TV shopping is making me feel stupid

I just want a TV, something that’s going to last a while, will be hook uppable with whatever I wind up hooking up to it, just a big glowing box to watch the pretty moving people on. I figure it’s time to blow out some cash on a big’n but how in the world am I supposed to understand the quality differences between model X for $1800 and model Y for $4500?!

I feel like loitering around a college campus and propositioning young geeks to have “VGA, DVI In, RS-232, NTSC RF antenna, Composite Video, Component Video (2), S-Video, audio-in (6), audio-out, subwoofer, RCA jacks for audio, video, Y/Cb/Cr and Y/Pb/Pr, 6 pin DIN S-Terminal for S Video,9 pin D-SUB for RS232 and 3:2 pull-down for film scan conversion” explained very slowly. There are pins?

Split screen, picture in picture and picture on picture, are these all different ways of saying the same thing? When did it get this complicated?

I’m watching a tiny dying 1989 relic of a tv with horrific sound because I’m too afraid of walking into any of the big box stores and getting bent right over. :smack:

Why don’t we eliminate the geek speak and start out with simple questions?

How many $ are you prepared to spend for a big glowing box?

How big do you want it to be?

What are you going to plug into it? Cable? DVD? PC?

The pins are part of the voodoo process. :smiley:

Expanding on Tapioca’s questions -

There’s another half to the TV experience - sound. Do you plan on using the speakers and sound system built into a TV, or do you have a separate stereo/surround system with its own amplifier and speakers?

If you have a separate sound system, you can pretty safely ignore that portion of the TV’s features.

Also, related to how big do you want it - how thin do you want it? Do you want something thin that can hang on the wall (ie: plasma or LCD) or do you have abundant space to fit a traditional CRT-based set into?

But the two primary questions are going to be how big a picture and how big a hole in your wallet?

Phew. I read the thread title and thought those evil folks at QVC were using big words again… :wink:

If they sold TVs on TV, would that be easier or even worse, hmm. :stuck_out_tongue:

From the browsing around I’ve been doing I’m figuring maybe $1500 or so. I remodeled my house and knocked out a wall to create a living room twice the size it used to be, I’d like a big screen that’s enjoyable from any seat, for Superbowl parties and such.

I’m really tempted to look at the 42" plasma ones just because they’re so cool, being 42 inches and all, but I recognize that’s a pretty silly reason to fork over an obscene amount of cash. The spot the new one is going to go is just over five feet wide, which gives me room for the nice new cabinet or stand to put the new set in or on.

I’ll be hooking up cable and a DVD player, and my son will undoubtedly be plugging in his PS2 if I let him, but nothing complex like a PC or stringing surround sound everywhere. The ones that hang on the wall look super cool in the commercials, but how does that work in real life? There aren’t any satellite or cable wires, no VCR or DVD players shown, they don’t even show a power cord snaking down from behind them. How the heck could you have a flat one just hanging there without trailing a buncha wires?

At that price, I recommend the rear projection sets. The new ones are really shallow (like less than ten inches deep). They can’t hang on the wall, but you can get a bigger one for the money than you can get an LCD or plasma TV.

I think I’ll second everyone else’s recommendation to define what you need and find a TV that fits that and your budget, rather than trying to understand everything and still not be sure it fits your needs. That said, I’ll go ahead and try to define some of the things in your OP.

VGA - this stands for Video Graphics Array. It’s been the standard analog (as opposed to digital) output for computers for nearly 20 years. Probably won’t need it for general TV watching. You may be able to hook up your computer, but I’m not sure the results would be satisfactory.

DVI In - This looks to be the successor to VGA as displays became more than CRT based (LCD, etc), although the way the standard was written, it allows for more than just computer connections. Most video gear doesn’t use this either.

RS-232 - This one has me stumped. Not because I don’t know what it is, but I can’t for the life of me figure why a TV would need a relativly slow serial connection.

NTSC RF antenna - For receiving broadcasts from you favorite local TV station. These were the “rabbit ears” of old, but I think everything is internal now. May not be a big deal if you use cable or satellite, but all TV’s include this anyway, so I guess they may as well use a marketing bullet.

Composite Video - This is just a video connector type. All the information for putting images on the TV travel through 1 cable (it’s usually the yellow one that tends to be included with your TV).

Component Video - Also a video connector type, except the information is split across three cables one for (I’m simplifing here) brightness, one for the red color information, and one for the blue color information(usually).

S-Video - Is yet another video connector type. It’s similar to component, except there’s one wire for brightness, and one for color information.

Generally speaking, the quality of the video tends to go from least -> best as Composite -> S- Video -> Component. You’ll usually find component connections on DVD players (some times even on the $40 Wal-Mart specials).

This part of your OP:

is just describing the type of connector for each of the things I’ve described above. They’re all pretty standard. Y/Cb/Cr and Y/Pb/Pr is another way to describe component video.

3:2 pulldown for film scan conversion. Ok, if I haven’t lost you by now, it’s probably a good time for some tea and aspirin. This refers to a process of converting a standard film (shot at 24 frames per second) to a TV image (which runs at 30 frames per second). Without getting into specifics, I believe the DVD standard allows for 24 frame per second rates and allows external devices to perform just this process. Almost nobody does it, because DVD’s tend to be hooked to TV’s as it is and the DVD manufacturer already does this process for you (on machines more expensive than your TV). In practice I suspect you’ll never encounter a use for this.

Split screen, picture in picture, and picture on picture all probably amount to the same thing, although there probably are subtle differences.

For hooking a PS/2 and a DVD player you’re probably fine with the above connectors. All you probably need is a composite (or S-video maybe) connection for the PS/2 (I don’t think they do component do they?), and component support if your DVD player has it (or you plan on getting one).

Take care

GES

P.S. Understand there have been TV geeks for far longer than computer geeks. I’m sure everything I’ve said above has a quibble (or an out right war). I don’t profess to know everything about TV’s, I’ve just encountered most everything you’ve asked about through the course of my work, although what I do doesn’t directly releate. Someone may be along with more knowledge than me (and spell better too). Oh, and since you didn’t ask about HDTV, the digital TV switch over, HDMI, or DRM, I won’t go into them save for the fact that they’ll probably make everthing above obsolete :slight_smile: (or not depending on who you ask)

We’ve got progress :smiley:

$1500 is probably not enough to get you a plasma screen, but a 42" DLP such as Dewey Finn suggested should be do-able. Regardless of brand, they should come with all the connectors with crazy initials that you can think of. It’s probably worth hunting out a store that will both deliver and install your new set if you can find one.

Thanks everyone, it’s slightly less bewildering now.

I went and looked at some in person and let the sales dude babble on for awhile and I’m just not tech-appreciative enough to get it. This one looks and sounds good, has all the features I’d want and costs one-third the cost of that one that also looks and sounds good? Poor sales dude starts singing his alphanumeric song of why the more expensive one is the better choice of course but it’s all just pretty noise.

I’m alright with that. Since I’m going to be the one using it, I doubt that a year from now I’ll be going “If only I’d gotten that one!”

I think right now the best bang for your buck (if you’ve got $1999) is a Hi-Def ready 42" LCD projection or Hi-Def ready 42" DLP.
If you go to a store and tell them that’s what you want and can get a price for $2K or under then you’ll be set.

Hi-Def ready so you’ll be set if you ever decide to switch over to hi-def. They may try to sell you a hi-def set with a built in hi-def receiver/tuner. These sets cost more and you won’t really need it since if you decide to go hi-def your satellite or cable box will have the receiver/tuner built in.

Avoid sets that look like a good deal that say Extended-Definition. They are cheaper but are not true hi-def sets.

A good hi-def wall hanging plasma or or lcd may be out of your price range.

Dont worry too much about all the inputs/outputs. Unless your an A/V geek it will have enough connects for dvd/cable/ps2 so don’t sweat over it.

Shop the weekly ads.
Stick to brands you’ve heard of. Toshiba,Sony,Panasonic,Hitachi,Mitsubishi,Samsung.
Avoid brands you’ve never heard of.
Broksonic,Shinsonic,Electroart.
If they don’t list the brand in the ad, it’s not a good sign.

I’d also add DVI and HDMI to the end of that list. Those offer fully digital HDTV signals without the 3 wires of Component. S-Video and Composite cannot send an HDTV signal, only regular resolution. HDMI has the benefit of carrying your audio signal too, and the wire/connector is much slimmer than all the others, hardly any bigger than a typical USB connector.

I actually got an “enhanced” definition Plasma, and it looks great. The only reason I got that instead of true HD is that an HD Plasma cost at least $1,000 - $1,500 more, and I didn’t have that kind of scratch to lay out, but really wanted the flat panel style. In a rear projection, I don’t think EDTV is nearly as good a buy since they are under $2k to begin with.

Wait…I’m down with the Hi-Def, that’s one of the things I was confuzzled about was the difference between Hi-Def with and without built in recievers and Ext-Def, but what’s LCD vs DLP mean? LCD is like what’s in watches and DLP means rear-projection, neither of which is a traditional picture tube?

Both of the types of television sets referred to by Hampshire (LCD and DLP) are rear projection sets, so they will have more depth than direct-view LCD or plasma TVs (which are the type that can hang on the wall), but rear projection sets are cheaper. And yes, neither is a traditional picture tube. I think the largest conventional CRT set you can get is 40 inches, but it’s considerably heavier and deeper. My parents have a 36" direct view Sony Wega TV and it weighs about 300lb. The rear projection TVs are lighter and shallower and have a larger picture. In your price range, you may want to consider them over a conventional TV.

They are two different technologies and the differnce between the two is techy stuff that will bore you. The sets however are about the same size and picture qualities are similar (however each side will argue why theirs is better).
They are a bit deeper but still very light (less than 50 lbs). You can’t really hang them on the wall but they do sit up on a stand.

If you want a really big set for less than $2K you’d have to get one of those floor standing big honkin projection set (which are available in Hi-Def) but aren’t that bright and the picture fades fast if you move to the sides.

Here’s a couple examples:

42" Hi-Def Plasma $4K

40" Hi-Def LCD (thin) $3700

(the previous two are the thin wall hanging variety)

42" Hi-Def DLP rear projection $2K

42" Hi-Def LCD rear projection $2K

(the previous two sets are less than 50lbs. and set on stands)

51" Hi-Def CRT rear projection $1500

(nice price and bigger picture, but picture quality will suffer)

42" Enhanced(extended)-Def plasma $2500

(nice price for a plasma, but it’s not a true hi-def)

LCD vs. DLP in a nutshell:
LCD uses a masking material to block part of the light from the bulb from getting to the display. DLP uses what is basically an array of very small mirrors to only transmit certain pixels in the first place.

You probably don’t care too much about that, but the important bits are
LCDs are generally not as bright as DLPs, nor do they have as high contrast (the difference between the brights and the darks). Side by side, a DLP will have a more vivid image than an LCD.
DLPs, however, use a rotating color wheel to project RGB in rapid succession (rather than all at one time), which can cause a sort of rainbow effect if you move your eyes rapidly. Some people are more susceptible to the rainbowing, so if you’re considering a DLP model, try to get all the regular watchers to try it out. The best way to look for the rainbows is to watch fast-paced action with hard black/white edges in the images, and to try to focus on the action as it’s going. Sin City works quite well for this.

FWIW, I have a DLP projector, and, though I can see the rainbows if I look for them, I rarely see them during normal viewing, and I’m quite happy with the projector.

Huh, so that’s what causes that rainbowing stuff. Always wondered about that, thanks! :slight_smile:

The kids went back to school today so I cruised a couple of the local big box stores looking at what was on sale. Thanks to this thread, my girlfriends were very impressed when I rattled off my own list of abbreviations to the salesperson explaining what I was looking for. You guys rule! :smiley: