Well, she’s rested her case.
You do realize that there is a tradition in the pit of posting recipes to derail a thread and that said posting of recipes has never been sanctioned?
You do realize that I’ve been mentioned in that troll thread and I have every right to respond to said mentions?
You do realize that the topic being discussed was a person being attacked in that thread?
My posts are far more on topic than a recipe for banana bread.
I don’t think you know what a hijack is.
Everything on a message board is a “language issue” – it’s the only way we can communicate. I can’t reach through here and kick someone or give them the finger or fart in their general direction. So, this “language issue” thing is utter nonsense. You’re essentially saying that the board can’t be moderated at all – call someone a racist epithet in MPSIMS? Just a language issue. Repeatedly post white supremacist topics and posts? Just a language issue.
Everybody agrees that there are many differences between trans and cis people. Discussing any of those differences does not require anybody to deliberately misgender any trans people.
Which is what we have kept telling you, and YWTF, and everybody else who attempts to misgender trans people under the guise of “discussion”. Over and over and over and over again.
This is a valid starting point. However, the necessary consideration is “what impact does this debate have on others?” If the answer is it makes some people uncomfortable because it goes against their beliefs, then debate away, and those bothered need to suck it up.
But trans debates (and race/gender/etc.) don’t fit that. There is real damage to people when the “debate” is about their validity and importance as humans. It might be very interesting for some people to have such debates, but it comes at the expense of others, and in my opinion (and the opinion of the decision makers here), that cost outweighs any benefit of letting racists and transphobes have their debates.
You seem to get that with the second half of your post, so why you keep whining about it is beyond me.
I know when you make the thread about you and not the subject matter it is a hijack. But as I said, I’ll leave it to Miller at this point.
Not at all. It’s the forced usage of man and woman in a relatively novel and definitely not universally accepted way is what I mean by language issue. I doubt most people consider trans and cis identical and expecting the modified noun to be all inclusive without qualification is not going to be something that everyone will be comfortable with.
And you’d be wrong. I don’t even think you are comprehending what you are reading. The topic wasn’t me! The topic was the language YWTF was using and whether or not that is transphobic, hateful, or trollery.
Well, if people refuse to follow the rules placing restrictions on how they can speak, then they shouldn’t whine that they’re not able to participate in debate.
We could have thoughtful debates and discussions until the cows come home with YWTF about how and to what extent transgender and cisgender women should be able to share gender-segregated spaces, if she could just bring herself to stop referring to transgender women on these boards as “men”. But she won’t do that, so she’s topic-banned from those debates and discussions.
I know what you mean by language issue. The rule on this board is that misgendering trans people is not allowed. Calling someone a racist epithet is not allowed. Both are language issues, both are clear in the rules.
Every community has its own rules. The rules are clear for this instance. YWTF pretends not to understand it because she’s a transphobic bigot. Are you also a transphobic bigot? Do you not understand the clear rules in this case?
I understand the rules and use the modifier trans to be clear on this board. It’s not hard to do. However, I find it is counterproductive to force language issues. Censorship and authoritarianism doesn’t convince anyone of anything.
It’s OK! Ed forgot that rule too . . . not that that actually matters as to whether it’s still a rule or not.
When same-sex marriage began to be first normalized and then legalized, a lot of people were uncomfortable with using the word “marriage” as an “all inclusive without qualification” noun to refer to both opposite-sex and same-sex marriage. A lot of people still are, as a matter of fact.
But that doesn’t mean that board rules allow you to discuss marriage in general while deliberately refusing to refer to married same-sex couples as “married”.
So, what’s your problem with how YWTF has been treated? She can talk about trans issues all day long, as long as she doesn’t misgender transwomen. She won’t even take that small step in a thread where she was allowed to bring it up again. She can’t stop herself from misgendering people even while ecg is giving her a minor hall pass to discuss the issue.
You white knight the worst posters on this board. You never add value elsewhere – don’t you watch movies? Read books? Listen to music? Watch sports? You spend almost all of your time in ATMB and the Pit, with occasional forays into P&E and GD to sneer about hive minds. Even if you hate how I post here in the Pit or whatever, I also ask questions in FQ, contribute to movie and song threads, contribute to sports threads.
I cannot imagine being here as much as you are just to whine. It’s baffling to me.
and?
You honestly think forcing people to think and speak a particular way is convincing?
I believe in free debate and not the infantilizing culture that has been allowed to pervade this board. I think that difficult issues freely discussed leads to intellectual growth and societal change. I think the illiberal trend towards silencing dissent is harmful.
Sure, I like books and other media. Hell, I’m playing a game as I type this but my thoughts on a Chillwind Yeti in Hearthstone don’t seem that valuable.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. If they want to post here, they have to generally post in English and follow certain rules, and avoid a handful of topics that are either offensive or done to death.
Since when is bigotry “dissent”?
If we don’t “force language issues” to some extent, we’ll have the boards overrun by overt bigots spewing the n-word and other objectionable epithets everywhere. I think it is extremely productive for the board authorities to impose censorship restrictions on permitted speech so that that doesn’t happen.
Similarly, I don’t see anything “counterproductive” in making rules against deliberate misgendering that will exclude participation by people who are unable to talk about transgender issues without misgendering transgender people.
In both cases, catering to the preferences of bigots is not worth the damage done to both the direct targets of the bigotry and the overall quality of the debate.
I’m searching for all of the threads you’ve started about Republicans using the power of the state to pull books out of schools and libraries and all the threatening language against teachers and librarians. I’ve come up empty so far, but I’m sure you can post a few links. I mean, librarians getting death threats is certainly a bigger issue than whether someone can call a transwoman a man, and yet, so far, I’ve seen no threads from you on the widespread use of the state by Republicans to silence dissent, ban books, change curriculum to hide the history of racism in the US, and so on.