The Nature of Salvation

When do you think in your opinion is the moment of the conversion and salvation to Christianity? Is it a single sudden moment or a gradual intellectual and emotional acceptance? For instance I didn’t when I became Christian go like someone in a Chick tract and pray in a single moment-mine was a slow intellectual acceptance of Christianity. Than is it baptism? Also what of people who have been raised Christian and does don’t have a moment of conversion as they’ve believed in God and Christ from the start?

You can be a Christian and go to Hell. You aren’t saved unless you’re repentant for your wrongs. There are multiple points of salvation as you go in and out of states of sin.

As to when you become a Christian, it’s whenever you believe in Christ’s wisdom as being divine.

I agree except for the bolded part. Do you believe in the doctrine of eternal security or not?

It’s when the individuality of the victim is overcome, and they become subordinate to the religious infection. It’s when they are willing to ignore reality, their own self interests and the needs of their friends and family in order to serve their religion; Christianity or any other, there’s little difference.

Do you really have to troll on every thread related to God? :smack:

Do you really have to start them? :smiley:

If you didn’t want criticism, you shouldn’t have posted this in Great Debates. Not everyone in the world thinks that religion in general or Christianity specifically is a good thing. Get over it.

And it’s not “trolling” since I genuinely regard religion as evil and a disease. Nor am I going out of my way to be offensive; I actually deleted some harsher comments before posting.

Your statement was ridiculous and over the top.

I think everyone pretty much knows your answer to every religious thread dude. :rolleyes:

And perfectly aligned with the OP.

No, it was rather mild and accurate. You see it as “over the top”, because it actually says that religion is bad instead of pretending that religion is beneficial “except for a few bad apples”, while all over the world suffering and death is spread in its name.

Religion is a bad thing in my eyes; therefore conversion* is a bad thing as well. One implies the other.

  • Rather, conversion from unbelief to belief; conversion between religions is largely meaningless.

For me being a cradle Catholic it was the moment I felt it in my heart. The love of God.

I was about 5 years old when I felt His divine presence. I had not yet made first communion but was in church with my Grandmother. She was on her knee’s and praying. As I was not allowed to talk in church so I just observed her. Both of my Grandmothers were women of great faith. I remember getting on my knees and I was so short I was facing the pew. I just prayed to be like my Grandmother. All of a sudden I felt such deep love I started to cry. My Grandmother looked down at me with such love in her face. She knew.

It has never left me. That feeling inside of deep love. It is the love of God that I asked for that came from a simple prayer. I feel very blessed to have the faith that my Grandmothers had. Out of 4 siblings I am the only one other then my Mother that still attends mass. Each and every time I attend mass usually at the Kyrie I just feel such perfect peace and ease.

If you are lucky enough to get it you will very blessed even in the bad times. I get God shots as I call them but they are just spiritual experiences. Not like what the saints had but I’m sure they just spent more time in prayer. I get everything I need from Jesus. I get it exactly when he wants me to. I just need to connect with him daily to get these gifts.

Ask and it shall be given, seek and you shall find. Luke 11:9 You can’t get to God without asking him in. Then when he comes you nurture the relationship and it grows.

I like this thread Curtis started and hope others will come and share how it happened for them. If it didn’t then don’t ruin it.

What about conversion from belief to unbelief? I assume you will go “Glory Hallaelujeah! Praise be the Atom!” :stuck_out_tongue:

But seriously what do you think Unitarian Universalists-do you seriously think for instance the Archbishop of Canterbury is evil as the Ayatollah of Iran? :dubious:

Since that generally means they are thinking more clearly I would consider it an improvement, yes.

I see little moral difference; the real difference is power, not morality. Christian believers have demonstrated an immense enthusiasm for tyranny and bloodshed in the name of their god when they could get away with it; now, governments in most Christian dominated nations are so much stronger than the various churches that they have to pretend to be civilized. Give the believers the kind of power and license in America that they have in Iran or Saudi Arabia, and you’d see little difference in their behavior. They’d cheerfully run around murdering gays and unbelievers and beating women into submission in Christ’s name instead of Mohammed’s.

That"s not true and you know it.

I’m simply extrapolating what they’d do from their own history, and places right now where they have power. Christianity has been just as brutal as the Islam that so many like to pretend is uniquely evil. Christian people still try to beat the gay out of their own children, beat gays to death when they can get away with it, express hatred for every other sect ( much less other religions ), condemn millions to death by trying to suppress everything from condoms to stem cell research, treat women like garbage wherever they can; and in general demonstrate that Christianity is still the survival from a more barbaric age that it always has been.

Are we talking about all Christians or Anglicans here? The Archbishop of Canterbury is very politically liberal-he does not think homosexuality is a sin and supports homosexual marriage and he is pro-feminist.

Could the same be said about non believers? If given the power and license would they kill believers?

To repeat:

He’s going to act all nice and enlightened, because if he tried to call for the extermination of unbelievers he couldn’t pull it off without the government clamping down. He can’t use force, so he has to try honey instead of vinegar. But he’s still a priest for a belief system that is based on the idea that they are absolutely right and everyone else absolutely wrong. A belief system that has a long and bloody history, and all over the world in places where it and very similar belief systems can get away with it, engages in bloodshed and tyranny as much as it ever did.