God gave Palestine to the Jews. See Genesis 15:18; Deut. 11:24; and other Bible verses.
II Samuel 5 tells how David captured Jerusalem. He then made it the capital city of Israel. Even though the Jews have not always had physical possession of the city since then, they still retained title to it. Morally, spiritually, and legally, Jerusalem has been their capital for 3,000 years.
Are you fucking serious?
To be fair, he is replying to a post which asked “why it is so important to certain Christians that the embassy to one particular secular government be located in the city of a particular religious shrine.” Flyer is explaining it according to the religious doctrine.
Whether religious doctrine should have any bearing on politics and geography is another question entirely.
If someone were to give Donald Trump an idea, it would die of loneliness.
You can if you are now changing that status quo. A status quo all sides are okay with is effectively a tentative peace. By changing that status quo so that one side is not okay with it, you have just created new arguments. You’ve set back the tentative peace that was in place.
The keen-eyed observer will note that Flyer “cleverly” slid “legally,” “morally,” and “title” into his list of justifications for his religious doctrine.
God gave Palestine to the Israelites. He gave Judah to the Jews. And, if He is unhappy with the current situation, He is, as he did before, capable of intervening and handling the situation Himself.
In actuality, He made promises to all of Abraham’s descendants.
I’d certainly like to see the “title” concept explained. I didn’t know they had title companies in Biblical times.
Well, I’d like to hear more about that and this 3,000 year-old law, apparently recognized in International courts, defining Jerusalem as the capital of the modern, secular Israeli state. Sorry, my Bible study classes were a long time ago and I clearly missed this fascinating bit of information.
Has there ever really been any question of whose side the US is on? The US has been a friend and ally of Israel for decades. The US has never been a friend or ally of the Palestinians, and again, being honest, they’ve never been friends or allies to us, have they?
But, so what?
We’re not special friends with Egypt, either, and we still managed to help broker a deal that has held successfully for decades.
The Palestinians could get a similar deal (Settle on a border; Work together; We give you all gobs of money) with us any time they want. They could have had that deal anytime the last fifty years.
Hell. They can still get it. You think the Bloody Stupid Great Negotiator would pass up a chance at a Nobel Peace Medal? He’d have a Big, Beautiful Party in the Rose Garden and go down in history as the Man Who Solved World Peace.
US is best friends with countries who have been at open war with us. We would be -delighted- to be friends with Palestine and (still being honest ) capitalize on the opportunities for investment in Palestine. But we can’t want this more than the Israelis and Palestinians want this for themselves.
Palestinians need to face reality, “reality” being - it doesn’t matter where the US puts its embassy (Hell, we can always move it again if we need to. If Palestine gets their part of Jerusalem, we’re going to need two embassies there anyway, right?).
What matters is that every single day that passes with Israel in complete control of Jerusalem makes it less likely that the Palestinians will get even a side street to call their own. If the Palestinians want Jerusalem or anything else, they need to stop with the self-defeating foot dragging otherwise they’re going to look up in a 100 years and the facts on the ground will have past them by.
This move isn’t upsetting the status quo. It’s acknowledging a status quo that has been in place for years. Jerusalem is the capital of Israel. If the Palestinians want to change that, they need to haul up their socks and make some effort at negotiating an agreement. Burning flags is a giant waste of their time - and time is what’s on track to defeat them.
You seem not to be familiar with this poster. Yes, he’s completely serious.
Damn, I noticed past for passed too late to save myself.
The main thing this proved is that our President is actually the WORST negotiator ever. The dipshit gave away one of his most coveted bargaining chips for absolutely nothing. Nada. Zip.
No, we have no idea who’s building trump tower there, do we?
Trump supporters always seem to have faith that he has some grand vision, a master plan that everyone else is just too short-sighted to see.
He’s poking North Korea, Iran, and now Palestine with a stick, while snubbing all of our long-held allies and getting in bed with dictators Erodgan, Duterte, and Putin (that last having the added bonus of reviving the Cold War in the over-the-top McCarthyist response from the Democrats). And providing insane amounts of arms to Saudi Arabia, to use on its neighbors in their jihad to spread Wahhabi Islam.
Taken singly all these actions make no sense… put it all together and it becomes clear, he does have a plan!
…he’s TRYING to set off World War III.
I voted for Trump & I hope Iran gets nuclear capability and does away with Israel once and for all.
The abrahamic religions are cancer. Yes, especially Christianity.
Fuckin’ trilogies, man. Everyone wants to get in on them these days.
Heh. What if we have that backwards?
Figure the previous situation was, well, just about useless: offer the Palestinians stuff, it’s no good; there’s never any progress. Figure they already saw us as being on Israel’s side instead of being an impartial broker – and figure we already had no chips of value, or else we’d have already been moving things forward with 'em.
So what happens if, instead of offering them a ‘carrot’ to move forward, we go ‘stick’? What happens if we simply announce that we’re doing something they’d hate, such that maybe they’d say “Please, What Can We Offer You To Stop Doing That?”
What if, instead of losing a bargaining chip, we’re creating one?
States and even non-state actors who want to be states have real interests. Symbolic shit does not change their real stance in any way. The Palestinians still want what they want and they’ll take it whether Israel puts their capitol in Jerusalem or on Mars. This makes no difference except to rile up the publics of various places.
As for the law, past Presidents should have obeyed it. They had legitimate reasons not to, as rightly they believed that foreign policy is the President’s purview. But that gave credence to the idea that this was about foreign policy. It’s not. Trade agreements are real foreign policy. This was bullshit. Doesn’t make a difference to any parties that really matter in this whole dispute. Plus past Presidents promised to move the embassy to Jerusalem as candidates. While Trump himself is a liar extraordinaire, it would be nice if we started holding Presidents accountable for saying things we know are lies as candidates. Starting with “I will move the embassy to Jerusalem.”
I thought of asking about Palestinian reactions to the Trumpist Day of Rage, but then I realized that this question could not be answered without a Trumpist Day of Some Other Kind for comparison.