Having grown up in Biloxi and now living in Baton Rouge, I know all too well.
The level of panic is straight through the roof.
There are ways to make your characters smart and careful and still engaging. The Road is a decent example of reasonable behavior in a post-apocalyptic setting. They were as careful as they could be and only took risks out of desperate need and the story was full of tension and drama. I don’t really expect the Walking Dead writers to be as good as Cormac McCarthy but they should be able to write a decent story with characters that don’t act like idiots. You shouldn’t have all the drama come as a result of your characters making stupid decisions. It’s like the horror movie cliche, “There’s a serial killer on the loose? We’d better split up!” It’s just lazy.
Put them in a reasonable shelter, they’ll still have to make trips for supplies and food. They’re still going to have to compete for those resources with the other survivors they come across. If they want to look for family or a cure, fine, but have them put a bit more thought and planning into it. Jumping in the RV that you KNOW is ready to break down is ridiculous when they have an entire city’s worth of vehicles within walking distance. And yeah, it’s a stressful messed up situation they’re in, people are going to panic and they’re going to make mistakes, nobody wants them to be perfect action heroes. But these people are so consistently stupid that sometimes I feel like rooting for the zombies.
And really, I don’t hate the show. (I bitch because I care. ;)) I just think that with a bit of effort it could be a lot better.
Here’s a snarky prediction of what’ll happen, courtesy of the Zombie Squad…
That’s true, but if they are convenient to pick up, it would be worth it. First of all, couldn’t you use them for a while without cleaning? (I don’t know anything about guns). Secondly, they might well run into some ex-soldier who knows how to do it and could teach them.
I agree that it would be silly to take extraordinary risks to get them, but worth salvaging if they could.
I couldn’t agree more. And I really don’t understand assertions like “people do the dumbest thing possible 90% of the time.” No, really, they don’t. People are pretty sensible. Especially when they have other people around to bounce ideas off of.
I have read dozens of post-apocalyptic novels, and I can attest that it is very possible to tell a good story about sensible people trying to survive. Most of them are like this, or else they would just be boring and annoying. (Like this show, IMHO)
If smart people wouldn’t have any trouble with this version of the apocalypse, the solution isn’t to make them stupid. The solution is to make the zombies more threatening and/or to make the risk of zombification greater.
Well-said, Terraplane. I agree completely. I also agree with you, Green Bean - I also read every PA book I can get my hands on, and I’ve read many great ones. The extended version of Stephen King’s The Stand has a series of vignettes of people who survived the superflu who were then killed in stupid, careless, unlucky ways - that really stuck with me. It doesn’t have to be superzombies to create tension in a post-apocalyptic world - there is nothing BUT tension in that world. I agree that it is lazy for the writers to be settling for such silliness for their tension in this series.
“A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it.” - Men in Black
We need to analyze this show from the point of view of its universe, which is no one seems to have what we think of as pop culture zombie knowledge. In their world, what has essentially happened is that a species-ending pandemic has finally happened, with the added bonus of the dead reviving and being hungry. It’s a wonder they aren’t just all catatonic.
Lori tells Rick that everyone is terrified and that’s why they are looking to someone to lead them. They aren’t stupid, they are just so scared that they can’t think straight.
That’s an interesting thought.
I’m no survivalist, but after reading The Stand when I was 12, I bet even then I had a pretty good head on my shoulders for how to live after the apocalypse – and there aren’t even any zombies. The worlds are similar in that they’re desolate and that other humans are ofter the chief source of danger. Using bicycles, siphoning gas for cars, carrying weapons, and being wary of other survivors - it’s all there.
Even in a world without zombie fiction, isn’t is near instinctual to know to shoot something in the head to *really *kill the hell out of it?
I’m not bothered by the show, but I do wish they’d pick up the pace. It’s starting to mirror Lost in that department.
Who cares if there’s zombie fiction in their world. Even animals know that if you’re under threat of attack, you build a fort or find something to act as such! Sheesh.
They essentially thought they had a fort… they were up in the hills in an area where they hadn’t seen walkers. They did have that one get in closer to them – the one that ate Daryl’s deer – but Shane resisted moving the camp when Rick suggested it. I don’t remember if they told the camp about it.
I do agree that there would be some people thinking in very practical terms as has been suggested, but those people would definitely meet resistance in one form or another from the people who were shell-shocked and exhausted. Would people with children be willing to give up a known quantity of safety (the camp) unless forced? I don’t think so.
The survivors aren’t just emotionally exhausted, either… think about the amount of physical labor they were doing just to maintain their scrubby lifestyle in the hillside camp… hauling water to and fro, cutting firewood, doing the laundry by hand, hunting or trapping, walking guard perimeters, etc. Jackie was a civil service worker, and Andrea was a lawyer. Lori was probably a housewife, as was Carol the abused wife. None of the men look particularly like athletes or used to living rough, other than Daryl. They’d be collapsing in exhaustion at the end of a typical day. Plus it looked summery. Outside Atlanta.
I just don’t find it that difficult to believe that they aren’t making smart survivor decisions.
Another consideration is that simply carrying a gun doesn’t help anyone who isn’t at least passingly familiar with firearms. Someone can show you the safety, but that doesn’t mean you’ll be able to hit the side of a barn when you aim and fire. Let alone consistent headshots on shambling targets. They are emphasizing the lack of ammunition they have available, as well. (Lori was shown whittling a point to something in the last episode and I thought, finally, someone is thinking of at least making long pointy sticks to poke at a zombie eyesocket, but I wouldn’t even want to get that close.)
The Tropes site calls this Genre Blindness (and it’s opposite is Genre Savvy).
Then the people that are thinking in practical terms would leave, because they know their lives depend on it. Those are the people whose story I really want to watch. The ones who stay behind? They’re all dead, every single one of them, unless they have lottery winner luck on a daily basis or a lazy writer propping them up.
I’ve read (long before today but also I think in either this or the last Walking Dead thread) that in SciFi/Fantasy you can ask your audience to make one major leap of faith but after that you have to keep your world logically consistent. Watching a show about those who are too stupid, slow, or broken to adapt is asking me to make allowances for not just zombies, but also an incredible and unending luck against all odds. When Rick found the bottom hatch of the tank in the first episode, that was awesome TV, if he finds an escape hatch every few episodes, that’s running the well dry.
Sounds like they’re wanting to work on the Deadwood template. Each episode was written by an individual writer (though I’m sure with input from Milch and others, but primarily the one writer) rather than a staff. It could be a good thing.
It looked like there was a large battle in the parking lot of the CDC. There were ad hoc military fortifications, vehicles, and hundreds to thousands of bodies. So it’s kinda weird there it’s completely empty. It also doesn’t make sense that there’s one guy in the building, unless he ate all his coworkers.
I personally think that’s why Morales and family left. The whole “family in Birmingham” thing was just an excuse. No need to burn bridges by telling the group “we’re leaving because you’re a bunch of idiots.”
Okay I went back and checked the tape. In hindsight I was thoroughly confused the whole episode in that I thought Shane was arguing to stay in the camp, and Rick was arguing to leave. I so did not get that they were both arguing to leave, just to different places. (Rick to CDC, Shane to Fort Benning.)
It was funny scanning through the episode a second time, I’d keep seeing lines of dialogue that seemed odd based on this misapprehension the first time around and remember being confused the first time. heh.
Anyway, here’s the original exchange that confused me:
*Rick: If there’s any government left, any structure at all, they’d protect the CDC at all costs, wouldn’t they. I think it’s our best shot.
Shane: Shelter, protection, rescure; you want those things, alright, I do too, okay? Now if they exist, they’re at the Army base at Fort Benning.
Lori: That’s 100 miles in the opposite direction.*
I thought Shane was saying that if the CDC exists – as in hasn’t been overrun yet – it’s way off at Fort Benning, too far to realisticly get to. Lori chimes in to confirm the unreasonable distance. (I was confused by the word “opposite” but just let it go.)
Just to finish this off for the thread, the only sign was a big yellow sign at the front gate:
\\ STOP ////
MILITARY CHECKPOINT
1ST CAV 3RD ???CIAL TR…
The ?s are where a dead body was leaning against the sign, and the … is where the screen cut it off.
A couple other notes on my confusion:
I ssaw the Military Checkpoint sign the first time, feeding in to my misunderstadning that they had arrived at Fort Benning. Also, they left at dawn and appeared to be driving through nowhere, as opposed to going around a major city. They did break down, but then stated they could see a place where they’d walk to to get parts to repair the RV. If you can see it, it’s within 3 miles, so figure 3-4 hours to fix the RV. Given that, what the hell took them so long in making a 21 minute trip starting at dawn to arriving at dusk. That part makes much more sense if it were the 100 mile trip.
This is also relevant to the complaints that they showed up at dusk. They left at dawn; what more can you do to avoid showing up at dusk? It certainly wasn’t intentional.
Thanks for looking at the sign - I had hoped that it had more relevant information for us. Well, we do know it was a military checkpoint there, which we had probably figured out from all the dead soldiers. 
Plus a tank.