TV Tropes' "New Content Policy"

I’m pretty sure you can’t devalue TV Tropes any further can its core membership has. It’s pretty much a major Internet cesspit.

He has no reason he has to bow down to Google. There are other ad providers that don’t let trolls get entire sites shut down just complaining.

The idea that a wiki smaller than any longterm Wikia wikis somehow needs so much money that they can’t stay even on other ad providers and donations is hard for me to believe. I’m pretty sure Eddie uses the site as his source of income, seeing as he has so much time to work there.

If FastEddie can’t keep the business without destroying the main purpose of the site, then, yes, I’d prefer him to just it down. The content doesn’t belong to him, and will just pop up somewhere else. There are plenty people he has pissed off so thoroughly over the years or who have seen the writing on the wall and thus keep archives.

I might have more sympathy if FastEddie weren’t such a bad leader to begin with. He’s the only one who loses out if the site goes down. The rest of us will move on. In fact, it might be better for him, too, as I think the reason he’s such a bad leader is that he gets so depressed about what other people say about “his” site. I mean, he’s admitted repeatedly that he wants to shut the site down and not deal with it anymore, and I wish he would.

TVTropes has entered the popular lexicon. It’s unique site that isn’t going to go away. The people who actually care about the site won’t let it. FastEddie should take a stand and stop letting the trolls win again and again.

The OP specifically mentioned Lolita - in that case, if they kept the article up, they’d probably have to constantly monitor it or keep an edit lock like some Wikipedia pages do. It’s better to nuke it from orbit, like reddit did with all the underage subreddits.

Upthread, Death In Venice was mentioned. Looking at the article, there’s nothing in it that a keyword search would pick up. Someone would need to actually know the source material to know that article should be removed. Lolita is way more popular and the first thing someone would think of when they think of lolis, of course it’ll get noticed right off the bat.

Can you give me a specific example of lesbian subtext being removed?

I hopped over to the forums and took a quick look - the censorship is still in process with a group overseeing it. If you think something is non-porny, request it be added back. It’s easier to ditch things and add back as needed.

The edit lock is standard policy. The fact that they are going beyond that is what indicates that Eddie is just being an asshole.

You didn’t think the community actually agreed to anything that’s going on, did you? FastEddie popped in, told everyone what’s happening, and they had to do it. You can disagree with him a few times, but eventually he’ll just block you*. That’s part of what I mean about him being a horrible leader. He sees the wiki as his personal website that he can do with as he wills, rather than a collaboration by equals where he acts a gatekeeper.

Perhaps is Eddie didn’t do shit like this all the time, I wouldn’t be so upset. If it wasn’t for the fact that I don’t want to risk his ire during a difficult time, I’d be pushing all this stuff to him. I’m tempted to send him a link so he can see how much he’s ruined the site.

*He actually has a tool called a Google bounce that he uses when he gets really mad. it makes it where you can’t even read the site, as you’ll be redirected to Google. And people who have brought up how that doesn’t accomplish anything that just banning people from editing would do have gotten in trouble if they timed it when Eddie is upset.

It’s his site and he can run it however he wants. If you don’t like it, then take one of the archives someone made and start a new TVTropes. I don’t understand this viewpoint that someone made something you loved and then fucked it up - just don’t visit it any more, then. Save the pages you like and read them on your own. Wait for people to move to the next big thing. Just because you’d run it a certain way doesn’t mean he has to! I know a wiki that was turning into a cesspool, so other people took the wiki content and moved it to a new wiki where it continues to thrive and is considered an official fansite by the Word of God.

I actually should say you can disagree with him when he’s in a good mood. His bannings are almost always when he’s upset. If you can wait until he’s calm and say it calmly enough, you might be able to get it through. Problem is, he never listens, so those people wind up leaving out of frustration.

No. it isn’t his site. That’s the entire problem. The entire concept of wiki is the contributor owns the content. The fact that he sees it as his site is the reason the site sucks so bad.

I don’t know why people bring this up. The idea “This is mine so I can do whatever I want” is the way children think. It’s something you’re supposed to grow out of as an adult. Why do so many people think this is remotely convincing?

Adults have to think “How does what I do affect everyone else?”

And let’s not forget that this very site runs Google ads. It TVTropes is having to become more cleaned up than this site, it isn’t because of Google.

Either that, or all it takes is one complainer to put a video up on YouTube, and we get sweeping changes to our site.

Of course it’s his site. Whose site could it be?

That’s the literal direct opposite of right. The entire concept of a wiki is that the content is not owned by anyone. That’s the opposite of the general presumption in other environments, which is that the person who created the content owns it.

Which doesn’t change who owns the site.

Funny, I think “You have to do what I want with your site even if it means the site shutting down because it’s unsustainable without ad revenue because I like your site and therefore I am part owner” is a lot more childish than an adult making decisions about their own property.

Sure it is. Running a website is insanely cheap. Especially a bog standard wiki that serves up fewer images per page than the SDMB. It shouldn’t cost that much (relatively speaking) to run it.

And not for nothing, but TV Tropes is also big enough that they don’t need Google Ads. They could easily hook on with one of the bigger ad networks and not have to bow to Google’s ad rules (especially since Google seems to come down especially hard on them when complaints arise).

Yeah, we should be adults! Like people who watch anime and write fan fiction!

It’s not so much that the Google standards are puritanical; it’s that the consequences of a complaint about certain types of content are extreme. They issue a single warning; the next complaint results in a permanent ban, and the loss of any pending ad revenue. On a site with user-contributed content, all it takes is one troll with a grudge.

Yes. Fanfiction is universally dreck. That is, of course, why no one other than a few fanatics have ever heard of: Rosencrantz and Guilderstern Are Dead; Pride and Prejudice and Zombies; Sense and Sensibility and Sea Monsters; The Holmes-Dracula File; Wide Sargasso Sea; Wicked: The Life and Times of the Wicked Witch of the West; or The Wind Done Gone.

I won’t touch the anime portion of your post. I doubt I’d be able to be convincing to anyone who might share your prejudices.

Good job living up to your user name, though.

The entire “Les Yay” page was removed. It annoyed me because they have no problem with “Distaff Counterpart” pages in general, but got rid of the one where the target audiences are completely separate.

Apparently they’ve also deleted the entire “Nightmare Fuel” category.

Which, if I recall correctly, is a term that ORIGINATED on TV Tropes.

I’m calling it - they’ve officially gone off the rails.

I dunno… I think a lot of this wouldn’t be happening if there weren’t so many contributors who never bothered to play by what few rules there were. Take Nightmare Fuel. That trope is a HUGE headache because of historical rampant misuse and overuse. This is why I have to wonder if taking the wiki elsewhere would make it better or worse. Depending on what the moderation is like, you could end up with huge amounts of conversation in-page, loose trope standards, and general creepiness. I’m honestly not sure what’s worse: puritanical, whimsical moderation, or abetting users who think nothing’s fun unless they get to do and say whatever they want without consequence. (I’m not saying either of these is true of the site now, and I know there’s an excluded middle there, but my point is that I’m not sure any effort to “restart” TV Tropes out of its founder’s influence would be any better than what’s there now, and in some ways could very well be a lot worse.)

That’s actually a line from Mike Nelson on Mystery Science Theater 3000–from ‘Santa Claus’, I believe.

Well then I suppose the question is really WHY is google so stupid as to have this policy, where any troll can get any website shut off from google ads? This doesn’t seem to mesh with google’s public relations efforts in other areas, perhaps all thast is needed here is for some media attention which will make google act more sensibly.

(Off topic somewhat but google has been one of the best tech companies to deal with, they fixed a mistake I made with checkout in minutes and emailed me to let me know it was fixed. They also had my back when someone did a chargeback four months after sending an email raving about how wonderful my job was.)

The forums are creepy. I see way, WAY too many people there justifying pedophilia. And the fanfics, urgh!

I’d vote worse. When Troper Tales got taken off-site, it pretty much became an instant ghost town.