I don’t know that. It was certainly an element of the “Biden is a doddering senile old man on death’s door” narrative the right have been pushing for over a year now, but since that’s pretty much bullshit I see no reason to assume the “just a runway for President Kamala” has much validity. Although I’m sure Biden and the Democrats would be fine with Harris succeeding him in due course.
Ten years maximum, I’m afraid, as per the 22nd Amendment.
So he said the thing you said a “leader with any integrity” would say, and now you’re saying it doesn’t count, because reasons. Got it.
Trump fucked up this badly on a regular basis and most of us didn’t demand his resignation over it.
So, your request that “A leader with any integrity would say “this may or may not be my fault, but it happened on my watch, and I’m responsible.”” wasn’t really met by Biden, almost exactly, saying ‘this may or may not be my fault, but it happened on my watch, and I’m responsible.’?
Oh. Taking notice of that text now, it would appear to be 7 years and change (finish Biden’s term, plus one of her own). Still, doesn’t change the point that Biden should resign and Harris is a perfectly acceptable VP with plenty of years left in her.
Goody gumdrops, he spoke some magic words. The second part of my request (which you keep ignoring) is to see him back it up with action, which is firing some military leadership and then resigning himself. Here’s the full request again for you:
Again, if you didn’t read below the fold, I stated “Biden should resign as soon as he signs all the major legislation in the pipeline.” Are you going to crop that out again?
Yes, he said the magic words you said a “leader with any integrity” would say. And now, having been called out on it, you’re busy hauling the goalposts off toward the horizon.
Did Biden handle the withdrawal badly? Absolutely. Is it a resignation-worthy offense? Not remotely. As I already mentioned, Trump had fuckups like this on a ridiculously regular basis, and previous Presidents have had similar disasters on their watch. On the scale of “things Presidents should resign for”, this barely moves the needle. Have you made the same demand of every other president?
You are of course perfectly entitled to continue to believe Biden should resign over this, and the rest of us are entitled to continue to weigh your beliefs against your words and actions in a wider context.
I don’t understand this joke. Do you mean that leaders shouldn’t resign when they make epic fuckups, or that Biden didn’t make an epic fuckup here, or that previous leaders’ misdeeds should excuse him from accountability, or just that you are unable to mount any more substantial objection here?
Uh, bullshit. Permit me to narrate my post, which people keep selectively quoting.
Part one (don’t give up after you read this, there’s still more to come!)
Grab a cup of coffee to keep your focus up for the second part:
Don’t give up yet, we’re almost there!
Is it “moving the goalposts” if you failed to read the three goals that I explicitly laid out and have re-quoted here? Whose fault is it that you missed it?
Oh god, this is the weakest most bothsides brain-wormed possible response that anyone could have made. We just got through eight years of Trumpers waving away all his bullshit by pointing back at Obama.
It’s honestly and unironically sad to see Dems (or whatever you label yourself) plopping directly into that groove as soon as Biden pulls a boner. I hoped we were better; we clearly aren’t.
You want Biden to fire the entire CENTCOM chain of command while we still have troops and other US citizens in Kabul that we’re struggling to evacuate? You want him to do that right now? And then resign immediately? President Harris and a brand new CENTCOM chain of command can then swoop in, quickly discern a better course of action in the middle of a crisis situation, and produce a better outcome?
I didn’t miss it. You seem to have missed the bit where he met the first condition and you immediately dismissed it as “magic words”. Wouldn’t even acknowledge it. Because reasons.
Mind you, the other two conditions - as already pointed out - would not be something a “leader of any integrity” would do; they’d be ludicrous overreactions that would make matters worse. But you’re just going to keep on insisting on them anyway, because it draws attention away from your reaction to the first point.
Remind me who said this first?
Consistency does not appear to be a strong point in your arguments.
It is entirely reasonable to ask you whether you - you personally, not “both sides” - have made similar demands of other presidents in order for us to judge whether you’re arguing from principle or just because you’re seizing on any feeble excuse to call for Biden to resign because you just want him to. Right now, all evidence points to the latter.
Having said that a leader with any integrity would take responsibility, you were then shown that Biden has said almost exactly that. Do you now admit that Biden has integrity?
I would also point out that Biden’s speech was yesterday. It doesn’t make your goals look very open-minded that you asked him to step up and take responsibility after he had already done so. Instead, it looks as though you were expecting the worst from him, and pre-judging him for it.
I acknowledge that he said this. I dispute that speaking these magic words should absolve him from consequences, which you are arguing because - let’s be frank - you don’t want anyone in the Biden administration to be accountable for this. At all.
Okay. Just to help narrow down what I’m supposed to be responding to, which President oversaw a chaotic military withdrawal so abrupt that it was doubtful whether we were going to evacuate everyone who deserves to be evacuated, and hedge on the possibility of even getting them visas?
Is that the subject where you want me to account for my history, or do you want to expand the goalpost somewhere else, or are you just looking for something to gauge my party fealty?
Yes, dear Christ, I fall on my knees and confess that Biden has met the bare lowest bar of integrity to give lip service to his own responsibility in the matter.
Now, answer me a question: do you believe that politicians should be allowed to deflect consequences by admitting the very obvious fact of their Constitutionally defined role of occupying the top level of responsibility?
Do you think we have enough information to determine an accurate punishment for Joe Biden and/or the CENTCOM CoC, what, 2 or 3 days after the Taliban entered Kabul? While the crisis is still ongoing? We don’t even know what the hell happened but you think it’s time to mete out consequences?
You yourself said he should resign after he signs all of his major legislation. There’s still plenty of time to do that, right? There’s still plenty of time to fire the CENTCOM leadership, right? For all you know, Joe Biden will come out of this, having shredded the military brass and resigned in disgrace, smelling like absolute roses in your book.
Let’s let the dust settle first, and in the meanwhile we can appreciate a president who actually had the balls to take personal responsibility instead of blaming everyone around him.
I don’t believe Biden independently made such a bad decision. I believe he was fed some bad information by career officers in CENTCOM, at the general grade. That whole command structure (I’ll say general and higher) needs to be turned over on principle. Biden should oversee that, and then resign himself.