Of course they are of that belief. They belief–sincerely and firmly, contradicting the actual evidence–that they and their mythical version of “Real American Culture[sup]TM[/sup]” is under actual attack and those attacking it are the non-Christians and non-Whites who are lying about their motivation.
Yeah, when you recognize that’s their view, then it’s no surprise they support such garbage as Trump.
I mean, there really was a very white bread American culture that was created in the middle decades of the 20th century by the draconian immigration policy from about 1920 to 1965. That’s what Boomers and even GenXers grew up with. It was a real thing, not a myth, but times change. The Boomers’ grandparents saw a transformation in the other direction, after the U.S. population had become very “ethnic” by the early 20th century.
The reality is that Puerto Rico should either be its own country, and we shouldn’t have shit to do with it, or we should make it a state. But Americans just disrespect P.R. even worse than we disrespect the residents of DC. We’ve always treated PR as a colony, and at not time was that mentality on display more than how we ignored PR at her darkest hour. It’s unforgivable. If I were a resident of PR I’d fucking move to Florida in 2020, register Democrat, and vote that scumbag out of power. But then I’d stay long enough to hold Democrats accountable so that they can’t just slink off and ignore PR anymore.
I wish more of them would do that! Moving to NC would also work.
So the Klan does want you?
Yuk yuk. :rolleyes:
I hear they have good bake sales. Maybe you could make your world-famous lemon squares for them.
This makes no real-world sense. They can say what they want, but the only people that have control over the impeachment process before it reaches the Senate are the House Dems.
Your digressions aren’t at all on point. What’s like 1974, actually - get your years straight here - is that the Democrats on the Judiciary Committee will still have to take the time to review the evidence (including the Mueller Report), determine which actions of Trump’s are worth an article of impeachment, and make sure they’ve got cogent arguments that people can grasp.
My point about 1974 is that (a) that’s the work of a few months, at the speed Congress operates, and (b) if they stick to relying on what’s already publicly available, they control the process. Trump can’t block them from this or that, if they’re not trying to obtain anything that’s not already publicly available.
True. And if the Dems do nothing, that’s also true.
How does this work? They’ll be reading the Mueller Report for real, and pulling together other publicly available documents and video clips, and exactly what’s the brawl over? Other than Trump and the GOP saying “you shouldn’t be doing this,” but OK, so what? To have a fight, it’s got to be a fight over something, and as you’ve heard from elementary school, it takes two to make a fight. If the Judiciary Committee Dems just shrug and keep doing their work while the Trumpists yell, that’s gonna be newsworthy for two days, max.
I still don’t see what the rant ending with this has to do with anything I’ve said. I’ve gone back to 1974 to talk about two things: (1) the amount of time we should allow for the Judiciary Committee to take, and (2) the efficacy of relying strictly on what’s publicly available in order to not get bogged down in court fights.
You’re not addressing either one of these issues in your comparisons with 1973-74, so :shrug:
People still get cues from the leaders who generally share their POV. People outside the 40% are going to regard this as more serious if Dems act like it is, and less serious if they don’t.
And holding ordinary hearings is in the latter category. Congress holds hearings all the time, and people rarely pay attention to them.
Only a daft or disingenuous cunt would think it’s Americans civilians living in in South Africa I was talking about.
No, I meant 1973, not 1974, because that’s when the pressure to impeach began. That’s when the testimony began. My point is, the House Judiciary Committee didn’t just rush into impeachment. There was a LOT that happened after the initial discovery of and investigations into Watergate. The articles of impeachment were drafted in 1974, long after Nixon’s popularity declined. Furthermore, the things that brought Nixon’s popularity down…aren’t bringing Trump’s popularity down. You stubbornly refuse to accept facts because you think impeachment is the right thing to do. You need to snap yourself back into reality.
Nope. That’s the work of more than a year. That’s the work of the public not tolerating things from Nixon that they’re apparently tolerating from Trump. That’s the work of a few media gatekeepers reporting the same story every day and night. It’s a different world.
People outside the 40% are going to regard this as more serious when there’s stagflation and/or the national humiliation of losing a war.
No, I’m ignoring facts that I think are beside the point.
Take for instance your comparison of Trump’s and Nixon’s popularity. Trump will probably have 40-42% approval no matter what. So where are we on the curve of Nixon’s popularity? Nowhere. There’s no relation, no connection.
And the point that the House Judiciary Committee didn’t just rush into impeachment. Well, you yourself have already given a long list of stuff that’s already happened since the beginning of 2017 that parallels what happened in 1973. Plus there’s the Mueller Report. Not sure what else the Dems should wait for, before beginning an impeachment inquiry.
What’s with your string of non sequiturs? The amount of time the House Judiciary Committee needs to complete a proper impeachment inquiry is not determined by those things.
I feel like I’m talking about how long it’ll take to cook supper, and you say I’m wrong because tire rims and anthrax.
What does that have to do with impeachment? You’re through the looking glass and off the map.
Trump’s popularity can go lower.
You will need it to go lower if you expect congressmen/women to have the stones to impeach him. There’s nothing “beside the point” about it.
Well, as you said:
So what you’re saying is that just to get the people outside the 40% to favor impeachment, we’ll need national disasters that are unlikely to happen and are outside of Democratic control anyway. What will it take, according to your crystal ball, for people inside the 40% to get there? Nuclear holocaust?
Perhaps.
One of you argued that this year should be compared to 1973; the other argued 1974. But based on the electoral calendar, aren’t you both wrong and we are in 1975 (the year before the election)? Of course, in Nixon’s case it was his second term, so maybe there are no clear parallels.
What I am saying is, there are parallels to Nixon, but Trump isn’t Nixon - this is worse. I think that in many ways, he is far worse, and the Republican party is far worse. And frankly, the entire electorate is far worse.
But as alarming as this is, an impeachment to nowhere isn’t going to work. Our political system doesn’t allow one party in one house to remove the president because they’re mad as hell. You cannot remove a president through impeachment unless it is politically safe for congressional representatives to remove him. That’s just fundamental civics. I don’t see why RTF seems to have a hard time accepting this basic fact.
What it will take is for people to get tired of Trump on a personal level. George W Bush had sky-high popularity after 9/11; by the fall of 2008 it was about as low as Nixon’s in the summer of 1974. You need to understand that there’s a difference between how people perceive a president when he’s viewed as some guy on TV and how he’s viewed when he’s the guy who’s ruining their shot at the American Dream.
He’s right. Trump could *literally *shoot someone on Pennsylvania Ave., and if his polling numbers in red states didn’t budge, you still might not get 67 senators to remove him from office.
Because people don’t give a shit about “someone on Pennsylvania Ave.” He could shoot someone on Peachtree Street and his poll numbers in red states wouldn’t budge if the economy’s fine. But if farms start failing right and left, if economic disasters crush the south, and if he doesn’t have answers for it, then it’s a different ballgame. People don’t give a fuck about random strangers - anyone who ever believed they did is naive as hell. People care about themselves, and if everyone in Trump Land is feelin pain, there ain’t no Trump Land no more.
I still don’t think they would blame him if this stuff happened to them. They’d make excuses for him.
Sure, some would.
Understand that in a “blowout” or “landslide” election, 40% of the electorate votes for the loser. A “consensus” is about 60%.
I’ll give you a few examples of why Democrats should investigate but not quite impeach - at least not yet.
Let the GOP enact more abortion bans
Let the GOP block aid to disaster stricken states
Let the president - and the president alone - cozy up to global dictators
If there’s one thing the GOP can be counted on, it’s to make themselves look like a bunch of inhumane shitheads. Let them keep doing that. But impeach before the country’s ready, and then impeachment becomes the story. Shit, people might even feel sorry for Trump and conclude that “Dems investigated him since day one and never gave him a chance.” Let the GOP show the country what a bunch of callous shits they are. Let the country regret their vote.