The United States Declares Economic War on Canada

Politics & Elections
961

Everything you’ve said in this thread about Canada is wrong – not just a little wrong, but completely and comically wrong. For instance claiming that Canadians “are just like Americans” and implying that we should therefore be thrilled to join the US.

Your statement about Alberta is equally absurd. Since you know nothing about Canada maybe you should just stop pontificating about it

An informed take on Alberta is this post:

In short, the way other Canadians and the federal government treat Alberta is a reaction to things Alberta itself has done. It has doggedly and short-sightedly continued to rely on the fossil fuel industry – and in the process made a huge toxic mess of local environments – even after it became obvious that it was an industry in decline. Alberta has, at best, maintained an uncaring attitude about climate change, and at worst, been actively denialist and hostile to climate research, even as the federal government tries to institute significant measures to mitigate the problem.

The current premier, Danielle Smith, even tried to destroy the Canada Pension Plan, a major source of income for the elderly, by claiming Alberta’s right to seize 60% of its total assets, which besides being completely illegal, is a number that is positively Trumpian in its hugely exaggerated absurdity. A couple of years ago they passed the Alberta Sovereignty Act, which basically says they can ignore the federal government and the Supreme Court of Canada if they don’t like its laws and rulings. And when Canadian institutions take issue with this craziness, they claim they’re being treated badly.

962

What he said :clap:

963

Exactly why Alberta gets in trouble

# Alberta pioneered industrial carbon pricing. Now, Poilievre says he’d kill the federal mandate for it

Mixed reaction to federal Conservative leader’s plan for all carrot, no stick policy on large-scale emitters

Robson Fletcher, Joel Dryden · CBC News · Posted: Mar 18, 2025 4:00 AM EDT | Last Updated: 9 hours ago

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-carbon-pricing-poilievre-kill-backstop-promise-reaction-1.7486111

I recall when oil producers were begging for a carbon tax so they could have clarity …now paper boy and the Premiere want to kill just to feed the AGW deniers.

964

Holy shit, did you get that wrong. No, they’d be IMMEASURABLY worse off, because that is not the government they want, not the nationality they want, and not the identity they want. Americans don’t want to be Canadian, they want to be American. They are a self-governing people with an identity they wish to retain, a proud and remarkable history, and their own culture and way of governance. It is a terrible loss to lose all that and anyone who would propose to take it from them is a goddamn fascist who should be hanged.

Matters of government policy like gun control or whatever are an interesting debate, and I certainly have my opinions about them, but a country does not deserve to lose its identity and freedom over how the government runs public health insurance, and I am completely uninterested in the opinions of bigoted idiots who suggest otherwise.

They’re in jest and no one saying that really would welcome a Canadian invasion or vote for a takeover.

That take isn’t the slightest bit informed, contains no evidence, no reasoned argument, and it just appalling. Canadians need to stop sniping at one another. If you don’t want to be brothers and sisters with all Canadians in all regions and appreciate their differences, even if you don’t like some politician, I say get the fuck out to some country you do want to be a part of. Canadians have a Constitutional right to leave. If they want to hate other Canadians, they should fucking use it.

The regional bitching here is just depressing, my God. Absolutely disgraceful. Another country is talking about invading us, and people from one city are whining about people from another because of their last provincial election. (Hey, who did Ontario vote for?) Travel around the country a little, people. Rejoice in what we have. Other Canadians are your countrymen and you must be on their side.

965

I agree completely. The internal bitching is playing into trump’s (tiny) hands. Our past differences need to be forgotten (for now) and we need to make sure all Canadians are united in defending our sovereignty. It is difficult when Smith repeatedly spends her time schmoozing with magas south of the border. I’m not sure how to convince her to to come back to the fold but my Canada includes Alberta and Quebec and the Territories.

966

And in today’s Glibe (limited gift link):

967

Such kumbayaing. Well its 38 years after Meech lake and 33 after Charlottetown I say now’s the perfect time to reopen the constitution and have another crack at getting all the provinces onboard. Three times the charm. Who’s with me?

/s

968

Who are you addressing here? “Travel around the country a little”? I have written before about having had the privilege to hold a consulting position for about five years with a major multinational that gave me the opportunity to fly all over this great country from coast to coast as often as several times a week and to experience its beauty and the diversity of its culture and its wonderful people. I would venture to say that I’ve probably traveled this country more than any other poster here, probably by a large margin, and I don’t need or appreciate a lecture about getting out more or that I don’t understand our culture.

I challenge you to cite one thing I got wrong in what I wrote about Alberta. Yes, there are many good and decent people there. I know some of them. A good friend of mine married one of them. But Jesus fucking Christ, Danielle Smith tried to sabotage the Canada Pension Plan and steal its assets, and passed a so-called “Sovereignty Act” giving Alberta the supposed right to ignore federal laws and Supreme Court rulings if they didn’t like them. Don’t accuse other Canadians of lack of patriotism or lacking a sense of national unity when insane traitorous shit like this is incredibly divisive and undermines the fundamental rule of law that is a pillar of our values.

969

I think Canada has bigger moose to hunt right now.

970

You’re a doctor you know the saying. “Open up those old wounds, let the air in. Its good for the humours.”

971

We used to have something of that sort - I grew near the border, we crossed back and forth all the time, often having to do no more than state our citizenship, and be on our merry way. Not quite Schengen, but a hell of a lot closer than we have now. That was trashed after 9/11 and crossing that line has never been the same.

972

There’s no such requirement. In fact, most members of the Commonwealth are republics, and many that aren’t have monarchs other than Charles III.

973

Indeed. Nor is the Commonwealth a trade/economic organisation, let alone a political/security one. It works as a intercontinental talking shop and a framework for co-operation in education, technical and development/capacity-building projects.

But in the unlikely event that they allowed the US to join, it could mean USAnians resident in the UK would be entitled to vote here (though would that mean they lose their US citizenship?)

Also, as the newest member, when it comes to the wreath laying at the Cenotaph on Remembrance Sunday, the US would come last in the order of precedence, after Gabon. Canada, as the oldest, goes first.

974

I had no idea about this. Certainly it’s not reciprocal and a UK resident of Canada can’t vote in elections here.

975

There are a lot of rules concerning how one votes in Canada (where you live, how to register, identifying yourself, etc.) but the only rules on who can vote are:

  1. be at least 18 years old
  2. have Canadian citizenship

So no. A UK citizen cannot vote in Canadian federal elections if they reside n Canada, if they do not have citizenship.

ETA: Ah, I see that is exactly what you stated. I need to read better. Carry on.

976

There is a time to do things and a time not to. Experienced doctors might know to try not to do risky procedures on a weekend, for example.

977

I have never said that they would be thrilled to join the US. I said they’d be better off financially. I’ve said that all the things that Canadians want such as universal health care would be available at the state level if they wanted to keep it. Right now the provinces provide health care, I have no reason to believe that a state couldn’t do the same thing other than they don’t do it now in the US, although some states are moving in that direction.

Are Canadians indistinguishable from Americans? Essentially yes. Certainly when compared to people living in Saudi Arabia, or Yemen, or Africa, or much of Europe. Our cultural differences are less pronounced and mostly similar. A person moving from Newfoundland to Calgary isn’t going to find it much different or more difficult than if they moved to Denver. There are outliers in both cultures, but for the most part we are the same.

Thank you, massah, for correcting me and my provincial outlook on how we should act. You are obviously superior in your thinking and know far better how we should be managing our resources and province. Why without you we wouldn’t know how stupid we are in trying to produce billions of dollars of resources and not leaving it in the ground. Now we should take your advice and not give our resources and money away,… to whoever wants to take them.

978

You know, I was actually interested in trying to understand how far right leaning Canadians feel and why but you’re not even debating in good faith so I’m out.

979

So drill baby drill Uzi???
Not one to think AGW is the greatest threat?
Trillions of dollars at stake continuing as you wont and you still don’t get it. :roll_eyes:

And no Canadians don’t want to be Americans :face_with_symbols_on_mouth:

American GINI index is pathetic, American’s healthcare rip off is astonishing you have millions of poor American’s subsisting on foodstamps - why would any Canadian or Australian be in the least bit interested in joining your corrupt country.

As I said, better Canadians and the West Coast USA form a federation.

980

The health “care” industry is a very powerful lobby in the US and between that and the ideological bent of the Republican party, much less the MAGAts, they would never tolerate the continuation of state-level government health care except, maybe, for pregnant women (once the babies are born, of course, both mother and child can be cut loose).

Yes, US states have Medicaid and Medicare, which is the closet thing to government-provided health care the US has - but DOGE is trying to dismantle both even as we speak. In any case - you have to either live long enough to qualify for Medicare, or be Officially Disabled (my late spouse - born with spina bifida - never qualified for that so make of that what you will), or be poor… with the caveat that it’s perfectly legal to restrict that to just poor children, or just pregnant women, or otherwise severely limit access. The result being that many, many poor adults, especially men, simply have no health coverage at all. Other than the mandate that ER’s must treat you if you’re in imminent danger of death. Unless you’re a pregnant woman in Texas, in which case your fetus is more important than you are. If you aren’t actively dying… screw you. Have cancer or something else chronic and need treatment? Sucks to be you if you can’t pay, you get nothing… until the point you’re in on the point of sudden death in which case the ER is obligated to patch you up sufficiently to put you out on the street again. Then sends you a bill you can’t pay and hounds you for the rest of your life.

Another scenario - a diabetic can’t afford insulin, can’t afford to go to the doctor. Then falls into a diabetic coma, is transported to the ER, and “fixed” - then turned out on the street again. Where they can’t get insulin, and can’t afford to go to the doctor. Then fall in to a diabetic coma… rinse and repeat, until they also go blind or have to have a limb amputated. Which won’t happen until it’s a matter of lop off a leg or the patient WILL die soon… but then back out in the world again, still no insulin, no doctor, and no rehab or prosthetics and hope to God someone gives them a wheelchair. I have known two people in that situation (both are dead now). IF the person is photogenic enough maybe they can get a GoFundMe to pay for their medical care but if not… they deteriorate and die.

Against that backdrop no, provincial health care will not survive. Also, Trump has repeatedly said he’ll “save” Canadians from high taxes… which is how your provincial health care is funded. So he’ll eliminate the money for it, then the US Health"care" industry will move in to impose private healthcare.

Maybe YOU don’t have a reason to believe that scenario, but I’ve lived in the US all my life and even worked for the Evil Insurance Empire for a decade and a half (at the time it was the only way to get health coverage for my family, which was sort of essential with a spouse with serious chronic health problems) and I sure as hell DO have a reason to think your Provincial health care would be doomed if the US took over Canada. Even the most progressive US state with the best Medicaid/Medicare programs is a pale, pale shadow of the worst Canadian Province health care situation.