Thinking of joining the military--opinions please

In My Humble Opinion
1

My fiance is thinking of joining either the Air Force or the Navy. We have found a lot of good info on the about.com website, but still have questions. (Also would appreciate any personal anecdotes that anyone would care to share.)

When you live on base- are you allowed to have pets?

What’s it like living overseas?

How likely is it that he would get posted overseas?

How long would he have to serve before he could request a specific posting? (Like for example, could he request a posting in Europe?)

What are these branches’ boot camps like? (We know about Army boot camp, but we don’t have a lot of info on these.)

Are you able to choose the job you train for? (I know that job qualifications are based on the ASVAB scores- he will be getting a study guide for that.)

How many hours a week would he be working after going through boot and training camp?

Are the benefits as good as they say?

How likely is it that he would see action in any current or upcoming conflicts? (Keep in mind that he wouldn’t qualify as a pilot if Air Force is his choice.)

There’s lots of talk of military benefits to continuing education- how well does the G.I. bill and those other continuing education programs work?

I’ll probably have more questions later but those are good to start with. If you have any other good websites, we would appreciate links. (We’ve already seen the “Official” websites of the Air Force and the Navy, though, and they didn’t have a lot of info- they were more like advertisements, so please don’t bother with those.)

Thanks in advance!

2

I am a retired (Army) officer and so I have limited knowledge of the Air Force. That being said, do it.

Housing for married junior people may be problematic. Instead of on-base quarters you may get cash to pay for a place downtown.

You will curse the Air Force (and get 30 days of paid vacation a year), be angry at the Housing people (and get free housing, with a pet) and you will be upset when you ask for Italy and get California.

You will miss each other when he goes off for a six-week school, a four-week deployment and then you will celebrate when he gets home.

It is a tough, stressful life. You will be away from your family when you get pregnet; but you will make new friends at every stop around the world.

Do it, do your part to make everyon safer.

3

I can answer the questions that I know the answers to. They’re all from personal experience, so if I’m off on something, keep that in mind. I’m sure my husband would be able to tell you more, but he’s at work right now.

*When you live on base- are you allowed to have pets? *
On the base we lived at in Charleston, you were able to have pets. I know dogs and cats were fine, and I am not sure about anything else.

*What are these branches’ boot camps like? (We know about Army boot camp, but we don’t have a lot of info on these.) *
Navy boot camp lasted from about mid-April until mid-June. I think it was 9 weeks + another week or so. From what John said, it was hard, but once you get used to what’s going on, it’s not bad. It sucked being away from him for that time, but I got used to it as well.

*Are you able to choose the job you train for? (I know that job qualifications are based on the ASVAB scores- he will be getting a study guide for that.) *
He was able to choose the job he wanted. He’s in the nuclear field, though, and there really aren’t that many jobs available there. I dont know what it’s like if you’re not nuke.

*How many hours a week would he be working after going through boot and training camp? *
Depends on what he’s doing. John got out of boot camp in June 2001, and started school in early July. There were times that he’d be up there from 4 or 5 in the mirning until midnight, coming home for about an hour at lunch, and maybe that long for dinner. This wasn’t every day, though.

*iAre the benefits as good as they say? *
They’re not bad. If you like not having to pay rent (since we’ve just been on fairly small bases, we haven’t had a problem getting housing.) or medical bills (a big one, since I’m pregnant now. I think the entire pregnancy & delivery is going to cost us about $25 or so.), the benefits are good. I am a little irritated at the time that it takes you to get an appointment at times, but overall, I can’t really complain.

4

My opinion on joining the military is: don’t.

5

Fairblue, most of your questions are so general they’re hard to answer, especially considering we don’t know anything about the two of you and what job he’s going to wind up with. But I’ll take a crack at some of your questions anyway.

From a Naval Officer’s perspective: Yes, you are allowed to have pets when you live on base (we had a dog). But for us, there’s always a wait-list, so it may take up to a year until a house opens up. In the meantime, you have to find a place out in town which’ll take pets.

I haven’t lived overseas yet, but I’ve spent a lot of time overseas. It’s really where you are and what you make of it. For some families, it’s a problem if the spouse wants to work. Job opportunities (especially if you don’t have an easily transferrable job like a teacher or nurse) are few and far between overseas. At the same time, it’s perfect if you like traveling and seeing the world.

For getting posted overseas, I’d say there’s a pretty high chance if he’s in for multiple tours. For the AF, I’m guessing the high-probability place is somewhere in Europe. For the Navy, it could be tons of places (southern Europe, Japan, Mid-East). I have no clue how long he’d have to serve to have an input on where he goes. Heck, he may be offered a choice of locations right off the bat.

Can’t speak for the boot camps. Airman Doors would be the perfect guy to ask about this.

Hours/week: again, this totally depends. If he winds up doing office work, probably around 40. If he’s standing watches on a ship, he may be working closer to 60.

Benefits: again, this is what you make of it. If you really take advantage of all the benefits that are available, then they can be great. Some people who don’t live on base find it very inconvenient to always use the commissary and go to the base gym, so they may not take advantage of these. It all depends. You’ll probably see a huge payoff if you start a family. The medical costs you’ll save can be substantial.

As far as seeing action goes, if he’s AF, then I’d say there’s only a slim chance he’d be in a warzone facing actual hostilities. If he’s Navy, there’s a greater chance, although it’s still pretty low.

Education: The GI Bill is great. I have it but haven’t taken advantage of it yet, but it’s nice to know it’s in my back pocket for when I get out. There’s something called tuition assistance which you may also want to look into.

My advice to you (and him) is once he decides which service to enter, to check into career progression (how easy/hard it is to work your way up the ladder to E-7) and also re-enlistment bonuses. I’d also recommend getting a handful of names (from whatever recruiter you’re dealing with) for people who are working the same type of job he winds up considering. Their perspective may be helpful for you guys.

6

Good question, fairblue, my take is in the <<>>.

My fiance is thinking of joining either the Air Force or the Navy. We have found a lot of good info on the about.com website, but still have questions. (Also would appreciate any personal anecdotes that anyone would care to share.)

When you live on base- are you allowed to have pets?
<<Most places, yes, but there may be size and number restrictions, plus you’re on military property, so the pets would be there at the discretion of the military, and can be removed at the discretion of the military.>>

What’s it like living overseas?
<<Depends, if you live in military housing, and never leave the base, you’d just be living in a conclave of 'mericans. If you live off-base, it can truly be a rewarding experience seeing how other cultures conduct their day-to-day business, plus you have the opportunity to make new friends for life. The morale, welfare and rec (MWR) activities usually work overtime providing the military family with the opportunity to do lots of things overseas. From discoounted ski trips to Eur-rail passes, etc. (If for instance, you were stationed in Europe)>>

How likely is it that he would get posted overseas?
<<As a low-ranking enlisted person, it is VERY likely. Especially if he’s in the Navy. And there’s 90% probability that if he’s in the Navy, he will be assigned to a ship, which due to the current anti-terrorism initiatives, he can look forward to a 6-month deployment real soon.>>

How long would he have to serve before he could request a specific posting? (Like for example, could he request a posting in Europe?)
<<Usually, straight out of boot camp, depending on the rating he’s going for, he will be attending schools for up to a year and a half. From my Navy experience, I was able to select my first real duty station because I was at the top of my graduating class. FWIW, the military usually assigns duty station dependent on the needs of the military.
Remember this phrase, ON THE NEEDS OF THE (ARMY, NAVY, AF, CG, MARINES). You will see this again.>>

What are these branches’ boot camps like? (We know about Army boot camp, but we don’t have a lot of info on these.)
<<The Navy’s boot camp is just a head game, it’s really not physically trying like the Army or the Marines. When he leaves for boot, don’t expect to see him until graduation, approx. 8-10 weeks>>

Are you able to choose the job you train for? (I know that job qualifications are based on the ASVAB scores- he will be getting a study guide for that.)
<<Get everything in writing BEFORE he leaves for boot. That means if he wants to be an electrician, and attend the requisite electrician training schools, have the recruiter put that in WRITING, BEFORE he leaves for boot, and have copies made. Depending (remember this?) ON THE NEEDS OF THE (ARMY, NAVY, AF, CG, MARINES), if he goes in with the intent of being an electrician, w/o paperwork, and the Army decides they need cooks, guess who’s gonna be going to cooking school.>>

How many hours a week would he be working after going through boot and training camp?
<<The concept of a 40 hour work week in the military is unknown. Depending on duty station, rank, mission, you might find a forty hour a week job, but that doesn’t include standing duty (guard, phone, admiral’s dog watch, you name it), which could mean being at the job once every four days for 24 hours, to one whole weekend a month, or one two hour watch every 30 days. Remember the Navy’s old jingle, it’s not just a job, it’s an adventure?>>

Are the benefits as good as they say?
<<30 days paid leave a year, (try finding the time to use it), full dental and medical including dependents, (however, there are a lot of hoops to jump through for dependents unscheduled visits). Commissary and exchange privileges, which can be good or bad depending on where you live.>>

How likely is it that he would see action in any current or upcoming conflicts? (Keep in mind that he wouldn’t qualify as a pilot if Air Force is his choice.)
<<There’s a very good chance. My bud who’s a reserve EOD chief, just got sent to replace active duty guys in the Med. for a year>>

IMHO, that’s a pretty good ballpark summation, I think Monty or Tranquilis can give you more in-depth stuff on the bennies, as the former was a personnelman, and the latter was a detailer, IIRC. Like anything else, you get out of it what you put into it. I really enjoyed it for the time I was in, but found where I wanted to go didn’t jive with the Navy’s vision and left. I’ve got plenty of friends who are still in, so needless to say it’s not for everybody, but most of those who stay are highly motivated individuals.

Oh, and Otto, thanks for the pithy reply. We need every good person we can get.

7

I am not in the military but I was raised as a military brat.
When you live on base- are you allowed to have pets?

It really depends. For the most part you can have any type of Aquarium life (fish and sometimes reptiles) that you want in the barracks. If you have actual housing you can have dogs and cats as well. You will find that if you move overseas a whole lot that having pets becomes a burden because they always have to go into quarantine for a month or two in every country you go to.

What’s it like living overseas?

It is pretty cool. It is tough if you don’t speak the language. It is hard to learn a foreign language in Asian and more developing countries because they see English as a “wave of the future.” They will want to practice their English with you much more than you will be able to practice your foreign language with them. European countries like France and Germany have a more nationalistic language so it won’t be as much of a problem there.

How likely is it that he would get posted overseas?

Your first post can be anywhere. If you do it right you can move every few months and never have the same job twice. However, if the country goes to war you won’t have an option where to live. They will tell you.

How long would he have to serve before he could request a specific posting? (Like for example, could he request a posting in Europe?)

According to my father you can do that from day one. You may not get it since many of those postings are very competitive.

What are these branches’ boot camps like? (We know about Army boot camp, but we don’t have a lot of info on these.)

I hear the Air Force’s boot camp is significantly easier than the other Armed forces from friends in the Air Force. I think the Navy has a swimming requirement.

Are you able to choose the job you train for? (I know that job qualifications are based on the ASVAB scores- he will be getting a study guide for that.)

I can’t answer that one specifically. The recruiters say you can choose any type of job you want but it was my experience with friends who joined the military that they were really pressured to do other things than those that they wanted. For what it is worth, an Air Force friend with no depth perception became an Aircraft welder. He was covered with burns from the rivets constantly because he couldn’t tell how far something was from him.

How many hours a week would he be working after going through boot and training camp?

Most jobs are 40 hours a week jobs. If in war that changes where he will likely always be on call.

Are the benefits as good as they say?

My father and one of my best friends both retired from the military at 50. Neither one has to work but they both get bored and do work when they feel like it. The dental insurance isn’t great but the basic health insurance is good. Try to always go to a private doctor though. The military doctors that I have went to in the past aren’t as “customer friendly.” That basically means that they saw you as an assembly line product rather than as a person. This however is just my impression from the various military doctors I had visited.

How likely is it that he would see action in any current or upcoming conflicts? (Keep in mind that he wouldn’t qualify as a pilot if Air Force is his choice.)

That really depends. A coworker of mine is in the Marine National Guards. He is going to be shipped out later this week. I think the National Guard is used much more for infantry than the typical armed forces. However, in joining the military you should know that you have no choice in who goes to war. If it happens he may have to go away for a while and won’t necessarily come back.

There’s lots of talk of military benefits to continuing education- how well does the G.I. bill and those other continuing education programs work?

One of the provisions of the GI Bill is that you will almost always get “in-state tuition” from American universities. They also have a small stipend that can go towards tuition and books. You have to get a passing grade for any type of reimbursement otherwise it comes out of your own pocket. On a side note, all of the Armed forces offer a program where they will pay a certain amount towards your college education which I believe is near 60K after serving for a predetermined amount of time. I believe this time frame is around 4 or 5 years as a signing on bonus. If you sign on without planning on going or already having attended college you will sometimes get a similar cash bonus.
With all that said, there are an equal number of bad things that can happen to anyone who is in the military. They take care of their people but you have a job where you can be called away to die at anytime. You are basically a slave to the government for however long you are in the military. That means they control where you live, what you do, and when you go to war. You have some moderate control in that but it isn’t completely worthwhile. Also, in many places where you will be stationed you aren’t necessarily needed or wanted in the area. If you somehow got stationed in France the locals will likely hate you if the polls we see on the media are to be believed, for example.

8

I too have been pondering a life in the military…Perhaps you could explain why this is a bad idea Otto?

My question was always about the food. I hate cheese* with a passion, and don’t much care for other dairy products either. However, I’ve heard that mac & cheese is a main staple at basic.
True?
[sub]*I swear I’m not a whiner, I just dread the thought of force-feeding myself for 10 weeks.[/sub]

9

My sister was in the Air Force during the Vietnam War. Although I can answer your specific questions, there are some things I can pass on:

  • You have to be able to deal with authority well. As the saying goes: "If it moves, salute it; if it doesn’t move, paint it.
  • You are military property. You will go where they need you and do what they tell you.
  • The military is the Armed Forces. Don’t ever join with the expectation or hope that you will never see conflict.

Having said that, the benefits are good (even airlines and hotels hand out military discounts), the retirement plan is good, and you can’t beat the job security.

10

In short, no. While there will be a lot of mac’n’cheese available, the dietary plan follows a basic American diet. The premise is take all ya want, eat all that you take.

11

So you actually get a choice? I thought they just slopped a spoonful of whatever on your plate, and you had better damned well eat it.

Of course, I also think my DI would be R. Lee Ermey, and “Time” or “Painted Black” would play during every action sequence…:smiley:

12

Unless they have changed the ASVAB in the past few years, there’s no need for him to study for it. One, it simply tests your natural aptitudes. Two, it is beyond easy.

Put it this way. I blew it out of the water.

(Except the mechanical stuff.)

So if I can do well on it, considering I am the antithesis of military material, chances are they’ll just go ahead and make a graven image of your fiance and worship it several times a day after they see his scores.

13

I’m a pacifist. I don’t think anyone should join any military ever.

And I don’t plan on debating the merits of pacifism in this or any other thread so please don’t bother trying to provoke me into it. I’m just answering the question posed.

14

At the risk of an unsolicited “me too” post, me too.

15

Interesting.

I too, am a pacifist by nature.

However the rest of the world is not, so until then I am still considering joining the ranks.

Thanks for answering. [sub]Even though that was more of a personal opinion, and in no way answering the OP.[/sub]

16

I’m 3 years out of the Air Force. Airman Doors will be the most helpful for you as he just got out of AF basic and IIRC is still in “tech school”. I will tell you what I know.

<When you live on base- are you allowed to have pets? >
If you live in “Family Housing” you are allowed the standard domestic pets. If you live in the dorms, you are allowed fish AFAIK.

<What’s it like living overseas? >
I never lived overseas in my 5 years in the AF. Most people that lived overseas LOVED it. If you stay for more than 4 in the AF it is almost a positive that you will spend 12 months in Korea. At least that was the case in the late '90s.

<How likely is it that he would get posted overseas? >
Pretty good chance for an overseas tour. Especially if he signs up for 6 or re-enlists.

<How long would he have to serve before he could request a specific posting? (Like for example, could he request a posting in Europe?) >
You get to fill out a “dream sheet” in basic. It is an official document that lists bases and/or regions you would like to be stationed in. Which pretty much guarantees you WON’T be going those places :slight_smile:

<What are these branches’ boot camps like? (We know about Army boot camp, but we don’t have a lot of info on these.) >
Air Force boot camp was relatively easy physically speaking. The hardest part for me was being a little homesick.

<Are you able to choose the job you train for? (I know that job qualifications are based on the ASVAB scores- he will be getting a study guide for that.) >
If you score decent on the ASVAB you can do pretty much whatever you want in the AF. If, IF, that job is needed at the time. If you want a specific job, wait in “Delayed Enlistment” until it becomes available. I went in as an “Open Electronics” which really could have bitten me in the butt. I got lucky and got a decent job (computer maintenance). I highly recommend he wait for a job he really wants.

<How many hours a week would he be working after going through boot and training camp? >
Generally around 40. BUT, the military isn’t a regular job. You WILL have to come in early (or stay late) for work or for Commanders Calls. There are enough extra things to do outside of work that it can be a hassle. You can be called into work at 0430 on a sat morning for an exercise. You may also get to go home early 4 days a week for years at a time. It all depends on your job.

<Are the benefits as good as they say? >
There are so many benefits. Looking through the posts so far, its funny just seeing on what different people count as “benefits”. The education benefits are HUGE. GI Bill, FREE CLEP’s, time off work to go to school, when you are still in they pay for most or all of your school, time at work to study if nothing is going on, plenty of resources at the education center (they have a staff of around 8 people at most bases just for education AND the local schools will have representatives full time in the same building) and it is good for your career in the AF to be going to school.
The medical benefits are free. Not the best in the world, but they are free. It can be hard to get an appointment sometimes. They will give you codeine for EVERYTHING (my experience, other people say percocet). You almost never have to wait in the waiting room for more than 2 minutes.
When you get out of the military there are people holding your hand, looking for jobs for you, helping you to “transfer into the civilian world”. One of your last weeks in the AF you get to go to a class for week in civies, learning how to fill out applications and write resumes, etc.
Most bases have Clubs on base that is basically a really cheap bar. Bases often have lakes for fishing, swimming, etc. Shooting clubs. SCCA racing in a parking lot on Offutt AFB. Cheap tickets to sporting events and theme parks. Wood working shops. Auto working shops (with every tool you would EVER need for a car). Intramural sports. There is always something to do.
Bottom line, there are some GREAT benefits to being in the military. Some you cant avoid. Some you have to go do yourself.

<How likely is it that he would see action in any current or upcoming conflicts? (Keep in mind that he wouldn’t qualify as a pilot if Air Force is his choice.) >
AF, not to likely. Navy, slightly more but still pretty low I would guess. You and him HAVE to realize that he can and may be called up to go to a war zone at any time.

<There’s lots of talk of military benefits to continuing education- how well does the G.I. bill and those other continuing education programs work? >
You will get out of them what you put in them. If your work center is a good work center there is NO reason why you can’t at least get your Associates (for free) in a 4-year enlistment. I knew several people that got their bachelors in that time. There are a couple of choices here at Offutt for accelerated programs, weekends only. I curse myself often for not getting a degree out of my time in. I’m lazy that way.

17

OK, this what I know

I was in the Navy for 10 years, enlisted, and female. In the beginning I was single, but got married to a fellow Navy member.

Military life is a hard life, it’s not a 8 hour a day / 40 hour week, you work real damn hard. You will work until the job gets done, and you will have a day of duty, probably rotates once every 6 days, 24 hours of work, either in your shop, or on watch.

You will have fun, travel, and see and experience things, you either have never, or would not have seen or done. I have been aboard ship overseas to Hawaii (3 times), Victoria, Canada, Guam, Singapore, Malaysia, Hong Kong, Bahrain, and United Arab Emirates. I have been to San Diego (station & lived) San Francisco, Seattle, Memphis, TN, Wash, DC/MD/VA in the US.

In school you are allowed to fill out a “dream sheet” for your assignment, Shore/Sea, Overseas, East or Weat Coast.
My first assignment after school was aboard ship, I did get to pick relatively where I went. You get asked first East or West Coast.
I took West Coast, then they say San Diego or San Francicso. I picked San Diego, then they tell you you’ll going to a ship, even if you say shore. After your school they always send you to sea-duty on board a ship, unless you go overseas, which I didn’t want to go there.

Now a days you can be stationed in one location for your career, for example, if your married, to keep the trauma down by moving every 3 to 5 years, you can homestead, like in San Diego, Ca.

I don’t know anything about On-base housing, I lived on board ship, during my sea-duty. On shore-duty I lived in the barracks, married to a Navy person, but I was stationed in Washington D.C., and he was stationed in Philadelphia, PA we both lived in the barracks on our bases.

When I left the Navy, my husband was still in, we lived in Jacksonville, FL Off-base. One thing I do know about On-base housing from friends, I have known, your neighbors (Busy Bodies, usually a Navy Dependant) are always trying to get into your business.

I don’t know about the pet policy, but I would assume it would be as if you lived in a normal rental/leasing community.

The ASVAB, is taken to find out what job they can offer you and what you have the aptitude for. You usually have a few choices, but the job classifiers want to put in a job that is needed to be filled quickly, so let’s say you have the scores to be a Photographer or an Electronics Technician, if they need the ET, that’s the job they will fill.

Navy Boot Camp, 9 weeks, you will go to Great Lakes, IL. You will have physicals - body, dental, mental, you get shots, you will also get drug tested constantly. You get up early and do Physical Therapy (Exercising and Running) and Marching.

You will stand watches. You are told what to do 24/7.

You will learn Naval/Military History, Navy/Military Regulations, UCMJ (military law and conduct, all branches are bound), Military Ranks and Structure, Uniform Regulations (how to wear your uniform), Flags and Semaphore, Firefighting/Damage Control, Chemical, Biological, Radiological Warefare/Defense (Gasmask training), Phone Talking, Pistol Shooting (usually 45 cal. or 9 mil. pistol), Ships, and Shipboard Etiquette, Survival-At-Sea, You will need to know how to swim/float, If you don’t they will teach you.

Education benefits are good, GI Bill, various other offerings. When on ship, underway you can take college credited classes. On shore duty, you can take continue taking college credited classes.

Medical and Dental are available. Training, pay and vacation
are good.

Keep in mind, you are serving your country, in any branch of service that you go into. If it is decided by the president (who by the way is the commander-in-chief), to take on war, or peace-keeping, or some other endeavor, that will be done. Whether you agree, or not, with the policy or philosophy. You are told what to do, and you will be expected to follow any order to the letter.

I am not trying to dissuade or scare you, I am trying to be up-front, I wish my recruiter would have been so forthright.

This is alot, and I do not regret my decision to enlist in the Navy.
I learned a good job, that I have taken to the civilain community.
I make a good living, and it’s because of the school I went to.
I have traveled, and I have went to school, I still have GI Bill money to use.

Also, go talk to the Navy recruiter, you get alot more talking to a real sailor than going to Navy.com.

Overall, I wouldn’t change anything I have done.

18

What’s with the pacifists having four letter screen names? Is it a club thing? Do you have secret handshakes?

But to the OP. The wife of a serviceman (speaking in generalities here, folks) has a support structure that can be very good or very loose, depending on who is running it. When he is out on a six month deployment with his unit, there can be a phone tree and weekly or monthly meetings at someone’s house to get together and share news. You will have thousands of people about the same age as you, with the some of the same issues as you. And friends who have been through what you may be going through for the first time. Best of luck to you both. He should join the Marines, if for nothing else than the uniform to get married in.

19

Ah, but Uncle Bill, you know what you get when you cross a gorilla and a Marine!
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.
.
.
.
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A retarded gorilla! :smiley:

20

Thanks for the responses so far. We have talked to a recruiter, but still it’s useful to get as many different perspectives on it as we can before deciding to jump.

We know that he may be sent to war if he signs up and we don’t really have a problem with it. I agree with Spit on that count. We would also like to be pacifists, but unfortunately some societies act like a cancer to the living organism that is human society. On that count conflict just can’t be avoided. Perhaps in the future we will evolve past the point of having to go to war, but for now we understand that history leads the way.

Thanks again, and please keep the anecdotes coming.