are in fact hard limits, and contribute in whatever way they can to their household or community. Not everybody’s contribution is going to be the same. If someone can’t drive, maybe they can cook dinner for their family every night. If they can do none of that, maybe they can be a support to a family member or friend. Do you remember blinkie? Blinkie had locked-in syndrome, couldn’t move a muscle except for his eyes, and he somehow found a way to contribute to the world by communing with people here, and doing online research for studies that had value to him.
The kids I am talking about are the ones who have never tested their limits and who have never been called upon to contribute anything. I know these people, they are my cousins. My grandmother has a very bad enabling problem. The upshot is a bunch of almost-adults and young adults who have no idea how to do anything for themselves. They rely on her for everything, and panic and require intervention for things as simple as making a decision about what to buy in a department store. Her phone rings nonstop for these little emergencies, and that is how she likes it. I love my grandmother more than words can say, but I recognized how dangerous that was and intentionally didn’t allow myself to fall into that trap. The outcome has been tragic. These are miserable kids who cannot cope with their lives. They already had a lot of things stacked against them, but the way my grandmother raised them didn’t help.
In contrast, I live with several disabilities, and I do a lot of things that require a lot of spoons and are hard to do. But they must be done. What makes it a disability is not that I can’t do it, but that it takes so much more effort to do than it would for the average person, and that I generally get less of it done in a day than I otherwise could (and periodically I really can’t do it, but I usually can the next day.) These are real limitations. For example, it took me six years to graduate from undergrad due to all my challenges. But I never stopped doing things. Or at least, when I did stop, I always started again.
As my first ever therapist always liked to say, “You must do the thing you think you cannot do.”
(Eleanor Roosevelt.)
A car-centric environment like most of the US is unbelievably hostile to children and does absolutely nothing for the mental health, physical health and financials of the people sitting in traffic.
I agree with you, but that doesn’t magically make public transportation happen where I live. Shit, in my county, half the people voted to defund our disability transportation bus service. They don’t even think disabled people should get public transportation.
ETA: One beautiful thing about younger generations is they have a high degree of empathy. It might be one reason they are struggling so much. I do hope in the future it results in more humane policies.
Generally our kids seem happy. We had a busy weekend. My daughter had a birthday party at a trampoline park and we brought my son. He seemed to have a good time fighting with some other boys with Nerf pugil sticks and throwing foam blocks at each other. Then we took them apple picking near our second home in the country, which is always fun.
I think my son does wish he had someone (other than his sister or parents) who shared his interests. So I kind of feel bad about that.
I guess what I worry about is what happens in a few years. Little kids are content to play with their toys and watch their cartoons. I think it gets harder in a few years as they outgrow that stuff (or worse…don’t) if they can’t form relationships with other people or find more mature interests.
I’m happy that you referred to spoons. It’s part of the vocabulary of our house too.
I agree with everything you said.
When I was ten we moved out of the subdivision where you could walk to school or the library to a more rural place. My parents both worked, I had no access to motorized transport. I rode my bike everywhere. Now, even if kids were allowed to go places alone, there’s far too much traffic. Cars have killed what freedom children used to have as much as anything else.
That’s really striking when you see how it is in pedestrian friendly countries, like Japan. There’s a reality TV show called Old Enough in which children aged 3-5 are sent on lone errands by their parents (with a camera following their adorable exploits, naturally.) Between the very carefully and clearly marked pedestrian paths and the community looking out for them, they do just fine. I wish sometimes I was raising a child in a society more like that.
As a humorous aside, there’s a memorable episode where a 4-year-old has to carry a bucket of dead fish back home. He hates the fish. He makes a face when he gets near them. He encounters one problem after another on his journey, and finally, when he is on his way home, his fish bucket handle breaks and the fish spill everywhere. At first he tries to pick up the fish with sticks, but then a cat comes along and starts to eat the fish, at which point he has to bite the bullet and actually touch the fish. The look on his face! But he does it. He recovers the fish and makes it home to Mom.
I related so hard to that kid. We’ve all had that day when our fish bucket breaks.