Professional house painters and shoddy work

Factual Questions
1

I’m in the process of having a house built, and I’m seeing what I consider to be a big problem. The house is almost done, but there were a number of areas that needed touch up paint. The paint used in this work is close, but not exactly the same color, and some of the areas are pretty large and located in very visible areas.

In any case it looks like hell. It looks like some first grader did the work. And I’m wondering if this kind of shoddy work is common among professional painters, and what level of outrage, if any, I’m allowed to convey to the builder?

And BTW this is a very expensive house on a very expensive piece of lake side property. A very large and probably a very bad investment for me.

I write awkward sentences and I don’t know how to punctuate (my secretary always takes care of this) so any suggestions or corrections are more than welcome.

2

You paid for professional work, didn’t you? I’d raise holy, yet polite hell with your general contractor, or whoever your primary point of contact is on the construction of the house.

Tell 'em politely that the house looks terrible, and I’ll bet they’ll look at it and say “Egads, you’re right!” and they’ll have it taken care of. If they’re ambivalent about it, tell them that the shoddy paint job is now at the top of the punch list and you’re not going to sign off on anything until it’s fixed to your satisfaction.

3

You have every right to complain about subcontractors to your contractor/builder. We just went through a partial house construction and, even though the contractor was about the best I have dealt with, subcontractors made mistakes and we made them do it again.

Mistakes in painting are about the most straightforward thing you can complain about. Unless this person is color blind, all you have to do is tell him to come over and walk around showing what is wrong and tell him what needs to be done. Having him drop a few hundred or a few thousand dollars in a redo isn’t one of the worst problems contractors have to deal with. Part of this is doing the builder a favor because they have a choice of subcontractors and they need to know if they need to replace one of them.

Just invite the right boss over, clearly outline the problems, and then tell them what you expect to be done again. Be polite but firm and don’t negotiate. Getting the paint right should be one of the easier parts.

4

Thanks for the responses, but I forgot to add a fairly salient point. The construction manager says that with the new non-lead paints it’s impossible to match colors exactly and there’s nothing the painters can do about it.

This sounds like total BS to me since I (a truly non professional painter) have managed to match paint colors by slowly adding darker colors. But he says no contractor will do this and I’m SOL.

I’m getting ready to contact the builder but I’m not absolutely sure what the const. mgr. says is Bull. I know for a fact (from experience) that the builder’s first reaction will be negative, and again I’m wondering how pissed and threatening I should be when he refuses to do anything at all.

5

Refuse to accept the house as finished until the paint is at least one color. The “matching paint” line is BS - I can do (and have done) that at my local HD. He hired bad painters - he is responsible for the work. Don’t accept it!

6

[QUOTE=Ring]
Thanks for the responses, but I forgot to add a fairly salient point. The construction manager says that with the new non-lead paints it’s impossible to match colors exactly and there’s nothing the painters can do about it.
[/QUOTE]

‘New non-lead paints’? When did they start using them? If they’ve had to switch paints and can’t get them to match, then they should redo the lot.

7

If you are building a new house, why the need to colour match for touch ups?

8

[QUOTE=Ring]
The construction manager says that with the new non-lead paints it’s impossible to match colors exactly and there’s nothing the painters can do about it.
[/QUOTE]

Tell him that you’ll pay the outstanding balance in cash

  • but with the new green banknotes it is impossible to distinguish $1 from $100 bills.

If you have had a house built, then you probably used an architect, have a word with him - your construction manager is spinning you a line.

9

Lead-based paint has been illegal in the US for 30 years. There’s nothing “new” about non-lead paint.

Besides, if they reshoot the entire surface, it’ll all match itself, even if it doesn’t exactly match the coat it’s covering.

Get on their ass until it’s correct.

10

This is well and truly bullshit. I do all my own painting and match paint all the time. Sometimes it takes several tries to get it right, but it’s usually far from impossible. And, if for some reason it is impossible to match your job – say if they are trying to match the touch up paint to vinyl siding and it’s the sheen they can’t get right, not the color – then they need to paint or replace all the siding in order to get it to match.

11

[QUOTE=SnakesCatLady]
Refuse to accept the house as finished until the paint is at least one color.
[/QUOTE]
“At least one color” implies it’d be OK if it were more than one color. “At least matches,” perhaps? :wink:
Man, is it hard not to type “leats.”

12

I’m not a painting expert, but I do know a little about lead in paint. In the late 70’s, DuPont developed a paint additive which was commonly referred to as “tickle” (short for the multisyllable chemical name). They built an entire new plant in DeLisle, Ms. to produce the additive. Apparently adding lead to paint gives it a quality that was previously impossible to reproduce, until the development of “tickle”.
I strongly suspect that your cons. manager is trying to take advantage of your ignorance of the subject, or else he’s totally ignorant himself and is passing on misinformation.
I wouldn’t get pissed, or threatening, just flatly state that you are not going to accept the job until it meets your satisfaction, stick to that and don’t argue. Worst case, you may have to litigate, but I doubt it’ll get that far when they see that you’re not going to budge.

13

Thinking a bit more, it might be smart to find an independent paint expert to take a look at the job, before you make any further demands. It might cost you a few bucks, but it also might save you in the long run and it should strengthen your position considerably. Any of your local paint suppliers should be able to help find someone reputable.

14

Thanks folks, the overall weight of your responses pretty much tell me what I have to do. But there are a few things I haven’t yet mentioned.

The [http://www.lchouseplans.com/search-house-plans/plan-detail.cfm?plan_id=5561&searchFrom=by-name.cfm&plan_name_starting_letter=E&start_page=1](Thanks folks, the overall weight of your responses pretty much tell me what I have to do. But there are a few things I haven’t yet mentioned.

The [url=Home - vBulletin Community Forum)

house has now been under construction for over 20 months; no other house (some much larger) in this development has taken longer than 12 months to finish. I’m renting a condominium that’s costing me $1600 bucks a month and I’m that much poorer every month this drags on.

The last time I had a disagreement with the builder, I told him I was going to withhold the progress payment until the defect was fixed. He went berserk and called the construction manager and told him to change all the locks on the house and to cease any further work. He actually did this, and until I agreed to pay for the fix, he wouldn’t even return my phone calls.

I once used the phrase “God Damn” and he again hung up on me, and it wasn’t until his secretary told me to send a written apology for taking the Lord’s name in vain that he would take my calls.

My blood pressure rises and my life expectancy falls.
]http://house

house has now been under construction for over 20 months; no other house (some much larger) in this development has taken longer than 12 months to finish. I’m renting a condominium that’s costing me $1600 bucks a month and I’m that much poorer every month this drags on.

The last time I had a disagreement with the builder, I told him I was going to withhold the progress payment until the defect was fixed. He went berserk and called the construction manager and told him to change all the locks on the house and to cease any further work. He actually did this, and until I agreed to pay for the fix, he wouldn’t even return my phone calls.

I once used the phrase “God Damn” and he again hung up on me, and it wasn’t until his secretary told me to send a written apology for taking the Lord’s name in vain that he would take my calls.

My blood pressure rises and my life expectancy falls.

Click here to visit the vBulletin forums

15

Sorry, I don’t know how to do links and I hit the wrong button.

Thanks folks, the overall weight of your responses pretty much tell me what I have to do. But there are a few things I haven’t yet mentioned.

The house has now been under construction for over 20 months; no other house (some much larger) in this development has taken longer than 12 months to finish. I’m renting a condominium that’s costing me $1600 bucks a month and I’m that much poorer every month this drags on.

The last time I had a disagreement with the builder, I told him I was going to withhold the progress payment until the defect was fixed. He went berserk and called the construction manager and told him to change all the locks on the house and to cease any further work. He actually did this, and until I agreed to pay for the fix, he wouldn’t even return my phone calls.

I once used the phrase “God Damn” and he again hung up on me, and it wasn’t until his secretary told me to send a written apology for taking the Lord’s name in vain that he would take my calls.

My blood pressure rises and my life expectancy falls.

House:http://www.lchouseplans.com/search-house-plans/plan-detail.cfm?plan_id=5561&searchFrom=../galleries/results.cfm&mostPopular=Yes&start_page=1

Development:http://www.grandharbor.net/

16

[QUOTE=Ring]
Thanks folks, the overall weight of your responses pretty much tell me what I have to do. But there are a few things I haven’t yet mentioned.

The [http://www.lchouseplans.com/search-house-plans/plan-detail.cfm?plan_id=5561&searchFrom=by-name.cfm&plan_name_starting_letter=E&start_page=1](Thanks folks, the overall weight of your responses pretty much tell me what I have to do. But there are a few things I haven’t yet mentioned.

The [url=http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/)

house has now been under construction for over 20 months; no other house (some much larger) in this development has taken longer than 12 months to finish. I’m renting a condominium that’s costing me $1600 bucks a month and I’m that much poorer every month this drags on.

The last time I had a disagreement with the builder, I told him I was going to withhold the progress payment until the defect was fixed. He went berserk and called the construction manager and told him to change all the locks on the house and to cease any further work. He actually did this, and until I agreed to pay for the fix, he wouldn’t even return my phone calls.

I once used the phrase “God Damn” and he again hung up on me, and it wasn’t until his secretary told me to send a written apology for taking the Lord’s name in vain that he would take my calls.

My blood pressure rises and my life expectancy falls.
]http://house

house has now been under construction for over 20 months; no other house (some much larger) in this development has taken longer than 12 months to finish. I’m renting a condominium that’s costing me $1600 bucks a month and I’m that much poorer every month this drags on.

The last time I had a disagreement with the builder, I told him I was going to withhold the progress payment until the defect was fixed. He went berserk and called the construction manager and told him to change all the locks on the house and to cease any further work. He actually did this, and until I agreed to pay for the fix, he wouldn’t even return my phone calls.

I once used the phrase “God Damn” and he again hung up on me, and it wasn’t until his secretary told me to send a written apology for taking the Lord’s name in vain that he would take my calls.

My blood pressure rises and my life expectancy falls.

Click here to visit the vBulletin forums
[/QUOTE]

Sounds to me like it’s way past the time when you should hire an attorney, preferably one versed in real estate law. Call your county bar assoc. and tell them what your looking for, they should be able to provide you w/ several names. Then interview several lawyers and choose the one you feel most comfortable with. BTW, when you’re faced w/ a confrontation, never lose your temper and never, ever, swear. If you do, you’ve given up any advantage you may have had and very possibly lost the argument.
I think these guys have your number and they’re buffaloing you. From your description, it sounds like you’re playing right into their hands. If it were me, I’d be changing my tactics and calling in reinforcements. You probably should have consulted an attorney before you started this project, to approve contracts and handle disputes. It’s not to late, but if you don’t, I’d guess things are only going to get worse.

17

Just to confirm what everyone else has said. There has been no lead in paint other than special primers for over thirty years and edging up to forty.

Matching domestic paints is not a problem. Even if it is, the painter who has walked away from a shoddy job should be compelled to return and rectify it.
It won’t cost your primary contractor anything anyway, the painter should bear the cost of any remedial work.

Just to give a clearer picture, I started buying paint from a new supplier that I was somewhat wary of - I won’t name them but I found that my fears were ungrounded and their products were superb.

They had on their literature an advisory that they could not guarantee that paint from different batches would match exactly (they all say this).

This supplier didn’t stock more than half a dozen colours and all the rest were mixed from bases by adding stainers under controlled conditions - everybody does this, it is nothing unusual but was at the time for professional outlets.

I needed a huge quantity of a very ‘sugary’ pink and bough 15L to start with. Did a couple of rooms with it and bought a further 25L the following day and painted a square with the new batch in the centre of a wall finished the previous day, to see if there was any tone or hue variance.

I was both surprised and pleased that there was none.

Continued in the same manner for a week, with most of the various colours specified for the job and there was never any variation in either hue or tone.

Your contractor is lying to you.

It may be worth your while to contact representatives of local trade organisations, these contractors are not welcome in their fraternity as they give the rest a bad name. Pressure may be applied.

Your legal representative too, they are taking the piss stringing completion out so long. Hit them for the cost of your temporary residence over and above the specified completion date.

18

The lead paint flam could have been down to a little creative bullsh/tting, but the changed locks and the sensitivity to ‘bad language’ is a clear sign that the guy is playing games with you.

Sometimes not very bright people can get the wrong impression of an individual

  • they start playing manipulative games

Auto mechanics do it to women.

I would say that you have an irretrievable breakdown of relationship with your building contractor, and that he needs either a serious kicking or sacking. Probably both.

For a start, changing the locks on your property is outrageous.
And manipulating you into writing a grovelling letter is a joke.

Hopefully you have a good lawyer, if not someone here will probably suggest a way of finding one.

I would cease personal communication with your contractor, tape all telephone conversations if he tries to contact you (stuff legality, it will make you feel better) and abruptly cease all payments.

Once he has received a vicious letter from a lawyer, he’ll probably change his tune, but my gut feeling is that you would be better off without him.

19

Ya’ know Ring, there is another possibility here. I’ve got a buddy who is a custom builder and every so often he gets a customer that is a total PIA and eats up much of his profit by slowing progress. You need to be honest w/ yourself and review your behavior over the duration of this project. If you’re frequently nit picking and interfering w/ the tradespeople while their working, and if you’ve made lots of minor, or even a few major, changes, it entirely possible that your builder is just fed up. I’m not saying this is the case, but you should consider it.

20

Thanks again folks.

I have tried to hire an attorney but all the ones who are supposedly competent in this field have told me they couldn’t represent me because it would be a conflict of interest. This guy has done business with every one of them, and as much as I hate to admit it, this seems like a pretty smart move on his part. So I’d have to retain an attorney from a larger city and I’d rather avoid that if I can. (This is obviously a small city.)

In any case I’m going to print this thread and show it to him (at least some of it) and hope I can resolve this issue. (I’ve only lost my temper the one time I said “God Damn” he’s the one who usually goes berserk.) This whole issue is driving me crazy and I’ll do practically anything to just get this damn house finished before I die.

Thanks again for all your help.