The Most Worthless Home Repair Folks Ever

A window contractor sales guy was the worst I’ve ever experienced. Some choice lines I remember:

“You are losing money by not buying these today”
“This is made with European technology!”
“Our gas molecules are specifically sized!”
“We can custom fit to match any frame or size” (upon showing him my little kitchen slider window trimmed with ceramic tile) “Umm…I’m sure our guys can do that” (furious clipboard scribbling ensued).
“They slide so easy, even a woman can open them.”
(while outside, shines a red-gelled flashlight through my window) “Tch tch tch…I’m afraid all your gas has leaked out of this one…probably doubling your heat bills.” (umm, and what spectral setting was your space visor set on while doing that test Mr. Predator?)

When we bought our house, the nextdoor neighbor was a roofing guy. He was involved in some kind of feud with the previous owner of our house. When she put the house on the market, the housing inspector suggested a new roof, but she didn’t want to spend the money. Suddenly, roofing guy neighbor gets all friendly and they become buddies. He offers to do the roof for free.
After we moved in, it became very obvious that the “new roof” which was the main selling point of our house, was less than perfect. Our first rain resulted in half the shingles sliding off the house, and the light bulbs filling with water. After 3 months, the ceiling fell in one room.
Guess what! He offered to give us a new roof for half-price. He told us he had just wanted her out as soon as possible, and would do an excellent job for us. :rolleyes:

We declined.

I was at the electrical supply store locally, standing in line at the counter behind two guys in typical “real Alaskan” attire: unkempt hair and beard, plaid shirt, Carhartt overalls, ball cap. Their conversation with the counter guy went something like this:

Counter Guy: Help you?
Dude #1: We need some wahr.
CG: Pardon?
D1: We need some wahr…some house wahr.
CG: House wire?
D1: Yep.
CG: What kind are you looking for?
D1 (looking a bit confused): The kahnd for a house…
D2: Yeah, we’re wirin’ up a house for a lady.
CG: Well, do you need single strand, romex, bx, or…?
D1: Just yer normal house wahr.
CG :: pulls a piece of romex from behind counter:: Something like this?
D2: Yeah, that’ll do I guess.
CG: What gauge do you need.
D2: Don’t need no gauges, just the wahr.
CG: No, what gauge WIRE do you need? 14, 12, 10?
D1: Hey, we just need somethin’ to wahr up a house.
CG, who is exasperated by now: What exactly are you hooking up?
D1: A stove.
CG: Okay, well you’ll probably need #6 for that.
D2: It’s a big stove…maybe we should get #7…? (for those non-electricians on the board, the larger the wire, the smaller the number, i.e., #4 is larger than #6)
CG, looking slowly back and forth at these two knuckleheads, pulls out a roll of #6, takes their money and watches them leave the store.

Me: Perhaps you should call the fire department.
CG: Nah. I’m sure they’ll electrocute themselves before they set the place on fire.

I own a Lustron home. Made entirely out of steel. Not something that anyone encounters regularly, I readily concede. Downside is that it was a rental for a long time before I bought it. Further downside is that the chinless hillbillies that were renters (before they got so far behind that the owner’s son really had no alternative except to toss 'em out) “worked off” rent payments by doing things.

First thing: they offered to replace the bathroom sink. Said it was leaking and they would get it taken care of. Of course, rather than replace the bathroom sink that was not working, they chose to put in a new sink. In a new place. Thereby leaving inlet lines and a drain in the spot in the bathroom where a sink should have gone and encountering the conundrum of running new lines and a drain in the corner of the bathroom they decided was better. Did I mention the house is made out of steel? Walls, ceiling, siding, everything is steel. So they decided that since the spot they would be using was opposite (approximately) the washing machine drain they would simply tie into those lines. Doing so, naturally, required going through the wall. Of course, they couldn’t just drill through (well, they could have, but I’m not at all certain they could have successfully opened the box of, let alone chucked a bit into and used an electric drill) they instead used what I think was a sawzall to cut two X’s into the steel panel and simply peeled the steel back to create passages. Upon buying the place, I had a sink put in where it should have been and am currently using the cabinet that held their sink as storage. An added bonus is I have a sink that I’m still trying to unload. The less said about what one of them did to the ceiling in one of the rooms the better.

Oh, and the contractors! I wanted to replace the heating apparatus since I was in no hurry to piss away every dime I made keeping the place warm. Had five guys come in. Most of them would stare at the house, listen to what I was looking for and walk away shaking their heads. I can respect them for that. My favorite: contractor wanted to put in a heat pump and rather than run ducting told me he would use the plenum as it existed. Which would have required the fan to run constantly. Being the astute individual he was, he noticed my look of puzzlement and rushed to explain that it wouldn’t be an issue and that he did this same sort of installation all of the time. “In steel houses?” I asked. No, but I would be surprised at the number of wood houses where the fan ran constantly to keep the ducts dry. Smiled and escorted him out. Poured a stiff drink and went to the next contractor on the list.

Had to have new juice run, since I decided to go with a tankless water heater. The electrician looked at the place, deemed it doable and I was pleased to have someone who seemed comfortable with my less-than-conventional home. Ran into problems when he told me that he had ruined a bit drilling the hole for my mast. I commiserated, but he wanted me to pay to replace his drill bit. I explained that he had already indicated that he could do it. His response, “But I was drilling through steel!” I pointed out that I was intimately familiar with what my entire house was made of.

As I said, I understand that my house is a bit different than most, but damnit, don’t act all surprised at what you’re dealing with when you’ve seen the place during the estimate portion of our little contractor/homeowner dance.

And replace your own damned drill bit.

The window guys I went with were the one bright shining moment in dealing with contractors. They finished the job in less than the time allotted and aside from the new plastic smell, which went away in time, I’m incredibly pleased with the finished result.

Good Lord, what a whiny bitch he was. You should have offered to pay for his drill bit, but charged him an equal amount for the electricity he used. And if he used the toilet at all while he was on-site…oh, that’s gotta be $1 a square for toilet paper ($1.50 for double-ply, and maybe $2.00 for the extra-soft Charmin that’s so padded it feels like wiping with chamois.)

Correction. Well known whiny bitch. His name is quite known locally and I’ve spoken to a number of folk who’ve had him in and thought he was the bees knees. But to me he was, indeed, a whiny bitch who actually looked surprised when I told him I wouldn’t replace his bit.

Yeah, prolly, but I just figured, “Fuck this shit! I’ve been jerked around by a baker’s dozen assholes since I bought this place and I’ll be damned if I’m gonna start letting someone play me now.”

Be careful. there are standards for stairs. You wont pass inspection if they do not know that. I do not know your area but the hight of steps and the length of the footspace are regulated. A non standard staircase is uncomfortable to walk on and could be dangerous.

We met this same guy selling siding. He wouldn’t make a quote until we’d picked colors from his samples (no, the color didn’t affect the pricing). His entire knowledge about why this siding was so great was "It uses J channels. He had 1 flyer about the company, which he wouldn’t leave with us. He scribbled the bid out on a piece of scratch paper. Then we got to play the guessing game. Neither one of us was even close. I believe the original bid was close to $60k, but he could discount it to $40k if we signed today. And they would arrange financing if we needed. 30 years worth, and we could roll our mortgage into it. When we asked for a copy of the bid, in case we decided to go with them (it was our first bid, we didn’t yet know how out of line it was) he said wouldn’t because “No one ever buys their siding once the salesman is out the door.” Gee, I wonder why?

I worked for almost 15 years as a house painter. As a scab. No contractor’s license, no insurance, no advertising (except word-of-mouth.)
We never had a lack of business because we always bid lower than anyone else and did excellent work. We bent over backwards to insure the customer was satisfied. The material (paint) was a down payment, (went to the customers garage or back yard), and a punch list was completed before final payment.
Seems like we were an exception…
BTW, we LOVED painting houses!!

I think my elderly parents had this same window guy! He talked and talked like he was a long lost friend but skirted alot of questions they had about brand, thickness energy star rating, etc… Everything was “no problem”.
Then he wouldn’t leave until they bought from him. My parents said they would think about it and call him, to which he became indignant and insisted they should buy now.
My mom, the peacemaker, said that they did not want to make a decision right now and were on their way to an important appointment. He demanded to know what could be more important than him. Annoyed, mom replied " If you really must know , we have to go to the bank to see if we can afford new windows!"
Big mistake! This clown now wants to follow them to the bank and wait in the parking lot for them to come out with the money to pay him!!
Luckily, I live close by so as soon as my mom called me and asked if I could come over, the guy beat a quick exit.
I’m really starting to hate these guys who prey on senior citizens, especially those enumerators from the gas and electric companies demanding to see your bill and won’t leave insisting people sign up for their “discount”, etc.

I have the same problem, it’s unbelievable the things the previous owner has screwed up! Everytime I try to fix something simple, I open a huge can of worms!
My poor wife is going to have a breakdown.
Last week, changing one light fixture became a complete rewire and drywall job.
Here’s how it went:
Oh… light fixture is screwed to wall stud, OK
Hmm, no electrical box, just wires hanging out hole in drywall.
No marettes? OK, lots of…hockey tape? Yes, that’s hockey tape!
Ground? Where is ground wire? Oh there it is, someone cut it.
Hey, new Romex at switch, old wire at hole in wall?
Check continuity from switch… yep one and only wire.
Notice bad drywall patch between the two.
Knock hole in wall, Aha marettes but no junction box.
Better yet, Romex is run outside studs inside and just under drywall!
Fuck it! Knock all drywall down, install proper wiring, add a couple outlets, etc…
Drywall, tape, plaster, and then paint.
Whew!

There’s one week I’ll never get back. Now on to the next room…

We were trying to get our utility closet moved last year so we called a few plumbers to see who could move the water heater within our budget. I informed the first plumber we called that the water heater was installed in an area with a slab foundation but we wanted it moved to a closet in an addition that had a crawl space. He showed up at the house with his buddy and walked around a bit. He gave us an estimate that sounded good and he was recomended by friends, so we agreed to have him do the job. He showed up the day before he was supposed to come do the job to scope it out and see what he would need for supplies. Suddenly, he’s all upset that the utility closet is over a slab. He can’t do that! That’s too hard! There’s no way to make it work! He can’t get to the plumbing! I’m grateful he didn’t try to do it, but it sure would have been nice if he had turned down the job to begin with. My entire kitchen remodel, including a tightly scheduled cabinet installation, hung on getting that water heater moved. He made it so I had to scramble to find someone at the last minute who could squeeze us in.

The guy who finally managed the job was a sweet little old man who kept showing us pictures of his two year old girl he had with his mail order bride. He was crazy but he didn’t even hesitate when he saw the concrete slab. A sledgehammer opened up that plumbing no problem. :wink: (Of course, since we were on a budget, we got to patch it again ourselves.)

I gained nearly 25 feet of floor space and an eight foot long counter moving that stupid water heater. It was worth it all.

Of course, neither of these plumbers were the ones who installed the basement toilet so it ran on hot water . . . .

Ugh. I need to hire someone to reroof our screened-in porch, and this thread is making my hyperventilate.

Thanks all. I had my siding and windows replaced last year and could never get over the feeling that I had overpaid. Now I see that I actually got good work for a decent price. I still don’t see how a few guys working for a few days can cost so many thousand of dollars but I guess the alterative is spending thousands for shitty work.

I’m not sure why this is a problem. It’s really not that unusual for the fan to run constantly. My wife has allergies, so we have a HEPA filter and run the fan continuously. Cuts down on dust quite a bit. Make sure you have an efficient fan and it doesn’t cost all that much. But if your placement is such that the fan would be noisy, or the steel would make the noise resonate through the house, then I can see this as not a good option.

I have seen this as a recommendation if condensation on the pipe and tank from cold water is causing a problem. I don’t like it, but at least it might not be a careless mistake.

Of course it could just be blatant laziness.

I am sorry to hear about so many horror stories involving Contractors. Owning a carpentry business I do have to spend way too much time overcoming the typical Contractor stereotype. A bit of advice to homeowners when getting estimates:

Check the vehicle when it pulls into the driveway. Is is presentable or covered in rust and barely moves? Is there signage on the vehicle denoting the business you called. Someone driving onto your property in a beat up truck with beer cans falling out the door when the Contractor gets out is not a good sign.

Is the person prepared? Does he have a tape measure, a tablet of some type to write information down, and are they on time? Also, do they offer to remove their shoes before walking on your nice clean floors? (A sign of courtesy). Are they immediately friendly? (Who wants to work around a grouch?)

In the course of conversation does the person seem at all knowledgeable? Ask some simple questions and feel them out. If they don’t seem to be ‘with it’ then politely end the interview. (It IS an interview, for BOTH sides)

Are you feeling pressured by the sales pitch? This is not a good sign.

Ask up front about what type of Liability Insurance they have and ask for a copy. They should be willing to offer that information and at least have a copy sent to you. If they stall on this then there may be problems in your future.

Ask them where they do business. Which lumber yards or suppliers they use. In event of some suspicions on your part you can always check these vendors. Most Contractors have accounts other than Home Depot or other Big Box Stores.

Check with neighbors and friends about who they may have used in the past and if they would recommend them.

Get a written estimate. This should be fairly specific about what work is to be done, how many people might be involved, and include a start date and a projected finish date.

NEVER give more than 30% up front. I’ll say that again. NEVER give more than 30% before the work begins. I usually ask for a deposit only AFTER the materials are delivered as a sign of good faith. A typical payment schedule is usually 30% upon start, 30% at approximate halfway point, and the remainder upon completion.

I could go on about this but I think you get the point. What I don’t understand is why people let complete strangers into their home with no apparent checking into the company. I also do not understand why people let bad work continue until completion when it should be stopped at the first sign of trouble.

We are NOT all bad.

-Paul

Since my last update - our forays into home repair and improvement:

  • The window saleslady who was so stupid she had to ask for help on how to open the windows she was selling, as she did not know how to open them!

  • The door salesperson who did not know what “French doors” were, and had never heard of them in their life.

  • The third window salesman who came out and jabbed his fucking screwdriver THROUGH THE WOOD OF MY EXISTING WINDOW in an attempt to show me how “rotten” the wood was.

  • The roofing guy who came out, did an inspection, promised an estimate “within 2 days.” It’s been about 3 and a half weeks now.

  • The furnace salesman who said he would make an appointment with me to send someone out to test our airflow and balance. That also was 3 and a half weeks ago.

  • The door salesman who told me that aluminum was “stronger” than steel.

  • The electrical contractor who won’t return a phone call when I ask for a quote on replacing a breaker box. Which is worse than the other contractor, who argued with me ad nauseum about how I didn’t need to upgrade my service, even though 1) he was wrong, 2) it shouldn’t matter to him as he’s getting paid for it so long as it’s legal, within-code work, and 3) he was absolutely fucking wrong.

And this is 100% of our attempts too - are you all seeing a lot of success in there?

Yup folks, it just keeps on getting fucking funnier.

I don’t get it - if I conducted my business like the people I’ve ranted about, not only would I have no business, but I might get my license yanked by the Board of Technical Professions. Yet somehow contractors can get away with it and keep making money. :confused:

I’m having post-traumatic flashbacks here.

I bought my new (old) home about four years ago. There were a couple of little inherent quirks - like the gas pipes that had no teflon tape or anything to bind them, but were screwed together nice and tight.

House picture.

But nothing compared to the adventure of remodelling. Thankfully, since this is my first house, my parents have been chomping at the bit to help however they can.

First was the dining room. My parents were insistent on getting rid of the 70’s-era paneling, and I figured I didn’t care either way, so whatever made them happy.

Some in-progress shots :
Shot One
Shot Two

Now, we were doing most of the work ourselves, but there was an issue. See, the previous owner had panelled over beautiful Oak trim, and we wanted to restore it - but something in the backing of the paneling or some kind of adhesive they used, perhaps - it had adhered to the trim. Looked ugly.

Fortunately (hah!) there was a handyman type doing some work restoring the house across the street, and through a chance conversation with my Dad, it was worked out that he’d take the oak trim, strip it and re-stain it, and bring it back and put it up. I forget the price, but it was reasonable. My parents were very impressed with the bathroom work he’d done at the house across the street, and excitedly began to plan a bathroom remodel.

This is the point where I probably should have pulled on the reins.

Anyway, the guy gets the trim done… in four weeks, not the two he’d said - and apparently 1.) didn’t let the stain dry in a dry enough place, as it was still tacky, and 2.) forgot to rout a channel in the baseboard pieces for us to slide in the wainscoting. Well, not forgot, per se. He brought the router with him, and did it in my basement. I would’ve thought “Hey, rout THEN stain.” But what do I know?

The important thing was that the dining room got done, and we’d made arrangements for the bathroom remodel.

After One
After Two

I should add at this point that the guy was NOT a licensed contractor, just a seemingly adept handyman who seemed to know what he was doing… at first. Now, the bathroom remodel was a more complex piece of work. Replacing all the fixtures, taking out the old tiled shower stall and replacing with a new three-piece fiberglass unit, tiling the floor, taking down the tiles on the walls and putting up wainscoting there as well. Oh, and moving the toilet. The toilet was about six inches too close to the wall behind the shower.

Bathroom, Before

Complex job, but he offered us a fantastic price, and we believed he could do the work.

Of course, first he’d have to show up. With him not being a licensed and bonded contractor, I wanted someone to be there in the house when he was working. So, it was something I had to plan in advance. We first planned for a week that I was taking off of work anyway. Didn’t show. Rescheduled. Didn’t show, rescheduled. Repeat that last bit three or four times.

So, it’s a month and a half after when the job was supposed to start. My parents are in town visiting, and they’re kinda pissed. Guy comes out Thursday night, all apologetic. Assures us he will be there, 8AM, tomorrow morning, to get started.

Friday morning. 8:15AM. The guy calls. This is actually a step up, because previously after his no-shows, I’d have to call him. He says he’s running late, he needs to pick up some tools that a friend of his borrowed. All is well.

11AM. Dad and I have had enough, and decide to hire someone else. Dad runs down the road to get food from Wendy’s. Guy shows up to work. Awkward! I ask him why it took three hours to get his tools, and he doesn’t have a good answer, and I tell him we’re getting someone else.

The end of the saga? Nooo…

My folks and I begin to re-plan the project. We get a licensed plumbing contractor in. He does the tile tear-down and the fixture replacement. He recommends a friend who does flooring, who does a pretty good job on the tile. (It ain’t perfect, but it was inexpensive, and I think the defect is due more to give in the floor than a defect of craftsmanship.) Things are actually looking up.

Here’s where it gets hairy again, though.

See, the tiles came off the wall easily enough, but the problem is that there is a good bit of what I can only assume is a glue residue of some kind - too thick for us to easily go over. We can’t chip it off, because the walls are plaster.

So. The decision is made - complete teardown of the walls, replace with drywall.

We tried to get estimates from a couple of guys - one didn’t show, but said the other guy we were talking to did good work. The other guy, in this case, was Ron.

Ron is a genial fellow. He talks a good game. His estimate was kind of high, and when we asked about an estimate on pressure-washing the house, that was ridiculously high. (He wanted $1200 to pressure-wash the house. We got some guys who just do pressure-washing to do it for $200.) Still, he seemed to know his stuff, he presented us with a contract that seemed reasonable, absent the spelling error in my name, and it had his contractor’s license number on there.

Work was to begin the following Monday, to be completed in the span of two weeks. Emphasis was made that he should minimize the amount of time the upstairs toilet was out of service, because the half-bath on the first floor is tiny and uncomfortable.

Ha.

Rather than belabor this in story format, let me hit the high points :

[ul]
[li]Work did not begin Monday, because the check from my parents bank didn’t clear instantly or something. This was resolved Monday evening with a phone call.[/li][li]Work didn’t begin Tuesday or Wednesday either.[/li][li]Work began Thursday, with the tear-down.[/li][li]The work was completed over a week late.[/li][li]Toilet was out of service for a week.[/li][li]Many days went by with no one showing up and doing any work.[/li][li]Ron claimed to be unable to hook up one of the features of the new vent fan, a night-light, because it would require running an additional wire from the basement, and thus, apparently, a licensed electrician.[/li][li]Ron’s people installed the access panel for the shower cutoffs as asked, but put a wooden support under it that ensured that no one could possibly reach the cutoff valves. (That, we caught and had them fix.)[/li][li]I specifically offered the use of a piece of half-inch yellow-board drywall that I had in the basement for the narrow strip next to the shower, quite certain that the 3/8s they had been using would not even out correctly for that small section. I was correct, and they said they would use it, but instead they just mudded the drywall out enough to vaguely look even.[/li][li]The roof vent for the ceiling vent fan was the biggest debacle, they tore out a board in my roof to install it, leaving a section two feet by one foot that was essentially protected only by shingle. (We got them to mostly fix that, but the gap’s still too big for my liking.)[/li][li]And when it was all said and done, and I was formulating a complaint against Ron, I discovered that the contractor’s license number he had presented on the contract was fake.[/li][/ul]

Argh. We did report him to the state, and I understand he got hit with a pretty hefty fine for falsely advertising as a contractor, and warned not to do that again.

My suspicion was that he was, during the day, a worker for a real contractor, and that he and his friends were moonlighting under the radar to make money on the side.

The way handymen and contractors comport themselves is sickening to me. I would pay double the “market price” if I had a 100% guarantee of competence. Sadly, home repair and improvement is an area where it doesn’t matter how much you pay, you have an equal chance of getting the same shitty, unprofessional, nearly criminal conduct.