Immediately after writing this I got the Guardians Daily Society Briefing in my email box. The lead story was “homeless charity says giving money to beggars kills them”.
link:
and from TRB’s own page:
http://www.thamesreachbondway.com/news.htm#begging
I realise that this may not be relevant for ireland - but I think it probably is.
I get called a fat knacker all the time. It doesn’t mean that in england - it means someone who has let themselves go (so sadly accurate in my case)
Yeah but thats ten euro roubles. i’m talking about ten of her Britanic Majesty’s pounds
I gave to a sax player once, silently hoping he’d spend some of it on lessons. Saw him a few months later and he apparently had. MUCH less unpleasant to listen to.
Yeah, but how many of them are there in a tenner do you think?
Ten, perchance?
We can’t call a ten euro note a sevenquidder, just to suit you.
Although, it does have a strangely pleasing resonance, if you say it quickly
What possible incentive could someone have for begging if they had money to begin with? I can’t imagine them making anything… hell, you could probably earn more in four hours at McDonald’s than four days begging.
Yeah, he’s always there, and he’s a pain in the arse.
Aesiron you would be surprised.
There was a woman who used to beg around here - right by Busse Woods Forest Preserves. Heck, she listed (and the police used) Busse Woods as her ADDRESS. And every single time they booked her (for begging - she used to hold up a sign - it’s a high traffic area - “Homeless, have 2 kids - help”) she’d have well over $300 bucks on her. She and another woman used to trade off the sign so the other could get a break. Was written up in the Daily Herald a few years ago. Apparently, her take home pay per diem was more than mine was at my full time job at a roofing co. 
Then again, on the flipside, I see so many people (and have seen so many of my co-workers and friends - especially in the industry I’m in) lose jobs, lose houses, lose their livelihoods - what spooje said, “There but for the grace of God, go I” sinks home in a way it never has before. If I can help someone, goddammit, I’m going to.
Reality check in Aisle 4.
:rolleyes:
I didn’t say ALL. I just said it existed. Please view the post immediately above yours for confirmation of such possibilities.
That made me laugh out loud, and now my boss wants to know what’s so funny…
Damn you
:o
A US view: During the Reagan administration there was a push for de-institutionalization of the mentally ill, plus more community-based care. In theory this was great, but budget constraints led to hundreds of thousands getting little or any help at all. I live in an area with a pretty healthy economy, but there is not a single bed for in-patient care of the mentally ill. I have health insurance, but it covers only 10 precent of mental health service. I’m looking for a cite, but I seem to remember that the untreated mentally ill are a great majority of the homeless population.
I remember her! I felt bad for her the first time I saw her (over by the Woodfield exit off 53). The second time, several months later, I turned into one of the “lazy bitch oughta get a job!” people.
And I’m offended by the OP’s use of the word “skinny.” It is only because Tarantula claims to also be slender that I don’t flame him for it, like the pass Polish people get for telling Polack jokes.
I always give to buskers, too.
if I stop and listen, that is.
When i’m being entertained, I don’t mind paying for it.
I do too - partly, I suppose, because I used to be one.
Well, I don’t consider buskers beggars. They just have a different job. Which I suppose begging is, too.
Excepting **Hamish, **apparently, who actually did have to beg when he was fleeing his brutally abusive parents. He was crammed in with his sister and a few other refugees in Vancouver, where there was never anywhere near enough food, and had to beg on the street to make his rent while looking for work.
He clawed his way up and made it to Montreal and completing his education, but the experience left him a permanent social democrat.
I disagree that harshness towards beggars is a natural consequence of having been poor, and I think it’s insulting and patronizing to say so. Most of the social activists I work with are themselves poor. Don’t overgeneralize your experience.
Busking is one thing; begging is another. In the US, beggars are often the mentally ill, who were dumped out of state hospitals. Some of these people are seriously ill, and also seriously unapproachable. When I lived in California, there was one man in particular who I felt so sorry for, but he was like a scared wild creature, you couldn’t even get near him. I watched him progressively get more and more unkempt and matted and clearly physically falling apart, and yet there was nothing that could be done by folks like me.
Papa Tiger knew a guy in DC 25 years ago who begged there six months of the year, and spent the other six months (the winter months, needless to say) in Florida. Apparently it was a very profitable business for him.
All that being said, if a beggar is actually looking for food, I have no problem donating money for food. One time a guy who didn’t smell of alcohol, just looked down on his luck, came up to us and asked for money to eat. We gave him a dollar. A few minutes later, as we went into a nearby inexpensive restaurant (where a huge meal could be obtained for about $6), we saw him standing there scanning the menu and counting what little money he had. We gave him another $5, and when we left he was still eating hungrily. I have no problems with giving a helping hand to someone who can use it and appreciates it.
Are there really that many beggars in Ireland now?
Oh, deinstitutionalization began long before the Reagan era. It was already being referred to as a crisis situation by the late 1970s.
Reagan being Reagan though, I’m sure his policies didn’t help.
Well, obviously they do have a steady income. alot of them work as builders, pavers etc, trades that you can take on the move with you. It is a problem when it comes to paying tax, but you only have to look at the news to discover that tax dodging isn’t restricted to the Travellers.
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Everytime i pass by one of their settlements, usually along the motorway (which, I agree, is no place for anyone to live, but experience has shown us they also do not necessarily leave their camping spots in pristine conditions), I note that the majority of them drive or inhabit mentioned cars/caravans.
I’ve also been told they don’t pay any tax. At all. I don’t know whether this is true or not? Could someone clear that up for me?
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The problem with the camping spots is that there isn’t enough of the facilities available, as every NIMBY makes sure their council won’t allow them, and the ones that do exist aren’t nearly adequate enough to deal with the people who stay there. there is one facility on the outskirts of swords that is kept immaculate, has no trouble with the locals or the police, but they will all be evicted in the next few months because the owner died and his wife hasn’t the ability to manage the site anymore, and the council won’t buy the site from her. Instead, the tenants will me evicted and new houses built on the property.
Few of the existing sites provide skips, and businesses aren’t allowed to provide skips to illegal settlements.
Its a question of who should make the first step. If you were a member of the Travelling community who’s been shit on by local and national government, the media and the public for as long as you can remember, what would you do?
Yeah I’d agree with that. I think when most people say ‘knacker’ now they mean scumbag or lowlife moreso than traveller.
True. I wouldn’t swap places in a million years if I could avoid it. I remember once this guy (looked about 16) asked me for a cigarette (no money - just a cigarette Tarantula). I stopped and gave one to him and while I was fumbling for my lighter to lend to him he told me how his dad won’t let him come home and threw him out and beat him up. He showed me horrible cigarette burns on his hands and arms and said his ‘da’ did that and I believed him because he was practically crying.
I know that some beggars are losers and agressive and think the world owes them a living when they’ve totally opted out but I believe these agressive people (and yes I would call them ‘fuckers’) are in the minority.