< Yakov Smirnoff voice >
In the Soviet Union, God worships you !
< Yakov Smirnoff voice >
That’s what you said the last time!!
There are other things that really bother me about the End Times, Rapture, etc. The people who hold to it seem to think that they will be OK, all 144000(?) of them. They don’t mind that according to their number, all the billions of other people who ever lived will be judged and damned. Yet, they are absolutely positive that they themselves are among this tiny select little group of “saved ones”. Are they that sure of their own perfection? Are they presuming not only to judge, but to do God’s judging for him? That seems like the epitome of arrogance and pride. Pride is a sin according to the Bible. Oopsie. There also seems to be a sadistic delight in the idea that the Other billions of people are doomed. That conflicts with the ideas of mercy and love. Oops again. It has nothing to do with being baptized in the right church, or sitting with the “halleluyah chorus in the amen pew” on Sundays. It has nothing to do with saying Jeezus all the time. Any God worth His salt knows the difference between show and go, between lip service and reality. If we do all get judged, nobody gets a free ride. Nobody is that perfect. So I wonder why some people are so noisy in welcoming it or wishing for it. A good christian should be either scared to death that they might have failed in some way, or hope for mercy. Feed the hungry, shelter the homeless, cure the sick etc seem to have gotten lost somewhere. Merely “witnessing” in the comfort and safety of your neighborhood church, among like minded people doesn’t cut it. Neither does saying a prayer or two now and then.
“This people honors Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me; their worship of Me is vain, for they teach as doctrines the commandments of men. You neglect the commandment of God, in order to maintain the tradition of men.” - Mark 7:7
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’
“Christianity might be a good thing if anyone ever tried it”. - George Bernard Shaw
The following quotation can be “expanded” to condemn those who crow about over being the “chosen few” and gloat over the destruction of everybody else:
“Whoever gloats over disaster will not go unpunished” - Proverbs 17:5b
My father-in-law says that, “Every good Christian believes the rapture (or whatever name you want to put on it) will come in his or her lifetime.” I really like the saying. At first it appears to be a conventional, fundamentalist statement.
Digging deeper (and knowing him), I think he is actually saying that it is incredibly narcissistic to focus on such things and in particular presume that they will happen in your lifetime and happen to you. Of course, it is the next step to presume that you will be one of the lucky ones, even when your odds should be about as good as hitting a Nolan Ryan fastball out of the park with a toothpick.
I have developed from this the belief that most human beings are fundamentally depressed that they are not special, they are not great captains, and in the historical scheme of things, they do not matter. The fact that they ever even lived will likely be irrelevant. We like scenarios in which we are somehow special or important, and the whole rapture in our lifetime scenario creates such a self-importance. It’s actually a great deal of hubris masquerading behind a facade of spiritual humility.
Heh heh. I like that, SlyFrog. In short, everybody is special. Just like everybody else. 
Don’t you think God will be more displeased with me than you if what i’m saying is incorrect? If I were giving you a false interpretation my punishment is much worse than an apology. I will stand behind my words. There won’t be any need for an apology to you or this newsgroup. I’m just the messenger… ephraim
So, if (just hypothetically) you are wrong, you won’t admit it?
No your not. I’ve received the Lord’s message through many people over the years. They have had almost nothing in common. But, they were all honest, caring, and willing to answer questions*.
Your past posts show you made a prediction proven false, and now deny making such a prediction. I don’t see caring in your posts. You’re unwilling to answer questions. You deliver no message but your own.
*This ranges from getting wise and sagely answers to the big questions of life, the universe, and everything, to the simple answers of a woman who so loved Hershey’s kisses that she decided to give them to strangers just to make them happy. “Yes, for you.” “No, you don’t have to give me anything back.” “Because chocolate is good. People like chocolate.”
[QUOTE=DocCathode]
So, if (just hypothetically) you are wrong, you won’t admit it?
Certainly I will admit to any error, if any occur…
I suspect you’ll make your apologies to Christ, Whom you so arrogantly set yourself above.
This Sunday in church, I was reminded of what God said to Ezekiel, a true prophet, unlike yourself. In Ezekiel 18:32, God says to Ezekiel, “For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone. . . . Turn then and live.” You, however, glory in the prospect of the deaths of others and in destruction. As far as I’m concerned, you’re one of the false prophets Christ warns us of in the Gospels for your fruits, in your preaching of death and devastation contradict the teachings of Christ who spoke of life. You’re a messenger, all right. The question is, “Who sent you?” My answer is, “No god who whom I recognize.” I will not set aside the teachings of Christ my Saviour to believe your so-called prophecies, even though you name yourself after a son of Joseph.
Then God will be equally displeased that you got it so woefully wrong last time, saying that the Second Coming would occur before the death of Arafat.
If I am wrong and Christ comes before Abbas’ death, I will admit that I could not tell the truth of God’s teachings from what I imagined to be true (that we are biological computers living in a four dimensional region of a universe which has never not existed). If you are wrong, and we read one day of Abbas’ death despite no such Coming, then if you stand by your words you will promise to admit that you can’t distinguish God’s truth from your own fetish.
Agreed?
So now we have someone who is a messenger of God himself? WOW! How does one become a prophet? Is there an entrance exam? Is there a secret ceremony? How many people out there already claim to speak for God, but instead are despicable liars (and worse)? We have Fred Phelps, Pat Robertson, Jimmy Swaggart, Jerry Falwell, Jim Bakker, Josh McDowell, R J Rushdooney, Randall Terry, let’s toss in Jim Jones or Torquemada too while we are at it. All these guys claim/claimed to speak for God too. Sorry, but just because someone thumps a Bible and is a self-proclaimed “holy man” means nothing.
Deuteronomy, 18:19, 20. “And it will be the man who does not listen to My words, but who speaks in My name, I will inquire from him. However, a prophet who sinfully speaks a matter in My name which I did not command to speak and he speaks in the name of other God’s, you must kill that prophet.”
Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Therefore by their fruits you will know them. (Matthew 7:15-20)
But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, . . . And many will follow their destructive ways, . . . (2 Peter 2:1-2).
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, . . . (2 Timothy 4:3-4)
Now, it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for an infidel to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking non-sense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn. The shame is not so much that an ignorant individual is derided, but that people outside the household of the faith think our sacred writers held such opinions, and, to the great loss of those for whose salvation we toil, the writers of our Scripture are criticized and rejected as unlearned men. If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions about our books, how are they going to believe those books in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven, when they think their pages are full of falsehoods on facts which they themselves have learnt from experience and the light of reason? Reckless and incompetent expounders of holy Scripture bring untold trouble and sorrow on their wiser brethren when they are caught in one of their mischievous false opinions and are taken to task by those who are not bound by the authority of our sacred books. For then, to defend their utterly foolish and obviously untrue statements, they will try to call upon Holy Scripture for proof and even recite from memory many passages which they think support their position, although “they understand neither what they say nor the things about which they make assertion.” (Augustine, in his essay On Genesis, but applicable in so many other areas too)
“Whoever gloats over disaster will not go unpunished” (Proverbs 17:5b)
So I guess you don’t believe me. Do you think it is possible that i am right? Could you be one of those who forsook God’s word and ridiculed him? I think you need to think hard about what you say about me . You may live to regret it…
Yes. A tiny, tiny probability of course, but yes. Do you think it is possible that you are wrong? If not, then you will agree to this:
If I am wrong and Christ comes before Abbas’ death, I will admit that I could not tell the truth of God’s teachings from what I imagined to be true, and beg forgiveness for my pride. If you are wrong, and we read one day of Abbas’ death despite no such Coming, then if you stand by your words you will promise to admit that you can’t distinguish God’s truth from your own fetish.
Agreed? Have you not the courage to subject your firm convictions to such a reasonable challenge?
It’s an infinite universe and all things are possible through God, including things which seem impossible to mere mortal man. Therefore, I will grant there is a chance ephraim is right, infinitessimal though it may seem to me.
Nevertheless, ephraim, in the Gospels Christ refers specifically to people who do the very thing you are doing and calls them false prophets. Therefore, given a chance between believing the One I call Lord and Saviour and believing you, I’ll believe Him.
By the way, I notice you haven’t addressed anything I’ve posted. Is there a particular reason for this? I’m particularly curious about whether you consider yourself a Christian, and, if so, how is it you reconcile your specific knowledge of when the end will come with Christ’s statement that not even He knows, along with other verses SteveG1 and I have cited.
CJ
Oh yes, regret. I have no intention of regretting my beliefs, even if they prove to be wrong. To do so would come close to making me a hypocrite. I have believed what I have believed based on my honest readings of Scripture and what I have learned through prayer and meditation. I see no reason to change them based on the words of one man who directly contradicts what I have learned. If that means I burn in hell for all eternity, so be it. Better to burn an honest sinner than live because I changed my deepest held beliefs under threat and fear.
CJ
Hey, if the OP is right and Christ comes tomorrow and Abu Mazen grows horns on live TV, I am still not going to be convinced. If the rapture happens next week, I promise I’ll post that it is all a hoax, an illusion, Hollywood special effects… And if I am, in fact, among the lucky ones to get raptured, I will come in here and tell y’all how it was done! That fair?
Yeah, you might have your head cracked open by a falling turtle.
Ive said that Abbas is the false prophet spoken of in the Bible which is also the second beast of Revelation. Christians will not be here for the great tribulation. It is only for unbelievers and haters of God. Therefore, Abbas will be here on earth after the rapture of the church. He will die somewhere close to the Lord’s second coming. And in all that I have not told anyone the hour or the day only that it is close. The 3 and a half years of Revelation 12 is very close.
Oh ? How do we know you’re not the false prophet ?
Speaking of “the rapture of the church”, which one ?
As far as “unbelievers and haters of God” go, how is getting rid of the Christians supposed to result in “tribulations” for us ? I’d miss a few relatives, but it would be an overall improvement. Wouldn’t it be amusing if the result was a utopia ?
All you’ve done is say we should believe you because you’re right. If you consider yourself a Christian, you’ve set yourself higher than Jesus Christ, Himself, which makes you, I’m afraid, a blasphemer in my book. Answer the questions you’ve been asked or take your cruel condemnations elsewhere.
CJ