I have no personal experience, but I have noticed that, in every war movie or television program I have seen where a grenade is tossed, it is done so in a peculiar and awkward manner. The tosser uses a stiff-armed, overhead motion that seems as though it would be less accurate and would cover less distance than using a standard baseball-throwing type motion.
Anyone know the reason for this?
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Hand grenades are heavy! Try throwing a brick each way, and see which one goes farther.
Oh, and I was in the Army infantry. They taught us overhand.
According to my source (retired Army husband sitting right next to me), a hand grenade weighs about three pounds. A baseball-type throw won’t work. It’s too heavy, and he said you’d break your arm.
He says the whole idea is to get it as FAR away from you as possible. The best way is to extend your arm, and throw it overhead. Do NOT bend your elbow; you want all the energy of the throw to get the grenade AWAY from YOU.
Oh, and forget the John Wayne business of using your teeth to pull the pin. He said you’d bust your teeth, and if the pin is dislodged in any way, you’d end up blowing up yourself. It takes a tremendous yank to get the pin out of the grenade.
~VOW
Which type has a better range–pineapples or potato mashers?
Studies I read actually showed that there is great variability in how soldiers actually throw grenades (this was research I read while in service); as long as the motion was generally overhanded and their body was facing sideways towards the enemy position variability in personal throwing style didn’t necessitate correction.
Grenades are heavier than you’d think, but they also don’t weigh 3 lb. The grenades we used in my day weighed 14 oz, a little lighter than the 16 oz. M61 (an M26 variant) which was lighter than the 21 oz. Mk 2. The Mk 2 is the “pineapple” grenade, and hasn’t been used by the U.S. Army since the Korean War. The M61 and M67 are somewhat rounded “smooth” looking grenades.
My understanding (based on historical knowledge and rudimentary physics) is the potato mashers will always have better range. However, because of their design they are inherently going to produce less fragmentation and their primary method of killing or disabling is through the force of the explosion itself. The lethality radius is smaller, essentially. The Germans preferred this sort of grenade because of their offensive warfare doctrine, because of the smaller radius of effect charging troops could hurl them forward and they would detonate without the advancing soldiers being at risk of being harmed by their own grenade.
The more common types of grenades used by other powers are designed to produce a large amount of fragmentation and to kill and disable both through the force of the explosion and by sending metal shards all over the place at high velocity causing serious injuries and/or death. The greater radius means that if you’re in a defensive position more traditional grenades will be much more effective in an anti-personnel role, and they still can be highly effective in an offensive role as well.
While the potato masher is a specialized tool, I wouldn’t want one over a standard issue grenade. Some of the early models from c. WWI also had the habit of being extremely easy to detonate…one of the worst possible design flaws when it comes to hand grenades.
It’s interesting to read about historical grenades. “Grenadier” as you might expect has its origins in units that were specialized at heavy assault and the use of grenades. Grenades in the 17th and 18th century were iron balls filled with gunpowder and thus were much heavier than anything we use today, so grenadiers tended to be atypically large for their time. Because hurling or rolling these iron balls of death could open breaches in enemy defensive positions or lines, grenadiers were often used for heavy assault actions. Over time the specialized grenade techniques lost importance, but grenadier as a name for regiments was kept in many armies as a traditional form, and became synonymous with “heavy assault” infantry.
I was taught to throw them like you describe. I was a transportation officer, so I never carried grenades while on active duty, but I had limited training on them. Throwing a live grenade was one of the scariest training exercises I did. It’s just freaky holding the grenade with the pin pulled, right by your ear, for several seconds while aiming before the throw. And the concussion is pretty big…you feel the blast in your chest, even when behind a blast wall.
ROTC. We were taught two different ways over my 4 years. The first was sort of “shot-put” style and the other an extended stiff arm rolled almost windmill fashion. What was drilled into us was more spoon control - leaving the spoon in place until the moment of release just in case the situation changed and the throw had to be canceled or majorly changed. Sarge was very clear that the “let the spoon fly, count to two and then throw” was not to be attempted by anyone other than John Wayne.
Here’s how the People’s Liberation Army throws grenades.
Frag grenades aren’t that heavy at all - around 1 lb (or 0.5 kg). We were taught to throw them “like throwing a rock at a cat” (my Sgt.'s actual words); if we played baseball, I guess that would be “baseball-style”.
Same here. We were specifically instructed not to lob the grenade like how people do it in the movies.
I never got to handle a live grenade, but those things were no kidding around. I must have been half a mile from the range, and those things still had a respectable (and tactile) BOOM.
Was everyone rather quiet while waiting for their turn and no one would admit to being scared? It was like that for my group.
Tabby cat: "I never got to handle a live grenade, but those things were no kidding around. I must have been half a mile from the range, and those things still had a respectable (and tactile) BOOM. "
Yeah, first time we heard it, we all stopped talking and thought “That is what it sounds like?” I’ve never seen a movie or a piece of footage that really recreates the sound. It’s intimidating.
One possible reason why the high throw might be used is because grenade training often puts a high wall in-between the thrower and the explosion ground. In that case, throwing at a high angle is useful to reduce the likelyhood that the grenade will hit the wall and bounce back.
As for movies, it’s more dramatic and easy to see if the soldier throws the grenade that way.
The standard US and Canadian anti-personnel frag grenade weighs less than one pound: M67 grenade - Wikipedia
If I remember correctly, hand grenade range is supposed to be about 30 meters: as in, don’t bother putting obstacles within 30 meters of your trench, if the enemy is within 30 meters, they’ll be using grenades.
Also keep in mind that in many circumstances where grenades might be used, you’re throwing them into a door or window you’re next to.
Well, strictly speaking they could, but they weren’t really intended for throwing: SPECIAL USES OF STICK GRENADES
Yeah, it’s like a deep THUMP, and you feel it as much as you hear it.
Funny grenade story:
We did armored combat as part of our advanced infantry training, which meant riding around the desert in an M113 APC. One of the things we practiced is the so-called “bazooka drill”, which is what you’re supposed to do if you spot a guy popping out from behind a rock with an RPG: turn toward him, open fire with everything you’ve got, run him over, and throw a grenade out the back to confirm the kill. Since we were driving around with the roof flaps open, the drill was to throw the grenade out of the top of the vehicle.
I went first: we attacked, and as we passed the target I leaned out of the roof, and - holding the grenade outside the vehicle - pulled the pin and dropped it, at which point my lieutenant, Chaim, who had been holding me by my vest, pulled me back to safety. I heard the grenade go off, Chaim declared the exercise a success, and we went around for another go.
Next guy up was a short, nervous Argentinian by the name of Paco. Once more we turned, fire, charged, Paco leaned, and was pulled back in.
No boom.
We looked up. Paco was holding the grenade in his hand and in what I would later decide was a suspiciously calm voice, said that he hadn’t been able to pull the pin. Chaim nodded and gave the order to go again. Once more: charge, lean, pull - and this time, boom. End of exercise.
Later that night in our tent, we found out the truth. Paco hadn’t had a problem with the pin. He had pulled it out just fine in the first try. What he had done was hesitate to throw the grenade, which means that when Chaim had pulled him back inside the APC, he had a live fragmentation grenade in his hand. We had driven around for a good five minutes, on rocky terrain, ten guys in an aluminum box, with only the nervous grip of a terrified 18-year-old new immigrant separating life from death.
And this is footage of the elite Chinese supersoldiers in action -
And more action from the frontlines of WW3 is this highly secret training footage of Western Very Special Forces -
only kidding, I’m well aware than anyone can make a mistake!
I’m curious if the thrower is frequently hit by the shrapnel from a fragmentation grenade. I have memories of 1960s firecrackers blowing a tin can 8 feet in the air, so I often imagine grenades shooting metal 60 or 70 feet (or more).
My sgt. wanted me to throw it “like a rotten tomato to a lousy band at open stage concert.” Makes sense, you do not want to hit someone or something directly in front of you, so you aim for steeper angle. And you want to stay as low as possible in every war.
Never threw live one, that goes KaBOOM though. Only trainer ones that go pfffstt …
I have only ever thrown them as more of a lob. Although they are not terribly heavy they are heavy enough. Throwing them exactly like a baseball could hurt your elbow.
One thing that greatly changes your motion is that you don’t hold it like a baseball. Letting go of the spoon leads to bad things. So instead of a two fingered grip it’s more like throwing a palm ball.
Like a baseball everytime. Even the grip, actually. Not exactly doctrine though.
Training Grenade:
Real Grenade:
(Turn your volume and bass up)